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Calling All E2PG & Game Mechanics Experts!!!

#31monkeyslingerPosted 2/13/2014 8:38:59 PM
camdad04 posted...
monkeyslinger posted...
I have something else in mind for Hilgigars. :)


Very curious! :)


It wasn't anything game changing, haha. I wanted to master Stona so I could cast it on the Stropers instead of using Softs, but it turns out that doesn't work. Oh well.
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Read along as I pioneer a new stat path for the Final Fantasy IX Excalibur II Perfect Game!
http://ffixexiipgfinalequip.blogspot.com/
#32camdad04(Topic Creator)Posted 2/13/2014 11:24:20 PM
^ Hey, that's what innovation is all about... you have to throw ideas at the wall until one finally sticks! ;)

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As for editing the guide, I'm starting to have major reservations...

I don't know if I can handle having that much power, and I'm definitely bound get carried away!

For example, here are a few things I'd like to change, just off the top of my head:

1. Focus on mastering Flee instead of Protect Girls, then simply equip Butterfly Sword during the Iifa Tree visit! I don't know why this didn't occur to me before as highly advantageous. Think of all the wasted seconds pulling up the menu to equip the Dagger on Zidane just so you can get through an area... all those menu screens really add up after awhile!

2. This is based off #1: wait until mid-disc 2 to synthesize the Butterfly Sword, so you'll have access to the Dagger or Mage Masher until you've mastered Flee, which will happen after Ralvuimago if you play your cards right! ;)

3. The Plant Brain battle is very survivable for Zidane if he's wearing the Silk Shirt. This is also nice because he can attack in place of Vivi using the Fire spell with its lengthy animation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTzvNdqtcn4

This also provides 5 AP toward learning Flee (6 if you count the Plant Spiders afterward.)

4. For Path B, Zidane and Dagger can level up using the Hecteyes strategy currently listed for Path C. Both of them have enough wiggle room for two more level gains with the inferior equipment, and it will vastly improve their performance in Pandemonium.

5. High Tide: this was an integral part of the Trance strategy -- I don't know exactly why it was discarded. In reality, for Path A and B, not much Trance Prep is required after all, as it is ideal to be 3 or so hits away from Trance during the Shell Dragon battle. With High Tide equipped, this is almost half of the bar, as Zidane can go from zero to Trance in just 8 hits.

6. I noticed that the Forbidden Forest chocograph somehow sneaked its way into the guide for all paths as well... Rather than digging for that, which nets 18000 gil, it's better to simply get Green Plains for all paths. If you measure the time from the last gate looted to the arrival at BMV, the time it takes to gain the Ocean Transformation and swim straight to the Outer Continent is actually slightly faster than using the Blue Narciss. Therefore, only time spent is the time for the CH&C game, which is already suggested by the guide. Meanwhile, the Ocean ability (and the 3 Dead Pepper you dig up during the same game) gives you access to awesome things like:

* Dragon's Hair and Gauntlets

* The mountain crack north of Esto Gaza, which hides a Protect Ring and a Rosetta Ring (total selling price: 38000 gil!)

* My personal favorite, the Ultima Weapon! One of these days, I'll succeed in getting some of you on that band wagon! :P

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Seriously, I'm just getting started...

Yeah, me editing the guide myself isn't such a hot idea after all! :P
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I wish you good luck, little boy. You're going to need it.
#33Atomos199Posted 2/14/2014 1:53:13 AM
For Flee, it's another one of those things that add seconds but reduce reseting, since Protect Girls helps you get through the Iifa Tree with fewer resets (wasn't it originally your strategy? :P). At this point I prefer to prioritize resets over time savings given how much extra time is already available.

OK, well I don't think there's anything actually *wrong* with the current version, so let's just leave it alone after all, and resist the urge to fix things that aren't broken.
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I never gained supreme ulti-complete status. I projected my mind ca. 3 years into the future and realized it was going to be a waste of time.
~ bastardpoetry
#34camdad04(Topic Creator)Posted 2/14/2014 7:54:17 AM
Atomos199 posted...
For Flee, it's another one of those things that add seconds but reduce reseting, since Protect Girls helps you get through the Iifa Tree with fewer resets (wasn't it originally your strategy? :P). At this point I prefer to prioritize resets over time savings given how much extra time is already available.


The idea is that you need use of both Flee and Protect Girls during the Iifa Tree -- that hasn't changed (after all, it was my strategy!)

One ability comes from equipment and one ability comes from mastering it earlier. I'm simply saying that it would be beneficial to master the more used and therefore more useful ability.

This would save time AND resets...

The best of both worlds!

Atomos199 posted...
OK, well I don't think there's anything actually *wrong* with the current version, so let's just leave it alone after all, and resist the urge to fix things that aren't broken.


Hey, I already said that I'm turning down the request to edit things myself -- it's better that way for both of us! :P
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I wish you good luck, little boy. You're going to need it.
#35monkeyslingerPosted 2/15/2014 7:05:32 AM
Atomos199 posted...
For Flee, it's another one of those things that add seconds but reduce reseting, since Protect Girls helps you get through the Iifa Tree with fewer resets (wasn't it originally your strategy? :P). At this point I prefer to prioritize resets over time savings given how much extra time is already available.

OK, well I don't think there's anything actually *wrong* with the current version, so let's just leave it alone after all, and resist the urge to fix things that aren't broken.


The changes I made were all very small in scale. I fixed the problems that were pointed out in another thread and made a couple parts easier without any need for changing the target times. Let me know what you think.
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Read along as I pioneer a new stat path for the Final Fantasy IX Excalibur II Perfect Game!
http://ffixexiipgfinalequip.blogspot.com/
#36camdad04(Topic Creator)Posted 2/19/2014 12:04:22 PM
Ok Monkeyslinger, time for that detailed explanation I promised!

Part 1 - (Path C) Pre-Terra Preparation:

Quina needs to learn Auto-Potion and either Level Up or Auto-Reflect. The former is easier to learn (and already accounted for in the guide), while the latter costs more gil (due to lost Millionaire opportunities) and requires prep starting back with Antlion on disc 2. Auto-Reflect is more reliable, but I'm not going to explain it now unless requested.

Dagger needs to learn Auto-Potion, Chemist, Auto-Float, and preferably Reflect. Level Up is debatable; I'll cover that shortly.

You should also purchase a Venetia Shield for Steiner and a Mantra Band for Dagger, and avoid selling the last Coral Ring before Pandemonium. The Venetia Shield is also part of a larger strategy that I'm not prepared to discuss yet, but it too is optional. the Mantra Band is nice because it not only provides the same stat boosts as the Lamia's Tiara, but it also provides an additional point of Defense -- that 1 point can mean the difference between failure and success! Don't stress too much about the gil; we'll be winning two battles shortly that will fetch 5000+ gil.

Pre-Terra Setups:

Steiner: Rune Blade, Cross Helm, Venetia Shield, Diamond Armor, Coral Ring
Abilities: Distract, MP Attack, Bird Killer, Accuracy+

Dagger: Magic Racket, Holy Miter, Magic Armlet, Light Robe/Robe of Lords, Ribbon
Abilities: Chemist, Insomniac, Auto-Potion

Amarant: Kaiser Knuckles, Bandana, -, -, Black Belt
Abilities: MP Attack, Bird Killer, Insomniac

Quina: Silver Fork, Bandana, -, -, Yellow Scarf
Abilities: Millionaire, Insomniac

Zidane: Orichalcon, Green Beret, -, -, -
Abilities: Bird Killer, Accuracy+, Insomniac

It is important that the above setups aren't altered too much. Steiner, Amarant, and Zidane should have 27, 24, and 22 STR respectively.
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I wish you good luck, little boy. You're going to need it.
#37monkeyslingerPosted 2/19/2014 12:39:02 PM
^ Question: I'm thinking about taking the detour to get the Ragnarok for Steiner. Would that fit with your strategy, or would it be better to abandon the idea?
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Read along as I pioneer a new stat path for the Final Fantasy IX Excalibur II Perfect Game!
http://ffixexiipgfinalequip.blogspot.com/
#38camdad04(Topic Creator)Posted 2/19/2014 2:04:46 PM
monkeyslinger posted...
^ Question: I'm thinking about taking the detour to get the Ragnarok for Steiner. Would that fit with your strategy, or would it be better to abandon the idea?


It actually fits in quite nicely! I'm planning the same thing.

Out of curiosity, what are Steiner's leveling setups for your stat path?
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I wish you good luck, little boy. You're going to need it.
#39monkeyslingerPosted 2/19/2014 3:17:29 PM
I plan to keep Steiner's leveling strategy exactly the same as in the guide. With the Defender's +3 Spirit providing most of his needs in that category, he doesn't benefit at all from the lower Spirit requirement if he's not going to take any forced experience, and he can't take it without losing at least 1 magic point.

By the way, I am now firmly on the bandwagon for the Ultima Weapon! I already have the AP allocated for mastery of Soul Blade.
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Read along as I pioneer a new stat path for the Final Fantasy IX Excalibur II Perfect Game!
http://ffixexiipgfinalequip.blogspot.com/
#40camdad04(Topic Creator)Posted 2/19/2014 3:34:16 PM(edited)
Part 2 - Leveling in Terra:

Once in Terra, choose a party of Amarant, Quina, and Dagger. Place everyone but Amarant in the back row.

As you may notice, it is Dagger who is setup to take experience first. I changed her setups so she no longer has to wait for Minerva's Plate. There is a slight benefit to waiting strategy-wise, but it's not a big enough benefit to justify the extra resetting it would take to get all the way to Minerva's Plate with just one encounter.

There are 4 enemy formations possible here: Hecteyes, Mover, Ring Leader, or Ring Leader x 2.

If Dagger has Level Up activated, she can gain experience from the first three only. Ring Leader x 2 would give her too many levels while wearing Light Robe / Robe of Lords. Without Level Up activated, she can safely gain levels from any formation.

It's obvious how to defeat Hecteyes, so here are the other three strategies:

Ring Leader:

Attack with Amarant at the first opportunity. He will do either 8228, 8364, 8840, or 9180 damage. For the lower two values, have Zidane attack next for 1024, 1088, or 1152 damage. For 8840, have Dagger attack for 432, 448, or 480 (496 if wearing RoL) damage. Now wait for Ring Leader to either waste a turn, or take out anyone but Dagger. Once he does, have everyone self-KO before Dagger attacks again for the kill.

Dagger will gain 19 levels (same for Hecteyes.)

Ring Leader x 2:

Follow the above strategy, but have Quina cast Night after either Zidane or Dagger attack the first Ring Leader. Then take the following actions in this order: Amarant attacks the <u>other</u> Ring Leader for a OHKO, Zidane KOs Quina, Amarant self-KOs, Zidane self-KOs, and finally Dagger attacks for the win, all before the Ring Leader wakes up!

Dagger will gain 24 levels.

If Amarant and Quina both get early turns, you can have Quina Eat the first Ring Leader instead, then revert to the single Ring Leader strategy above.

Mover:

This one is a bit more tricky, but still very possible. Have Amarant attack the Left Mover (bottom of the list), Zidane attack the Right Mover (middle of the list), and Dagger cast Reflect on herself, in that order. Wait for Amarant's gauge to fill again, and pray that he's not KOed with Movers' attack...
Now have him attack the Middle Mover (top of the list), while Zidane and Quina self-KO, and Dagger KOs Amarant, in that order. The last remaining Mover should self-KO with a reflected Firaga spell, but feel free to have Dagger tap it once if needed!

Dagger will gain 21 levels.

Now give remove Holy Miter, Light Robe / RoL, and Ribbon from Dagger, and equip Quina with leveling equipment according to your desired stat path. Revive everyone, and move Zidane to the front row.

Now repeat for Quina, Having Quina Eat the Ring Leader for the win this time. Also cast Reflect on Quina instead of Dagger during a battle with Mover.

Set Dagger up like usual just before exiting the screen with Minerva's Plate, activating Auto-Float as well.
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I wish you good luck, little boy. You're going to need it.