This is a split board - You can return to the Split List for other boards.

30,000 christians murdered by buddhist and shinto warriors

#1FelixTrapperPosted 6/16/2011 7:24:51 AM
This is an interesting story that I hadn't heard before--

to preface, I really enjoy RPG making as a hobby (that's actually the reason I joined GameFAQs 10 years ago) and I am always looking for new games to work on. I like telling stories through them.

The leading RPG Making company, Enterbrain, recently released a new graphics pack, with hundreds and hundreds of images/tiles/characters, all in the feudal japan setting. I always wanted to make a feudal japan era RPG, but lacked the resources.

So I bought the graphics pack, and began doing research on feudal japan. I happened upon the story of Amakusa Shiro.

Basically, a jesuit named Francis Xavier first brought Christianity to Japan in the 1500s, and managed to convert some people, among them was a powerful lord of the Amira family. Many of his peasants / farmers / samurai converted as a result.

When he passed away, a new lord was sent in his place, a buddhist. Eager to rise in power and appease the "higher ups", he engaged in many projects such as the building of lavish castles that he couldn't afford. In order to do this he taxed the people double or triple what they could reasonably pay.

He was also not very fond of Christians. In fact, when he was bored, he'd dress a Christian in a straw suit and light them on fire.

So Amakusa Shiro, a 15 year old boy who had been born a Christian, decided enough was enough. He started meeting in secret with other christians and disgruntled farmers and merchants, and formed a rebellion. He was made the leader.

They overthrew the local government and eventually made their way to the main castle over the province. They started losing and retreated to a smaller castle, where they defended attacks for days, killing thousands of samurai and the general who was commanding them.

When the first fleet had failed, the Japanese army arrived with another 200,000 or so men (against Amakusas 30,000) and mowed them over, killing every last one--as a final act, they beheaded Amakusa (who was 16 or 17, mind you) and put his head on a stick.

After that, Christianity was banned in Japan for the next 250ish years. To this day Amakusa is considered a villain in Japanese culture, where Christians (of any denomination) make up less than 1% of the population.

Anyways--I did a very quick summary here, you might be interested in reading more. I was surprised that I had never heard of this event before. He was basically like an unsung Joan of Arc.
---
Slowly recreating Final Fantasy 6 into 3D, one block at a time.
http://www.youtube.com/user/GDKT0486
#2Hustle KongPosted 6/16/2011 8:58:52 AM
I've known about Amakusa since Samurai Shodown.
---
Shooting Game never die.
It prays that the clover of luck be always in your mind.
#3OrangeWizardPosted 6/16/2011 10:10:23 AM
The topic title should read: "30,000 Christians attempt coup on oppressive Buddhist leader, they fail, and are killed."

What is it with misleading topic titles? Do you people have no shame?
---
"this game is about reality. ... when you fire a gun you are not like "what is this am i shooting sausages?""
-General_Dong on Black Ops
#4BlankDMNPosted 6/16/2011 10:15:30 AM
Wow, I pretty much agree with OW.

They weren't murdered, they lost a 'war' in the 1500s. That's what happens when you 'fight the power' and fail.
---
An Atheist in a Foxhole
#5FelixTrapper(Topic Creator)Posted 6/16/2011 10:34:31 AM
Ah, so had they done nothing and just sat idly by as the Christians were torched alive and beheaded, they'd be murders. . .

but the second a 15 year old grabs a katana and fights back, he's a statistic.
---
Slowly recreating Final Fantasy 6 into 3D, one block at a time.
http://www.youtube.com/user/GDKT0486
#6BlankDMNPosted 6/16/2011 10:47:05 AM
A 15 year old in the 1500s is not a 15 year old in the 2000s, but, besides the point, uhh, yeah, the minute you become a belligerent, you should expect the consequences. If they'd just slaughtered them without provocation, then you might have an argument.

Note, I'm not saying they were 'right' to slaughter them, but it was a battle, not a massacre.
---
An Atheist in a Foxhole
#7FelixTrapper(Topic Creator)Posted 6/16/2011 10:54:07 AM
The provocation was the slaughter of Christians for their faith and other people for not paying the impossible taxes.

His 'belligerent' nature was only a response to crimes committed against his people. He was not the aggressor, but the retaliator.
---
Slowly recreating Final Fantasy 6 into 3D, one block at a time.
http://www.youtube.com/user/GDKT0486
#8SuibomPosted 6/16/2011 10:58:09 AM
Guess they forgot the command to "pray for kings and all who are in authority... that you may have a peaceful life."

I agree with OW too. Terrible idea. Tyranny is never good, but politically motivated Christians aren't either.
---
If honor be your clothing, the suit will last a lifetime; but if clothing be your honor, it will soon be worn threadbare.~ William Arnot
#9BlankDMNPosted 6/16/2011 11:05:40 AM
You can try and twist it as far as you want, but the Christians took up arms against what they felt was an oppressive government. They were no more 'murdered' than Confederate soldiers were during the American Civil War. A tragic loss of life, but to call it 'murder' is highly disingenuous.

In fact, if I was so inclined, I'd call it a good example of the Christian persecution complex.

Oh, wait...
---
An Atheist in a Foxhole
#10FoxTheSwiftPosted 6/16/2011 11:08:04 AM
If you hold a violent rebellion, it isn't really "murder". One of the major problems was the fear (Rightly so too) of the Japanese that Christianity would be used as a weapon by foreigners against their culture and that the Christian countries would come in and imperialize their nation (Which they liked doing quite a lot to other countries that didn't withstand them quite as fiercely as the Japanese). It was less about religion and more about the politics surrounding the religion. Foreigners were trading guns to daimyos in exchange for allowing their missionaries in and all sorts of weird stuff, so that made the innocent Christians come under suspicion. It should also be noted that Ikko Ikki Buddhists were killed en masse similarly to the Christians by Nobunaga for similar political reasons (They were popular with the peasants and threatened the existing power structure).

Interestingly enough, the real killing blow to Christianity in the modern day was most likely done during WW2, since all of the Christians were concentrated in Nagasaki and America killed so many of them all with the bomb.