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McDonald's helpful suggestions to their employees on how to survive on min wage:

#21chaoslordisgoodPosted 7/18/2013 10:15:43 AM
Sativa_Rose posted...
mystic belmont posted...
If McDonald's can't afford to raise their employees above what the poverty line and than won't need the social safety net, maybe they don't deserve to be in business. We the taxpayer are pretty much picking up the tab on what McDonalds pays it's employees.


With that logic, that is also true for every single minimum wage paying employer in America then.


That is true. Any wage too low for someone to survive on is subsidized by the government, since without government assistance the worker would eventually starve, a state of affairs which would breed a great deal of social unrest.
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#22CC RicersPosted 7/18/2013 10:22:29 AM
Sativa_Rose posted...
Raising minimum wage would make millions of Americans WORSE off, not better off.

There are people BEGGING for minimum wage jobs right now, and they can't even find them. There will be even less minimum wage jobs available if minimum wage is raised...


Teens and adults shouldn't be competing in the same job markets.

The minimum wage makes more sense to younger teens, who don't have as many responsibilities and still live with their parents.

However, how DO the federal and state governments decide on a minimum wage? The amounts seem arbitrary given the living standards and "commodity bundle" values for their respective regions.
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#23The Green GoblinPosted 7/18/2013 10:31:39 AM
Cost of living has risen greatly in proportion to minimum wage.

It needs to be raised (damn near doubled, IMHO). Nuff said.
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#24Genesis DragonPosted 7/18/2013 10:36:34 AM
Fun fact: if minimum wage kept up with increases in productivity, it would be $21.72 right now.

Let that sink in for a moment. $21.72. Almost three times the current federal standard. That's how productive we've gotten. And we're seeing a small fraction of that.

I'm sure someone's going to try to justify this as fair. Good luck.
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Politics is weird. And creepy. And now I know lacks even the loosest attachment to anything like reality. -Shepard Smith
#25KwancahiPosted 7/18/2013 10:38:07 AM
I'm sure someone's going to try to justify this as fair. Good luck.

Well, you see, those people who are making minimum wage are other people, and since I'm not one of them, it is perfectly fair, because they deserve it or something. Whatever. I got mine.
#26chicagogr81Posted 7/18/2013 10:44:20 AM
Raising minimum wage isn't the solution because it ignores the problem: inflation in the cost of living. If the minimum wage goes up, employers will just lay off more workers and/or raise their prices to neutralize the cost. It's much harder to find a way to stop the inflation of cost of living, but that's what needs to be done. Increasing minimum wage will only result in more inflation and more of the federal budget spent on assistance, and the only ones that come out par or better are the corporations who are already doing just fine.

I'm not proposing a solution as to how to accomplish this, as I don't believe it is realistic given our incompetent, petty politicians who are bought and paid for by corporations to keep the masses distracted from the fundamental problem of our rigged economic system. And those wealthy corporations have no problem writing a big check to their lobbyists because the status quo is what they most value.

But the situation is never going to improve with reactionary measures that result in an infinite loop. The powerful will always find a way to bend or change the rules to continue their greed.
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#27Genesis DragonPosted 7/18/2013 11:02:16 AM
chicagogr81 posted...
Raising minimum wage isn't the solution because it ignores the problem: inflation in the cost of living. If the minimum wage goes up, employers will just lay off more workers and/or raise their prices to neutralize the cost. It's much harder to find a way to stop the inflation of cost of living, but that's what needs to be done. Increasing minimum wage will only result in more inflation and more of the federal budget spent on assistance, and the only ones that come out par or better are the corporations who are already doing just fine.


See, I had a feeling this kind of response would come up, and to be honest, I don't buy it. I mean, I don't deny the principle in itself, but I don't believe that a minimum wage increase's sole effect will be to proportionally change the baseline. The only way it would happen is if prices and such are based entirely on the minimum wage, which simply isn't the case. There are still many other influences in pricing, and those aren't going to go away.

I'll grant that if people were making more money, I could see some prices going up. But I could see them going up less than the wage increase, because people aren't going to be suddenly flooded in cash. Bumping up the minimum wage a modest amount is going to ease some of the financial burden but it's not going to eliminate it. There's still going to be effects of competition and demand, and that will keep prices from rising to the same rate as wages.

If we combine this with means of reducing cost of living or at least keeping it static (which is a good idea on its own right, I'm certainly not arguing that we should do nothing on that front), that will probably help lift a solid number of people over the poverty line. And maybe it would also lead to a reduction in need for government assistance, which would mean less debt and less tax burden. It would probably also help with upward mobility. I can envision loads of practical benefits.

The problem is going to be the corporate culture, which won't want any of this because it'll eat into their profits. I really think incentivizing the corporate tax structure would be a huge thing here. Offer tax breaks for having more jobs and especially part- and full-time employees (rather than temps), providing benefits to employees, among other things. For the business that will offset some costs, giving them more reason to do it.

I realize this is more pipe dream than anything, since we've got a broken political system beholden to the businesses, complete with what seems like an entire political party dedicated to doing the opposite of these things. But it's nice to dream sometimes...
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Politics is weird. And creepy. And now I know lacks even the loosest attachment to anything like reality. -Shepard Smith
#28funkeepickPosted 7/18/2013 11:14:55 AM
Sativa_Rose posted...
Old as f*** and no one cares

America's poor are way better off than the vast majority of humanity


I love how people you use this logic are usually the same ones who turn around and say "Making 6-figures isn't really that much at all" when the discussion turns to raising taxes on the wealthy.
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#29goatthiefPosted 7/18/2013 11:18:14 AM
Basically work full time at McDonalds (ahahahahaha good luck with that) and get an extra job on top of that.

That's how you're supposed to survive. F*** that. That's not the world I want to live in.
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#30chicagogr81Posted 7/18/2013 11:27:07 AM
I don't like it either, but I'm a realist. The powerful are never going to stop being greedy no matter how much wealth they accumulate, and they will fight to keep everyone else down simply out of spite because they think it's a game. You can't fight the system when they control the rules. The only way to change it is to break the entire system itself, and if companies are too big to fail and get bailed out when greed blows up in their face that's not even possible. I don't know the answer, but I guarantee you it is not easy, painless, quick or cheap.
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