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Question for all of the weak atheists here.

#41xXxCroNoxXxPosted 11/4/2011 10:12:04 AM
First, you're purposefully making it more confusing than it is..
I'm describing your system exactly how it is.


If you believe in a deity, then you are aware of the concept of what a deity is
prove it.

We just have no way to meaningfully discuss unconscious beliefs.
Then it'd be really silly to have a system that tries to discuss them wouldn't it? You make this too easy.
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#42hamsandwich3141Posted 11/4/2011 10:19:37 AM
cyclonekruse posted...
Depends. Is there a reason people are giving me the same answer? It would appear so. We should come up with a reason before making grand predictions.



We should, but in the event I want/need to make a prediction, I'm going with what I have observed 99% of the time.

Let me repeat. Previous observations have no effect on future observations (outside of maybe quantum mechanics where the act of observing changes things). Just because you observe a pattern doesn't mean there's a reason for the pattern (flipping 10 heads in a row).



If I were a caveman with no knowledge of probability and I flipped a coin and got heads 10 straight times you can bet I would put my money (or animal hide or whatever) on another head coming up.

Or even if there is a pattern, the next observation might fall outside the bounds of whatever is causing the pattern (as allin says, if you ask a question on religion in one region you might get a lot of the same answers because they follow the same religion but if you move outside that region and ask the question, the reason behind the pattern no longer applies).

I understand this and what I've said in previous posts is not meant to apply to scientific experiments or whatnot. Just your basic predictions for everyday life.
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#43gamesrgreatPosted 11/4/2011 12:48:12 PM

From: TheGeneralPublic | #041
If you believe in a deity, then you are aware of the concept of what a deity is
prove it.


a herpaderp
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#44xXxCroNoxXxPosted 11/4/2011 1:03:58 PM
gamesrgreat posted...
From: TheGeneralPublic | #041
If you believe in a deity, then you are aware of the concept of what a deity is
prove it.
a herpaderp

So I take it you can't.
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Fare thee well, you evidence of Jewish superiority.
-Mercuryink
#45black spiderPosted 11/4/2011 5:10:12 PM
^^
How can you believe in a deity without being aware of the concept of the deity you believe in?

Frankly its needlessly confusing and just one of many reasons its easier just to use the Dawkins system of ranking people as Theist>Agnostic>atheist based on how likely they believe the existence of god is.
How can you even begin to put probability onto the existence of freaking God or any other gods? There's no rational basis for doing so, other than whatever arbitrary probability you feel like pulling out of your ass. Sure, pulling s*** out of your ass is easier, but is it useful in any way?
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#46cyclonekrusePosted 11/4/2011 7:15:58 PM

From: hamsandwich3141 | #042
We should, but in the event I want/need to make a prediction, I'm going with what I have observed 99% of the time.
If I were a caveman with no knowledge of probability and I flipped a coin and got heads 10 straight times you can bet I would put my money (or animal hide or whatever) on another head coming up.


Yes a caveman would do that. And you might too because, in a lot of ways, we still have caveman brains. That's why so many people commit the gambler's fallacy (see Faust_8's topic about the cracked article). They see patterns in places where there really aren't any. That's just what our brains do.

I understand this and what I've said in previous posts is not meant to apply to scientific experiments or whatnot. Just your basic predictions for everyday life.


i understand that that's what we do and it often works out for us. But does that mean we're justified in doing it? Besides, if you put the same problem in different terms (like asking a question about religion in the southern U.S. and then asking that question in the Middle East, as mentioned earlier) you can intuitively see selection bias at work.
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#47xXxCroNoxXxPosted 11/5/2011 2:52:10 AM
black spider posted...

How can you believe in a deity without being aware of the concept of the deity you believe in?

I can think of several ways, but that alone is not required to be an implicit theist. One could simply be aware of the idea of god, and believe without knowing that they believe.


How can you even begin to put probability onto the existence of freaking God or any other gods? There's no rational basis for doing so

So? Do all theists and atheists base their positions on rationality?
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Fare thee well, you evidence of Jewish superiority.
-Mercuryink