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Fellow Christians: Should we pray for Satan?

#41SSj2_MagnetoPosted 11/14/2012 9:46:49 AM
Why pray for him? What did he do that was so bad?
#42FlashOfLightPosted 11/14/2012 3:34:16 PM
Burning_WolfX posted...

2John 1:10-11

"If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."


You're misinterpreting that passage. What 2 John 1;10-11 is REALLY saying, is that encouraging someone to sin makes you responsible for that person's sin as well. However, there is nothing wrong at all with praying that they repent. Recall the words of Christ:

Matthew 5:44 But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you

So of course we can pray for them. But we cannot encourage them in their sin.


The Scripture in 2John does not deny what Christ is saying, but I am once again making the argument that the Scripture in 2John is giving an admonition to people, and yet while doing so it is being very strict on allowing false doctrine in.

It's not denying that we should not encourage them in sin, but we are overall here talking about Satan, who is an angel, and the principal demon.

So I insist, still according to Scripture, that corrupt angels are not to be prayed for in the same way as man can be prayed for -

Galatians 1:8 doesn't leave any space for praying for Satan, it addresses him directly -

"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed."

Furthermore, Christ did not die for angels, they can not be saved. 2Peter 2:4

"For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;"

Jude 1:6

"And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day."

Christ did not treat the devils in ignorance of their deeds - Matthew 8:29

"And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?"

<- The devils knew that their judgment was set, and those were only striplings, as it were, and not Satan himself who is far more guilty.

So I am concerned that some in this thread are trying to justify praying for Satan, as if doing so is a part of righteousness and mercy, it is not.
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And out of this crust, put out your thrust, do what you must, try not to rust, as you turn to dust.
#43FlashOfLightPosted 11/14/2012 3:39:45 PM
Or, if people insist, what then can be said of a man? Judas?

Should one now pray for Judas? And yet is Judas in any comparison even close to Satan's complete deeds?

Good grief, man, think.

Again, to be clear, Judas' damnation is set -

Matthew 26:24

"The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! "

Acts 1:25

"That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place."
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And out of this crust, put out your thrust, do what you must, try not to rust, as you turn to dust.
#44Burning_WolfXPosted 11/14/2012 4:28:02 PM
FlashOfLight posted...
Or, if people insist, what then can be said of a man? Judas?

Should one now pray for Judas? And yet is Judas in any comparison even close to Satan's complete deeds?

Good grief, man, think.

Again, to be clear, Judas' damnation is set -

Matthew 26:24

"The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! "

Acts 1:25

"That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place."


Actually, I think it's perfectly appropriate to pray for Judas, and I do sincerely hope that, in the end, he's forgiven and welcomed into the Kingdom. He's not in Hell yet, no one is. Judas did later regret his betrayal of Christ, but he was given over to despair. Had he properly repented and made amends for his betrayal of Christ rather than giving into despair and hanging himself, just think of the testimony Judas would have been. He would have been the strongest possible witness to the possibility of repentance and salvation. I feel sorry for him, I really do.

Nowhere do I see in the Scripture you posted that Judas's damnation is 100% sealed. He is not like Satan, who will never repent. Rather, Judas was so overcome with grief and guilt that he couldn't bear it. Surely he is not outside the reach of God's mercy? Surely he showed clear and strong signs of contrition?
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Sometimes I'd like to ask God why He allows poverty, suffering, and injustice when He could do something about it. But Im afraid He'd ask me the same thing.
#45Julian_CaesarPosted 11/14/2012 4:48:28 PM
Everyone is asking the wrong questions in this topic.

The right question is this: Why would you want to pray for Satan?.

If you want to pray for Satan because you genuinely can't bear the thought of anyone going to hell, pray away. If you want to pray for Satan because you want to feel better about yourself, or want to feel intellectual, or any other number of selfish reasons, then I would refrain.

Any action we do is measured by our intention, and our prayers by how closely we mirror the heart of God in our requests. It is God's will (of desire, not command) that none should perish; therefore, a prayer for Satan's salvation born from the desire that none should perish...that is a good thing.
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Every day the rest of your life is changed forever.
#46FlashOfLightPosted 11/14/2012 5:49:34 PM(edited)
Burning_WolfX posted...

Actually, I think it's perfectly appropriate to pray for Judas, and I do sincerely hope that, in the end, he's forgiven and welcomed into the Kingdom. He's not in Hell yet, no one is.


Yes, of course.

Judas did later regret his betrayal of Christ, but he was given over to despair. Had he properly repented and made amends for his betrayal of Christ rather than giving into despair and hanging himself, just think of the testimony Judas would have been. He would have been the strongest possible witness to the possibility of repentance and salvation. I feel sorry for him, I really do.


Judas' damnation was part of fulfilling of the Scriptures, which cannot be broken, that's why at least in his case such a thing was not granted. Now, nevertheless above where you said that Judas is not yet in hell, and about you praying yet for him, the Scripture excludes that he is to be prayed for, because it says "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:" which itself is alluding to when Judas, along with everyone else, collectively, will be judged.

And Christ's comment before, (being very careful here not to be in God's place as judge by me saying such an absolute about Judas) would refute that salvation will yet be granted to Judas, and we know that Christ is faithful and true and when he forgave the malefactor that was with him, he promised him paradise, that is different than Judas, and shows Christ's distinction against the two.

Nowhere do I see in the Scripture you posted that Judas's damnation is 100% sealed. He is not like Satan, who will never repent. Rather, Judas was so overcome with grief and guilt that he couldn't bear it. Surely he is not outside the reach of God's mercy? Surely he showed clear and strong signs of contrition?


Though you may not see it, Judas is dead, and the Scripture says that in the resurrection even those that pierced him would wail, and that Christ will divide those on his left hand from his right, and of that specifically, he says of Judas - John 6:70-71

"Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve."

And John 13:10-11 re-emphasizes this "Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean, but not all.
For he knew who should betray him; therefore said he, Ye are not all clean."

That is why with boldness, with the Scripture's authority we can conclude that Judas is not saved, because Christ himself called him a devil, and we know what Judas did later, and his repenting was not out of coming to an awareness of his sin while in grace, as did David after he killed Uriah, but as of accusing fear as it is explained in Rom 2:15 and Heb 10:27.

This same fearful acknowledgement of sin as King Uzziah had when he was struck with leprosy after he committed his sacrilege.
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And out of this crust, put out your thrust, do what you must, try not to rust, as you turn to dust.
#47AdmiralBisonPosted 11/15/2012 2:30:34 AM
Indori posted...
AdmiralBison posted...
Actually here's a question Christians could answer for me.


Since god or Jesus answer prayers.

Could one pray for god to forgive Satan the Devil and not send him to hell for eternity and simply smother him with that ultimate and pure love that he is so described?


This would be a sincere prayer of course.



Also no silly answers like.


"Jesus or God answers prayers and their answer was NO."

The classic contention to this idea is that God can only forgive the sins of those who earnestly seek forgiveness. Satan is the way he is by his own choosing, and he isn't going to change his mind.


Yeah but God created Satan.

God knew exactly how Satan was going to be. If anything it's Gods fault for creating such a flawed angel.
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If delusions and Illusions are an en-escapable part of our entire lives, why not just pick a positive one?
#48SystemafunkPosted 11/15/2012 8:15:30 AM
Judas' damnation was part of fulfilling of the Scriptures, which cannot be broken, that's why at least in his case such a thing was not granted.

He has not yet, because the day of Judgement has not come yet. You speak of it as though it is in the past. As for his "damnation" fulfilling scriptures, please tell me where it says something to that effect that is not fulfilled by his simple betrayal or his being cursed in this life.
#49SilviiroPosted 11/15/2012 12:36:20 PM
That is why with boldness, with the Scripture's authority we can conclude that Judas is not saved, because Christ himself called him a devil

"Get behind me, Satan."
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"I have seen everything that is done under the sun, and behold, all is vanity and a striving after wind." -- Ecclesiastes 1:14
#50FlashOfLightPosted 11/19/2012 8:59:38 AM
Systemafunk posted...

He has not yet, because the day of Judgement has not come yet. You speak of it as though it is in the past. As for his "damnation" fulfilling scriptures, please tell me where it says something to that effect that is not fulfilled by his simple betrayal or his being cursed in this life.


I already said as much, that he wasn't yet.

As for the second part, have you missed where I put up what Christ said concerning Judas?

Again, following from what Christ already establishes early on in John 13, he continues...

Verse 18

"I speak not of you all: I know whom I have chosen: but that the scripture may be fulfilled, He that eateth bread with me hath lifted up his heel against me."

And he refers to Judas specifically as the 'Son of perdition' a title that emphatically implies that Judas is condemned.

John 17:12

"While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled."

<- And there it ties the two together, Judas being condemned with the Scripture being fulfilled.
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And out of this crust, put out your thrust, do what you must, try not to rust, as you turn to dust.