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How to handle non-believers.

#1XigbarPosted 1/10/2013 12:58:40 AM(edited)
Irreligious are a difficult case. They tend to ignore our feelings when it comes to words like God and religion, despite many of us never bringing the subject up ourselves. We feel disrespected at times. Should we remain humble and allow this behavior from them, or should we speak out?

I'm playing devils advocate here. Personally I'm something of an agnostic.
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#2HylanKnightPosted 1/10/2013 1:19:20 AM
Well, I don't like how the irreligious or the anti-religious treat the religious. I think it's unfair that they're telling us that we have to keep our religious views out of sight, or that acting from religious convictions is a bad thing that should be kept to ourselves. As for speaking out? I'd say that it's a case by case basis. I'm not against debating it, but there's a time and a place for everything.
#3darklaoPosted 1/10/2013 3:41:09 AM
Leave them alone.
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#4Hustle KongPosted 1/10/2013 4:04:08 AM(edited)
The amount of generalization going on here makes baby Kong cry.
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#5FlashOfLightPosted 1/10/2013 6:05:59 AM
Answer each one according to their nature, and as the situation requires which is the Bible's standard.

As per here - Prov 26:4-5

"Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit."

Matthew 7:2

"For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."

1 Corinthians 9:19-22 breaks it down in detail

"For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more.

And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some."
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#6LastManStandingPosted 1/10/2013 6:50:44 AM
FlashOfLight posted...
Answer each one according to their nature, and as the situation requires which is the Bible's standard.

As per here - Prov 26:4-5

"Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit."

Matthew 7:2

"For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."

1 Corinthians 9:19-22 breaks it down in detail

"For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more.

And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some."


Share the Good News to them and pray for them. Do not judge, put it all in God's hands.
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#7GBALoserPosted 1/10/2013 7:42:27 AM
HylanKnight posted...
Well, I don't like how the irreligious or the anti-religious treat the religious. I think it's unfair that they're telling us that we have to keep our religious views out of sight, or that acting from religious convictions is a bad thing that should be kept to ourselves. As for speaking out? I'd say that it's a case by case basis. I'm not against debating it, but there's a time and a place for everything.


I don't think it's so much irreligious trying to silence the religious. (Apologies in advance to HK; I fear a bit of generalization coming on).

Most of the irreligious on this board were at one time religious from what I've seen. They were the faithful, the trusting, the unquestioned believers that the religious are. The difference is, when their crises of faith occurred, they could no longer accept their faith at face value. Each has their own reason, each has their own experience. I don't declare any of their choices to be any less valid than the choice of the religious to stay so.

What the faithful appears to see as the unfaithful's disregard for emotion I see as the irreligious disconnecting from what they perceive as manipulation. The irreligious see the exact same thing that turned them away from their religion being replicated in the mouths of the faithful, and it angers them. It doesn't help that the most extreme cases of religious belief on this board are further advancing that stereotype. It's why I've asked posters like LMS to stop what they are doing; IMO they hurt their faith more than they help.

So, am I asking the faithful to stop expressing their beliefs? No. I'm asking for you to understand that the things you use as tenets of faith, and therefore proof enough of God in your eyes, is not going to work against the irreligious. We've all heard the same things from hundreds of different voices, and it hasn't convinced any of us to convert back. When you speak on "proper ways of prayer" or "the one true faith" we can accept it as your belief, but don't try to argue that all others are wrong or try to prove that it's right according to your holy book. It's not an argument that we buy, and in fact it will like give you a more hostile response than you intend.
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#8JonWood007Posted 1/10/2013 9:20:59 AM(edited)
If they bring it up to you, ignore them. If you bring it up to them, then don't cry when we go after your flawed logic. Very few atheists irl are this guy: http://images.cryhavok.org/d/18358-1/Debate+Me.png

We dont go up and down streets telling people they God isn't real and they're stupid. We don't go door to door to spread the word of Darwin or Hawking.

Now, if you mean this website, well, this is a religion board. We are discussing this stuff. And if you cant take the heat, get out of the kitchen, but I seriously doubt christians get harassed by atheists anywhere near as much as atheists get harassed by christians.

Also, if you're making decisions that affect others based on religion, we also have a right to speak out. I'm sorry, but a woman shouldnt be denied the right to her own body because you have a big stink about abortion because of your religion. Gay people should not be banned from being married because you have a big stink about gay marriage. 6 day creationism should not be taught in schools because of your religion. Public policy in this country, which affects everyone, believer or not, should not be affected by the teachings of religion. Don't cry about atheists getting mad at you when you're shoving religion down their throat.
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#9Simon_IsturizPosted 1/10/2013 9:19:36 AM
Xigbar posted...
Irreligious are a difficult case. They tend to ignore our feelings when it comes to words like God and religion

Why would your feelings matter? If the argument is one regarding the existence of a supernatural god or gods, then how you feel emotionally on the subject is of no interest to the discussion. Evidence and well reasoned argument are the only things that matter.

We feel disrespected at times. Should we remain humble and allow this behavior from them, or should we speak out?

Ask yourself this, are religious beliefs deserving of respect? I'm sure we can all agree that people's rights the have those beliefs are to be respected, but no one said anything about respecting those beliefs themselves. I would imagine that only ideas that are based on evidence and reality should be treated with respect.
#10HylanKnightPosted 1/10/2013 4:52:17 PM
GBALoser posted...
HylanKnight posted...
Well, I don't like how the irreligious or the anti-religious treat the religious. I think it's unfair that they're telling us that we have to keep our religious views out of sight, or that acting from religious convictions is a bad thing that should be kept to ourselves. As for speaking out? I'd say that it's a case by case basis. I'm not against debating it, but there's a time and a place for everything.


I don't think it's so much irreligious trying to silence the religious. (Apologies in advance to HK; I fear a bit of generalization coming on).

Most of the irreligious on this board were at one time religious from what I've seen. They were the faithful, the trusting, the unquestioned believers that the religious are. The difference is, when their crises of faith occurred, they could no longer accept their faith at face value. Each has their own reason, each has their own experience. I don't declare any of their choices to be any less valid than the choice of the religious to stay so.

What the faithful appears to see as the unfaithful's disregard for emotion I see as the irreligious disconnecting from what they perceive as manipulation. The irreligious see the exact same thing that turned them away from their religion being replicated in the mouths of the faithful, and it angers them. It doesn't help that the most extreme cases of religious belief on this board are further advancing that stereotype. It's why I've asked posters like LMS to stop what they are doing; IMO they hurt their faith more than they help.

So, am I asking the faithful to stop expressing their beliefs? No. I'm asking for you to understand that the things you use as tenets of faith, and therefore proof enough of God in your eyes, is not going to work against the irreligious. We've all heard the same things from hundreds of different voices, and it hasn't convinced any of us to convert back. When you speak on "proper ways of prayer" or "the one true faith" we can accept it as your belief, but don't try to argue that all others are wrong or try to prove that it's right according to your holy book. It's not an argument that we buy, and in fact it will like give you a more hostile response than you intend.


I think you hit the nail on the head there in your last paragraph. I think that those who use reasoning such as "because the Bible says so" or things like that (I think you know what kinds of things I mean), just make those who don't believe in the Bible upset at their seeming lack of concrete reasoning, and it causes a backlash for all of the religious. Even those who don't try to use those lines of reasoning.

(And I'm not sure if this was clear or not, but when I say irreligious, I don't just mean those who don't believe in a religion, I mean those who are opposed to others having a religion.)