Should I multiclass my wizard with rogue ?

#1ChaudronPosted 3/18/2009 6:23:12 PM
Let me explain, I'm lvl 18 wizard, in two levels, I'll have to choose a feat, but there is no feat there that interest me (Toughness ? +2 saving throws feats ? meh). If I take two rogue levels (two to get Evasion, I could just take one rogue level too at lvl20, but why not two for this nice feat ?), I'll skip having to choose a feat until lvl 21, where I'll be able to choose an epic feat.

In the end, at lvl 40, the 2rogue/38wizard will have 14 epic feats, whereas the pure lvl 40 wizard will have 13.

This means that the multiclassed wizard will have +1int than the pure wizard (additional Greater Intelligence), that means more spells per day.

And the rogue/wizard would have slightly better Saving Throws, but the Will one.

So knowing that, why would I make a pure wizard instead ? Is there subtle advantages in the stats ? In the spells DC ? Anything that would suggest a pure wizard is better ?


Thank you
#2RotschreckPosted 3/18/2009 7:13:29 PM
No, 14 epic feats does not necessarily mean +1 int over 13 epic feats.
How many times do you plan on taking Greater Intelligence? If you plan on taking it 13 times, then I'd like to suggest that you expand into different areas. The max is Greater Intelligence 10. Isn't it?

Spell Penetration (SP):
To overcome SR you need Wizard level + Spell Penetration (Greater/Epic) + d20
Lvl 40 Wiz: Max SR is 46 + d20
Lvl 38 Wiz: Max SR is 44 + d20

Difficulty Class (DC):
DC = Base (10) + Spell Level (1-9) + Natural Int Mod (max 15) + Magical Attribute Modifier (Max 6) + Epic Spell Focus (6)

Int Mod of 15 = Int 40 = Starting Int 18 + 10 Greater Intelligence + 10 Attribute increase + 2 RDD
Build: Wizard(29)/Bard(1)/RDD(10) [not saying you should be this. it's only for explanation purposes]

So to answer your questions:
DC has nothing to do with wizard levels.
# of spells per day does not increase after level 20. I may be mistaken, though I've never seen a table showing spells per day for epic wizards
SP is the only reason a person would want to be a pure epic wizard it seems at first glance from what I've collected. Hope this helps.
---
It's pronounced -rogue- not -rouge-. Yes, I disable traps. No, I do -not- leave a red mark on your husband's collar.
#3Chaudron(Topic Creator)Posted 3/18/2009 7:38:41 PM
You get more spells per day at 2 intelligence intervals (16, 18, 20, 22 ect)

I do not plan to get all Greater Intelligence, I'll take Improved Combat Casting, Epic Spell Penetration, Epic Spell Focus Necromancy, Epic Warding, Hellball, Ruin, Dragon Knight, and the rest in Greater Intelligence.

Which means I get 6 greater Intelligence with pure wizard, and 7 with rogue/wizard.

Considering that higher intelligence means more spell slots (you can test it yourself quickly with SetINT if you wish to verify), I thought there was no point playing pure wizard.
#4RotschreckPosted 3/18/2009 8:17:06 PM
Wait... on even intelligence, you get more spells..

Pure wizard you get +6.
Wizard/rogue you get +7.
So unless you started with an odd number... multiclassing for the extra Int is useless.

My point was that since I don't see tables of extra spells at epic levels, then there's really no reason to be a pure wizard unless you want to work on the spell penetration. It seems to be the only reason.
---
It's pronounced -rogue- not -rouge-. Yes, I disable traps. No, I do -not- leave a red mark on your husband's collar.
#5happyscrub1Posted 3/19/2009 2:44:00 AM
In the end, at lvl 40, the 2rogue/38wizard will have 14 epic feats, whereas the pure lvl 40 wizard will have 13.

how did you come up with his? the wiz/rogue should end up with 12 epic feats.


---
Question, how did world trade center building 7 (the -3rd- building to fall) collapse during 9/11?
#6happyscrub1Posted 3/19/2009 5:04:11 AM
wait... or are you trying to consider envasion and sneak attack an epic feat? That's the only way I can see how you got 1 more "epic" feat than pure wizard.


---
Question, how did world trade center building 7 (the -3rd- building to fall) collapse during 9/11?
#7RotschreckPosted 3/19/2009 9:27:45 AM
He gets a few feat for every 3rd character level.
He gets a few epic wizard feat every 3rd level after level 20.
For a pure wizard that means:

21 Character Feat (Feat #1)
22
23 Epic Wizard Feat (Feat #2)
24 Character Feat (Feat #3)
25
26 Epic Wizard Feat (Feat #4)
27 Character Feat (Feat #5)
28
29 Epic Wizard Feat (Feat #6)
30 Character Feat (Feat #7)
31
32 Epic Wizard Feat (Feat #8)
33 Character Feat (Feat #9)
34
35 Epic Wizard Feat (Feat #10)
36 Character Feat (Feat #11)
37
38 Epic Wizard Feat (Feat #12)
39 Character Feat (Feat #13)
40

With pushing back the Wizard feats by one level with a rogue level, they get Epic Wizard feats every time they get a Character feat, so it becomes 7 feats x 2 for a total of 14. :)
---
It's pronounced -rogue- not -rouge-. Yes, I disable traps. No, I do -not- leave a red mark on your husband's collar.
#8happyscrub1Posted 3/19/2009 10:31:59 AM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
#9happyscrub1Posted 3/19/2009 10:39:09 AM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
#10dark lancerPosted 3/19/2009 1:06:18 PM
Why would you want to multiclass with those two classes? Rogues get Use Magic Device which allows them to be excellent spell filchers, and wizards get plenty of spells which are similar in function to rogue skills.

Clairaudience/Clairvoyance: Spot and Listen
Knock: open doors
Find Traps: break traps
Invisibility: Hide and Move Silently
Panther familiar: Sneak Attack
Displacement: harder to be hit
---
"It's like newspeak, except less expressive." --Bored_Hunt on swearing.
[Papal Crusaders]