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Refuting the Flying Spaghetti Monster when someone uses it like this.

#61EastsideslingerPosted 1/28/2013 3:53:59 PM
Proudclad posted...
This is for the people who posit a Flying Spaghetti Monster, or similar caricature, as a rebuttal or response whenever someone says that God is real. So for example, if I defend the Bible and someone says "belief in the Flying Spaghetti Monster is as valid as belief in Jesus as the son of God", then I can respond in several ways. This is one form of my rebuttal. Please share thoughts or critiques.

1) If the flying spaghetti monster is actual spaghetti, then we have a warrant for asking for physical evidence for the flying spaghetti monster because actual spaghetti resides in the physical world.

2) In the absence of direct physical proof, and given that we know that, in the absence of omnipotence there can't be physical proof of something that's physically impossible, the Flying Spaghetti Monster is disproven as a mere caricature.

3) if you're referring to something that ISN'T just actual spaghetti but rather omnipotence that presents itself as spaghetti, you aren't referring to a flying spaghetti monster but rather you're referring to omnipotence.

4) You're using the idea of omnipotence to contradict someone's idea of God.

5) if omnipotence isn't a contradiction to that person's idea of God, then your argument isn't a valid comparison/rebuttal because you aren't attacking anything



That'd be like argueing that Santa is physically real because raindeer actually exist so whenever he goes flying around the globe one of them had to have left some kind of evidence of it's passing. I would think it strange if you all of a sudden found raindeer poop in the middle of the sub saharan desert (assuming santa cares about the boys and girls who live in africa so that's probably not a good example.)
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#62Joe605Posted 1/30/2013 2:04:42 PM
C_Mat posted...
The FSM is a pretty pathetic attempt from atheists to discredit theists. It is not as if Christians make the claim "You cannot disprove God's existence; therefore God exists." They provide external evidence for God that gives explanatory power for the world around us. FSM does none of that.


"You cannot disprove God's existence; therefore God exists" is EXACTLY the claim that Christians, and any other religious believer makes. Not one bit of the external evidence ever provided regarding the existence of God, actually proves the existence of God lol. "That flower is beautiful, therefore God exists" is not proof that God exists.

The "you can't prove it wrong" argument is exactly the argument posited by religion, and it applies to the Flying Spaghetti Monster just as equally as it applies to Jesus, Allah, Xenu, Brahma, Odin, Zeus, Ra, Arceus, Eywa, A, Adad, Adapa, Adrammelech, Aeon, Agasaya, Aglibol, Ahriman, Ahura Mazda, Ahurani, Ai-ada, Al-Lat, Aja, Aka, Alalu, Al-Lat, Amm, Al-Uzza (El-'Ozza or Han-Uzzai), An, Anahita, Anath (Anat), Anatu, Anbay, Anshar, Anu, Anunitu, An-Zu, Apsu, Aqhat, Ararat, Arinna, Asherali, Ashnan, Ashtoreth, Ashur, Astarte, Atar, Athirat, Athtart, Attis, Aya, Baal (Bel), Baalat (Ba'Alat), Baau, Basamum, Beelsamin, Belit-Seri, Beruth, Borak, Broxa, Caelestis, Cassios, Lebanon, Antilebanon, and Brathy, Chaos, Chemosh, Cotys, Cybele, Daena, Daevas, Dagon, Damkina, Dazimus, Derketo, Dhat-Badan, Dilmun, Dumuzi (Du'uzu), Duttur, Ea, El, Endukugga, Enki, Enlil, Ennugi, Eriskegal, Ereshkigal (Allatu), Eshara, Eshmun, Firanak, Fravashi, Gatamdug, Genea, Genos, Gestinanna, Gula, Hadad, Hannahanna, Hatti, Hea, Hiribi, The Houri, Humban, Innana, Ishkur, Ishtar, Ithm, Jamshid or Jamshyd, Jehovah, Jesus, Kabta, Kadi, Kamrusepas, Ki (Kiki), Kingu, Kolpia, Kothar-u-Khasis, Lahar, Marduk, Mari, Meni, Merodach, Misor, Moloch, Mot, Mushdama, Mylitta, Naamah, Nabu (Nebo), Nairyosangha, Nammu, Namtaru, Nanna, Nebo, Nergal, Nidaba, Ninhursag or Nintu, Ninlil, Ninsar, Nintur, Ninurta, Pa, Qadshu, Rapithwin, Resheph (Mikal or Mekal), Rimmon, Sadarnuna, Shahar, Shalim, Shamish, Shapshu, Sheger, Sin, Siris (Sirah), Taautos, Tammuz, Tanit, Taru, Tasimmet, Telipinu, Tiamat, Tishtrya, Tsehub, Utnapishtim, Utu, Wurusemu, Yam, Yarih (Yarikh), Yima, Zaba, Zababa, Zam, Zanahary (Zanaharibe), Zarpandit, Zarathustra, Zatavu, Zazavavindrano, Ziusudra, Zu (Imdugud), Zurvan

or any other deity you wish to substitute.
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#63almasbabyPosted 1/30/2013 4:59:15 PM
The FSM, if it exists, would merely represent the same creative power that atheists are trying to invalidate. Essentially they're saying that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is. He's Spaghetti.
#64fudrickPosted 1/30/2013 10:20:53 PM
almasbaby posted...
The FSM, if it exists, would merely represent the same creative power that atheists are trying to invalidate. Essentially they're saying that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is. He's Spaghetti.


Yeah... that's the reason it was invented
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#65Joe605Posted 1/31/2013 9:25:38 AM
almasbaby posted...
The FSM, if it exists, would merely represent the same creative power that atheists are trying to invalidate. Essentially they're saying that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is. He's Spaghetti.


No, using the FSM in this way is not to say "that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is". You aren't even in the same ballpark to the way atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


Atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster in discussions concerning religion to point out the absurdity in believing something that can't be proven false, but has yet to be proven true. While I, and every other atheist does not actually think the FSM is real, it is still an equally valid hypothesis when compared to any other deity you wish to name, whether you take it from the large list I posted a few posts ago, or some other imaginary friend you choose to have.


The FSM, if it exists, would indeed represent the supernatural creative power. This does not mean using the FSM to point out the absurdity of religion is akin to full fledged belief in Pastafarianism.


Good try though, this is why I love you people, the straws you grasp at are so far away it is quite amusing.
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Bowling IS a sport.
The good thing about science is that it is true whether or not you believe in it.
#66Proudclad(Topic Creator)Posted 2/4/2013 9:08:18 PM
preservation bump, sorry for being so delayed
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#67almasbabyPosted 2/5/2013 8:29:09 AM
Joe605 posted...
almasbaby posted...
The FSM, if it exists, would merely represent the same creative power that atheists are trying to invalidate. Essentially they're saying that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is. He's Spaghetti.


No, using the FSM in this way is not to say "that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is". You aren't even in the same ballpark to the way atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


Atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster in discussions concerning religion to point out the absurdity in believing something that can't be proven false, but has yet to be proven true. While I, and every other atheist does not actually think the FSM is real, it is still an equally valid hypothesis when compared to any other deity you wish to name, whether you take it from the large list I posted a few posts ago, or some other imaginary friend you choose to have.


The FSM, if it exists, would indeed represent the supernatural creative power. This does not mean using the FSM to point out the absurdity of religion is akin to full fledged belief in Pastafarianism.


Good try though, this is why I love you people, the straws you grasp at are so far away it is quite amusing.


But to you Pastafarianism is a joke. Our faith is based in personal conviction. If you want to make a joke out of our faith, go ahead, but it doesn't take into account how serious we are about what we believe in. It's just mockery, nothing to be respected. It's a stupid frat joke by people on the outside looking in. Enjoy yourselves.
#68lastheroPosted 2/5/2013 8:42:39 AM
almasbaby posted...
Joe605 posted...
almasbaby posted...
The FSM, if it exists, would merely represent the same creative power that atheists are trying to invalidate. Essentially they're saying that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is. He's Spaghetti.


No, using the FSM in this way is not to say "that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is". You aren't even in the same ballpark to the way atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


Atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster in discussions concerning religion to point out the absurdity in believing something that can't be proven false, but has yet to be proven true. While I, and every other atheist does not actually think the FSM is real, it is still an equally valid hypothesis when compared to any other deity you wish to name, whether you take it from the large list I posted a few posts ago, or some other imaginary friend you choose to have.


The FSM, if it exists, would indeed represent the supernatural creative power. This does not mean using the FSM to point out the absurdity of religion is akin to full fledged belief in Pastafarianism.


Good try though, this is why I love you people, the straws you grasp at are so far away it is quite amusing.


But to you Pastafarianism is a joke. Our faith is based in personal conviction. If you want to make a joke out of our faith, go ahead, but it doesn't take into account how serious we are about what we believe in. It's just mockery, nothing to be respected. It's a stupid frat joke by people on the outside looking in. Enjoy yourselves.


The only time I see it brought up is when the religious act like everyone should take their god as seriously as they do, and that God - not just a general god, but their specific God - is so obvious that only a fool couldn't see him. I'm sorry you find it insulting, but I find the idea that there's mentally something wrong with me because I don't accept your religion to be pretty insulting, too.
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#69Far421Posted 2/5/2013 8:47:06 AM
almasbaby posted...
Joe605 posted...
almasbaby posted...
The FSM, if it exists, would merely represent the same creative power that atheists are trying to invalidate. Essentially they're saying that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is. He's Spaghetti.


No, using the FSM in this way is not to say "that God exists, but he's not the way you think he is". You aren't even in the same ballpark to the way atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


Atheists use the Flying Spaghetti Monster in discussions concerning religion to point out the absurdity in believing something that can't be proven false, but has yet to be proven true. While I, and every other atheist does not actually think the FSM is real, it is still an equally valid hypothesis when compared to any other deity you wish to name, whether you take it from the large list I posted a few posts ago, or some other imaginary friend you choose to have.


The FSM, if it exists, would indeed represent the supernatural creative power. This does not mean using the FSM to point out the absurdity of religion is akin to full fledged belief in Pastafarianism.


Good try though, this is why I love you people, the straws you grasp at are so far away it is quite amusing.


But to you Pastafarianism is a joke. Our faith is based in personal conviction. If you want to make a joke out of our faith, go ahead, but it doesn't take into account how serious we are about what we believe in. It's just mockery, nothing to be respected. It's a stupid frat joke by people on the outside looking in. Enjoy yourselves.


To be entirely frank, if your position is no more supported by evidence than the FSM, then your belief is what's nothing to be respected, regardless of how serious you are about it.
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#70almasbabyPosted 2/5/2013 8:50:22 AM
To be entirely frank, if your position is no more supported by evidence than the FSM, then your belief is what's nothing to be respected, regardless of how serious you are about it.

But I'm not imposing my faith on you. Why would you go out of your way to make a mockery of it?