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30,000 christians murdered by buddhist and shinto warriors

#41FelixTrapper(Topic Creator)Posted 6/20/2011 8:40:41 AM(edited)
fudrick posted...
That is your issue. Your issue is that the government fought back against christians.


No. My issue is that the Tokugawa Shogunate killed Christians or forced them to commit suicide. That came -before- the rebellion.

mercuryink posted...
Yes, but now you're putting the cart before the horse. Said power would not have done that if they had shut up and paid their taxes. There's no such thing as an "impossible tax". You can't tax beyond the ability of your people to pay. That's why those fairy tales about wicked kings taxing people to death are just that. Fairy tales.

That's funny, because Christianity was banned by the Tokugawa before Amakusa was even born, 25 years before the Shimabara Rebellion, and before taxes were raised to support the various construction projects of the Matsukura family who didn't take power until after Christianity (catholicism) had been banned. But I'm sure it was a peaceful ban, they'd have never torched them alive or beheaded them, no, not until they decided not to pay a tax (which was obviously well within their financial boundaries)
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#42mercuryinkPosted 6/20/2011 8:44:51 AM
Somehow, Jews managed to exist in the Eastern world (as early as 15th-16th century Japan) by shutting up, keeping their heads down, and paying their taxes.
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#43FelixTrapper(Topic Creator)Posted 6/20/2011 9:37:05 AM(edited)
The issue wasn't paying taxes in general, it was paying the extremely disproportionate taxes of the Matsukura family, imposed during a time of great famine. The record shows that as soon as he was placed in power, he wanted to gain favor with the Tokugawa by engaging in many expensive projects, simultaneously, and raising the taxes to an absurd amount that the people deemed unpayable.
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Slowly recreating Final Fantasy 6 into 3D, one block at a time.
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#44FoxTheSwiftPosted 6/20/2011 11:03:21 AM
mercuryink posted...
Somehow, Jews managed to exist in the Eastern world (as early as 15th-16th century Japan) by shutting up, keeping their heads down, and paying their taxes.

http://www5.ocn.ne.jp/~magi9/isracame.htm

Hmm! Apparently its because Japanese are the descendents of the Jews! No wonder they had to satiate their lust for Christian blood =P
#45mystic belmontPosted 6/20/2011 11:10:04 AM
OrangeWizard posted...
The topic title should read: "30,000 Christians attempt coup on oppressive Buddhist leader, they fail, and are killed."

What is it with misleading topic titles? Do you people have no shame?



This so much.
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Again I must reiterate that I did not plagiarize twice, I copied two assignments once. - tuffguy34
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#46FelixTrapper(Topic Creator)Posted 6/20/2011 12:36:46 PM
mystic belmont posted...
This so much.

Congrats on your 11 year anniversary here on GameFAQs yesterday.
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Slowly recreating Final Fantasy 6 into 3D, one block at a time.
http://www.youtube.com/user/GDKT0486
#47Julian_CaesarPosted 6/20/2011 9:50:32 PM
Its difficult to call "non-retaliation" a Christian principle when Christians for the vast majority of history have spurned it in exchange for shocking amounts of violence.

No, it's not difficult at all.

Christian principles are not defined by how well Christians have followed them throughout history. They are defined by how well Christ lived them. That is to say, perfectly.

Also, the term "non-retaliation" is a misnomer; that's not the actual principle at hand. The point is not that retaliation is inherently wrong, but that vengeance is wrong. If a man breaks into your home and you "retaliate" by driving him out, that's different from you chasing that man down the street. Christian pacifism is not a code of strict non-retaliation; it is a relationship with God of respect and submission to His will.

So in the case of these Japanese Christians, where they went wrong was that they took "political vengeance" into their own hands. They decided that this tyrant no longer deserved to be king; just as a man decides that a robber no longer deserves to live. Ultimately, the motives are strikingly similar in origin.

Christian pacifists are worthy of merit and do not deserve to be compared to the vast majority of cases of violent Christians, its just shameful to do so and destroys the sanctity of the sacrifice those Christian pacifists made.

Hence the part where I quite clearly delineated the difference between Christian martyrs and this particular historical event. Just because someone is murdered for being a Christian, doesn't make them a martyr.
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#48mystic belmontPosted 6/21/2011 3:04:54 AM

From: giantdonkeykongteam | #046
mystic belmont posted...
This so much.

Congrats on your 11 year anniversary here on GameFAQs yesterday.


I totally did not even notice that.

LOL.
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Again I must reiterate that I did not plagiarize twice, I copied two assignments once. - tuffguy34
[Evil Republican]