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God exists and there's nothing you can do about it, atheists.

#21Moorish_IdolPosted 2/26/2013 7:42:19 PM
Flash may or may not be a geocentrist, but at least he isn't one to go around demanding we all be geocentrists too. He seems to just speak his mind and let others take it or leave it, which is what good posters should do.

Plus he is a nice fella from all indications. I don't think he belongs anywhere near the same group as LMS and PC.
#22FlashOfLightPosted 2/26/2013 7:55:32 PM
TheRealJiraiya posted...

Less so here, though, because when you are around the same community for a long time folks tend to cut you more slack if you miss something


And that's another thing too, in that we may have a slight advantage in posting among regulars, since they may be aware of our beliefs and so we don't have to newly explain it to them again, but I always think that if so-called "newbies" show up, and come across any of our statements for the first time, they will start afresh pretty much demanding an explanation and answer out of us and ask "What? O-o Did you just say what I thought you said?"

And so though to regulars, they might be familiar with how we came to any given conclusions, to new posters it will still be so alien to them, that we have to take the time out to properly again explain to them why we believe certain things we do.

I know many of the posters here have a running joke as it relates to myself of what I say on my views concerning cosmology, and historical commentaries for example, but even so they are somehow acquainted with my stance on those things, but to new users it would once again come off as perhaps the most radical thing they ever heard, and I would have to form a defence against them, and go through the whole process of re-establishing why I have come to the conclusions I have.
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#23FingerpuppetPosted 2/27/2013 11:28:40 PM
Hustle Kong posted...
Lol. FoL is the only one of them I am able to see. >.>


I see them when people decide to quote what they say...sadly, the worst things are what people quote and respond to.
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#24GegengegengegenPosted 2/27/2013 11:39:24 PM
The problem with this board is that there are too many preachers and not enough congregants.
#25JonWood007Posted 2/28/2013 12:05:46 AM
Another problem is the freaking recent obsession with literally arguing semantics. LIke...seriously...these freaking language/definition debates are so boring....tired of getting in 100 post arguments with people over what a word means.
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#26OrangeWizardPosted 2/28/2013 12:09:54 AM
You just don't like getting called out on it when you misuse words.
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Trolling and making valid arguments are not mutually exclusive things.
#27AynRandySavagePosted 2/28/2013 12:15:13 AM(edited)
The real problem is that people want to argue their pet viewpoint, but don't want to do the philsophical legwork beforehand. Philosophy is *supposed* to be tedious and dull, at first. It's like any field. You have to get the basics down before you can get to the fun parts. And yes, if you want to argue about religion, you have to figure out the semantics of the discussion first.
#28JonWood007Posted 2/28/2013 12:55:41 AM(edited)
You just don't like getting called out on it when you misuse words.


And about 90% of the time, I have found a dictionary definition somewhere to support my viewpoint.

The real problem is that people want to argue their pet viewpoint, but don't want to do the philsophical legwork beforehand. Philosophy is *supposed* to be tedious and dull, at first. It's like any field. You have to get the basics down before you can get to the fun parts. And yes, if you want to argue about religion, you have to figure out the semantics of the discussion first.


Well, you see, when I see those kinds of discussions in professional debates, like between atheists and theists, it's normally the theist who likes to do this. I notice atheist debaters like to get their point across plain and simple while theists like to do word games. I've seen them try to pigeon hole weak atheists in debates because they want to use THEIR definition instead of letting the person argue their viewpoint in their own words (when you do that you might as well pull a Clint Eastwood and argue with an empty chair). I've also seen some very manipulative arguments come out of debates like this. WLC LOVES to do this. It's called framing the issue, or in politics, spin. I know when I listened to WLC debate a scientist, I think Lawrence Krauss (who is known for proposing a universe from nothing theory), WLC was throwing out deductive arguments like crazy, and when Lawrence krauss mentioned how things might be different under the conditions in the early universe and conventional logic isn't really valid, WLC got huffy because Krauss wasn't using logic.

Philosophical arguments have uses, but I find them....limited. And as far as debates go, I find them horrendously irrelevant and tedious. With the right definitions of words, and the right premises based on said definitions, you can argue for just about anything, but it doesn't make it true.

Anyway, I'm not a professional philosopher. My actual experience in philosophy is rather shallow, and more based on concepts about life (ie, what is self, do we have free will, etc.) than the nuances of forensics. Seeing how political science and other social sciences are more my field though, I can say that I am very skeptical when dealing with a lot of said philosophical arguments, because there is a lot of bias and spin behind them. And said bias and spin = silver tongued devils trumping the facts.

In other words, I see a major disconnect between the ability to put together philosophical arguments and actually being right. I'm more interested in the latter.
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#29OrangeWizardPosted 2/28/2013 12:58:18 AM
From: JonWood007 | #028
it's normally the theist who likes to do this. I notice atheist debaters like to get their point across plain and simple while theists like to do word games


Speaking of bias...
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Trolling and making valid arguments are not mutually exclusive things.
#30FingerpuppetPosted 2/28/2013 10:10:16 AM
OrangeWizard posted...
From: JonWood007 | #028
it's normally the theist who likes to do this. I notice atheist debaters like to get their point across plain and simple while theists like to do word games


Speaking of bias...


He didn't say that it was only theists. There are a few atheists here that will play semantics until the rivers run dry just so they don't have to be wrong.
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