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In a 100% Christian nation, would laws be necessary and/or desirable?

#11Polish_CrusaderPosted 6/27/2013 1:37:44 PM
Yes, because all christians make mistakes. One of the common subjects and themes throughout the bible is following good leadership. In order to have leadership you need a leader. Every leader has rules. The rules need to be followed if they are good.

Laws are absolutely necessary.
#12kozlo100(Topic Creator)Posted 6/27/2013 1:46:07 PM
That Matt verse does seem relevant. I still don't know that it justifies establishing a legal system though, particularly one that involves punitive measures.
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Time flies like the wind,
and fruit flies like a banana.
#13black spiderPosted 6/27/2013 1:55:18 PM
C_Mat posted...
If I steal something from you, it's my job to forgive you.


If you're going to steal something then you're not really a good Christian, are you? Unless you're having problems, of course, but in that case Kozlo, being a good Christian, is likely going to cherish the opportunity to help you, out of the goodness of his heart.

If everybody are good Christians then nobody will steal unless they really, really have to, and in that case all the other good Christians will line up to help them, making theft entirely unnecessary.
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#14kozlo100(Topic Creator)Posted 6/27/2013 2:12:01 PM
Lets come at it from a slightly different angle, kind of along the lines of spider's comment.

In this fully Christian nation, what to the jails look like? Who's in there, why are they in there, and what are we doing with them? Do we have a death row?
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Time flies like the wind,
and fruit flies like a banana.
#15Dathrowed1Posted 6/27/2013 4:17:51 PM
If you mean in this world, yes. There's a reason why Jesus never participated in politics and continuously said he was not apart of this world.
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#16kozlo100(Topic Creator)Posted 6/27/2013 4:21:28 PM
But if everyone in the nation is a JW, if you're going to have laws, then somebody's got to be participating in politics, right?

If everyone stays out of it, you've got no government at all. I'm wondering if that isn't the desired end game.
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Time flies like the wind,
and fruit flies like a banana.
#17Dathrowed1Posted 6/27/2013 9:47:55 PM(edited)
kozlo100 posted...
But if everyone in the nation is a JW, if you're going to have laws, then somebody's got to be participating in politics, right?

If everyone stays out of it, you've got no government at all. I'm wondering if that isn't the desired end game.


There's a reason why I said "this world".
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#18C_MatPosted 6/28/2013 7:30:31 AM
kozlo100 posted...
That Matt verse does seem relevant. I still don't know that it justifies establishing a legal system though, particularly one that involves punitive measures.


I still don't understand why you think this.

kozlo100 posted...
Lets come at it from a slightly different angle, kind of along the lines of spider's comment.

In this fully Christian nation, what to the jails look like? Who's in there, why are they in there, and what are we doing with them? Do we have a death row?


I don't want to ignore this, but figuring out what the jail system would look like in a hypothetical 100% Christian nation takes more brain power than I feel like putting into this scenario. All I will say is, about .7% of the American population is in prison right now; I'd say a fully Christian nation would have less than that. I don't know if it had a death row; the New Testament affirms the right of a government to impose a death penalty for crimes, but I couldn't tell you if Christians would use it.

kozlo100 posted...
But if everyone in the nation is a JW, if you're going to have laws, then somebody's got to be participating in politics, right?

If everyone stays out of it, you've got no government at all. I'm wondering if that isn't the desired end game.


Is JW a Jehovah's Witness? Because I probably wouldn't consider that a Christian denomination. But anyway, there's no reason getting involved in politics or government is a bad thing just because Jesus didn't. That would be like saying I shouldn't be a doctor just because Jesus wasn't; there was a specific reason Jesus came to earth and it wasn't to get a medical degree or be a political activist. I see no reason Christians should desire to get rid of government.
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#19BashyMcFetusPosted 6/28/2013 11:36:04 PM
C_Mat posted...
I don't know if it had a death row; the New Testament affirms the right of a government to impose a death penalty for crimes, but I couldn't tell you if Christians would use it.

You're going about this all wrong. What crime would a good christian commit that would possibly warrant the death penalty? Anything deserving the death penalty would rule out the person being a good christian, don't you think? And if they aren't a good christian, they aren't in our hypothetical nation.

My take on this is that there would likely be civil and property laws, i.e. zoning laws, who's liable in an accident, etc. There shouldn't need to be criminal laws.
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#20the_hedonistPosted 6/29/2013 12:29:18 AM
I think this is relevant:

When one of you has a grievance against another, does he dare go to law before the unrighteous instead of the saints? Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world is to be judged by you, are you incompetent to try trivial cases? Do you not know that we are to judge angels? How much more, then, matters pertaining to this life! So if you have such cases, why do you lay them before those who have no standing in the church? I say this to your shame. Can it be that there is no one among you wise enough to settle a dispute between the brothers, but brother goes to law against brother, and that before unbelievers? To have lawsuits at all with one another is already a defeat for you. Why not rather suffer wrong? Why not rather be defrauded? But you yourselves wrong and defraud—even your own brothers! (1 Corinthians 6:1-8, ESV)

Now, I do not know what sort of 'court' or 'law' system was in place in the New Testament church. Clearly, there was some authority which mediated between two parties in the church when there was a grievance. It is unclear what this exactly looked like, however.

So, in this hypothetical system, are laws necessary? It depends on whether there is one sect/denomination or multiple. If there is one, then whatever that sect considers authoritative should be the law. For Protestants, it would just be Scripture. For Orthodox/Catholics, it would be Tradition (that's shorthand - I know it's more complicated than that).

But in the case where the nation is 100% Christian, but of multiple sects, I would think a democratic system should be put in place.
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But this I know with all my heart - His wounds have paid my ransom."