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Was the final boss truly a "Giant Space Flea from Nowhere"? (spoilers obviously)

#41Bronze_StuffPosted 9/18/2013 5:25:37 PM
Flare_Dragon123 posted...
Actually, I'm going to fall on the side of the crystal isn't destroyed yet. I've been saying destroyed in my long posts, but my last one changed to damaged.

Because here's what doesn't make sense, if the crystal was destroyed, then why would Necron make pains to never imply that its gone. This argument is weak and not my main point. The reason its weak is two fold, 1: this was a poorly forced and written scene that marks a bad spot of writing, its not specifically important. 2: this is a translation, what words fit best in english don't necessarily carry the weight or the import of the words in the japanese language the game was written in. It's highly possible, if someone where to interpret the original japanese text, that we would get an entirely seperate interpretation.

My argument for the crystal still existing is that, if it didn't, it makes no sense for it to magically appear afterwards, just because Necron is gone. Hell, it could even be possible that the crystal is still damaged to some extent, it was just saved from total destruction because of the battle with Necron.


Sure it does. Before they even talk about the crystal, they talk about how everything is linked in memory. Kuja makes the chaos/fiends come back to life from the crystal's memory. It's not unreasonable for people's memories to bring the crystal back at that point. Everything in Memoria is weird as is.
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#42Bronze_StuffPosted 9/18/2013 5:33:13 PM
But if Zidane and co. could repair the shattered crystal so easily that it took no time and was trivial enough for no one to ever mention it afterwards, not even in passing, it makes it incredibly illogical that Terra would go through such incredible amounts of trouble to keep their own crystal functional. They could just do the same thing and send a ragtag band of 8 people to the centre of the planet to magically fix it instead.

It wasn't easily repaired. It required them to demonstrate just how much they were willing to fight for life. IE, fighting Necron.

It's obvious that the crystal was never repaired by the party because - even ignoring the fact that one would expect this to be an immensely difficult thing to do - it definitely would've been mentioned in some way if it did happen.

We can't say it was immensely difficult. And there's a lot of things not mentioned in that part. Like... It doesn't mention how the party is pretty much dead for instance. They don't even question where they are after they come back into "reality" or anything of the sort.

Now the crystal almost certainly still exists after the final battles. (One could have a silly argument along the lines of Zidanes 'the power of love' speech means that planet can exist without a crystal, but this isn't a Disney movie and the Ultimania goes to a lot of trouble to portray how important the crystals are that this possibility can be disregarded).
Since the crystal still exists, that means it was either repaired or replaced somehow (no, it wasn't) or it wasn't destroyed in the first place.


Repaired makes sense. If everyone's memories and lives are connected to one another, and the crystal can clearly bring stuff back, I see no reason the opposite cannot be true.

All I'm saying is that if it's not from the crystal going away, Necron is really a horrible final boss then from every perspective.
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#43ZidaneTribal93Posted 9/19/2013 5:32:27 PM
Prove that Necron was the personification of death is this pic:

http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy/images/0/05/Hill_of_Despair_FFIX_Art_1.jpg

Hades, god of the underworld, was apparently planned as final boss but he was cut. It probably gave away to much information so they created Necron and replaced Hades with him.
#44JudgeFredPosted 9/22/2013 3:25:01 AM
You can argue it both ways, but I say he is, he's just too 'out of nothing' to be tied fully into the story with any level of satisfaction.
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#45MysterPixelPosted 9/22/2013 4:25:10 AM
ZidaneTribal93 posted...
Prove that Necron was the personification of death is this pic:

http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy/images/0/05/Hill_of_Despair_FFIX_Art_1.jpg

Hades, god of the underworld, was apparently planned as final boss but he was cut. It probably gave away to much information so they created Necron and replaced Hades with him.


Well.. unless the writing there says otherwise (I don't know), all it shows is that Hades was going to be fought in that battle scene. I'd say it was more likely that Hades was always an optional boss and Necron was always the final boss, however for whatever reason (maybe they ran out of time to make a scene for Necron) they gave Hades' background to Necron and that's why Hades is now just fought on a featureless black scene.
#46random_singerPosted 9/22/2013 5:00:19 AM
I'm gonna come down on the side of the argument which says giant space flea from nowhere.

Reasoning:

1. He is not mentioned anywhere throughout FF9 prior to battling him. Likewise, he is not seen anywhere throughout FF9 prior to battling him. Furthermore, he is not part of the ending sequence. Quotes that have been argued to foreshadow Necron actually make better sense if interpreted differently. ie When you fight SoulCage he says "I have seen death and it is not now"- seems to be a reference to Soulcage harvesting souls rather than a foreshadowing of Necron. Similarly, the quote "The Iifa Tree is not the tree itself" also seems to be a reference to the collection of souls rather than Necron.

2. He has little bearing on the plot. Yes, he (possibly) appeared as a result of Kuja destroying the crystal. Yes, he wants to destroy everything. But this is not sufficient to rule him out of Giant space flea status for me. Every boss has some degree of justification- even the alien boss on the TV tropes Space flea from nowhere page has the justification 'This is the final boss, controlling evil hunters' (previous bosses were all poachers apparently.) The question is then, was Necron sufficiently involved in the plot to warrant not having Giant Space flea status. I say nay, FF9 is a game that revolves around Zidane's relationships with Kuja, Garnet, and Vivi. Necron plotwise adds nothing to these relationships other than giving Kuja a chance to partially redeem himself.

Not that being a Giant space flea from nowhere is necessarily a bad thing. Gameplaywise I really enjoy the Necron fight; the game needed an escalation of tension there. And FF games have a rich tradition in space flea final battles: Cloud of Darkness, Zeromus and Neo-Exdeath are all good final bosses.
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#47CalmlanderPosted 9/22/2013 5:06:14 AM
I agree with some of the post here.

To me Necron is death. After the Crystal is destroyed Necron comes to destroy everything, but is stopped by the party, and the Crystal regenarates. The Crystal is a ''barrier'' that blocks the bringer of Death to enter in the dimension.

All the game is a struggle for life, and the Final Boss is the bringer of Death to the entire creation. Makes perfect sense to me.
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#48Flare_Dragon123Posted 9/24/2013 10:31:40 AM
random_singer posted...


1. he is not seen anywhere throughout FF9 prior to battling him.

2. Quotes that have been argued to foreshadow Necron actually make better sense if interpreted differently.

3. 'This is the final boss, controlling evil hunters' (previous bosses were all poachers apparently.)


1. Except the scene immediately before the fight. You know, the whole bad guy speech. (The only reason I say this is because this establishes Necron against something like Ragtimer Mouse, who truly only appears in a battle scenario).

2. There are no quotes or foreshadowing to Necron anywhere in the game. He is, no matter what we say about the crystal, completely out of nowhere.

3. This piece of evidence tips the argument for me. Before hand, I interpreted it as a completely out of nowhere boss with no plot relevancy whatsoever. Of course, Necron's monologue and completely causal nature (things had to occur in the plot for Necron to exist) may tip this away still.
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#49random_singerPosted 9/24/2013 2:56:10 PM
Flare_Dragon123 posted...


1. Except the scene immediately before the fight. You know, the whole bad guy speech. (The only reason I say this is because this establishes Necron against something like Ragtimer Mouse, who truly only appears in a battle scenario).
.


Of course. I just included it as part of the 'battle scene' in my reasoning as there is no break in between scenes. Regardless, just replace 'prior to battling him' with 'prior to talking with him and battling him' in my argument, and it still makes sense.

It is a question of degree here though, so thanks for making that clear.
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#50espritduoPosted 9/24/2013 8:18:04 PM
I'd just like to point out that in that concept art with Hades in the Hill of Despair, the text pointing to Hades says "Last Boss".

There's also other concept artwork for an alternate, more evil-looking version of the Grim Reaper that was supposed to be summoned during the final battle in place of the regular Grim Reaper seen during various Death-related spells.

http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy/images/2/21/Grim_Reaper_Final_Battle_FFIX_Art.jpg
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