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So I finally did Purge of Dalaran as Alliance. (Spoilers, I guess?)

#31Sir WillPosted 2/6/2013 8:33:53 AM
^ all that. Bombs were not good. There was especially 0 need for the second.
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#32c0sa n0straPosted 2/6/2013 8:34:00 AM
CM101Play posted...
Wyrmwarrior5 posted...
c0sa n0stra posted...
I guess Garrosh shouldn't have bombed the city of one of the most anti-war Alliance leaders huh? Jaina may have gone a little overboard, but the rogue Sunreavers constructed the bomb that took out Theramore and then abused the Kirin Tor's neutrality to steal the Divine Bell from Darnassus to unleash another massacre of Alliance CIVILIANS, Varian would never have tried to use that thing.


Nobody is denying that Garrosh is a douchenozzle. But again the thing is, the entire group of Sunreavers should not be taking the blame. Jaina overreacted entirely, and ended up causing a place that was once a symbol of peace into a war zone, and tons of innocents were killed or imprisoned. What happened with Theramore was terrible, and the few behind stuff like that SHOULD be punished, but Jaina didn't go "we need to take out those responsible", it was "**** it kick them all out, kill everyone who might show the smallest resistance."

Also, it's funny that you should mention Varian when he is like "dude Jaina wtf"


So when we nuked Japan and killed, what, thousands of innocents, you thought that was the wrong thing to do? Because if we didn't do it then more people would've died over all. To end a war you have to make the opposition give up, and they won't do that if you're not making every single one of them responsible.


The difference is intent, the US did it to try and force Japan to surrender (not that I think it was a good move), Garrosh is not interested in surrender.
#33Neo_HeartlessPosted 2/6/2013 8:49:19 AM
Actually I bet fine well that if the Alliance bowed to the Horde Garrosh would let them live as he has no love for mindless slaughter. The current attacks do make him look bad but in his eyes he's doing what he needs to do to ensure the survival of the Horde.

What would be more accurate to say is that he doesn't want a compromise peace. Victory or Death and all that jazz.

Also thank you once again Gamefaqs for gifting the world with your god-awful analogies.
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[Wubeth Intensifies]
#34CM101PlayPosted 2/6/2013 8:51:50 AM
Neo_Heartless posted...
Actually I bet fine well that if the Alliance bowed to the Horde Garrosh would let them live as he has no love for mindless slaughter. The current attacks do make him look bad but in his eyes he's doing what he needs to do to ensure the survival of the Horde.


The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.
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#35CM101PlayPosted 2/6/2013 8:52:45 AM
c0sa n0stra posted...
CM101Play posted...
Wyrmwarrior5 posted...
c0sa n0stra posted...
I guess Garrosh shouldn't have bombed the city of one of the most anti-war Alliance leaders huh? Jaina may have gone a little overboard, but the rogue Sunreavers constructed the bomb that took out Theramore and then abused the Kirin Tor's neutrality to steal the Divine Bell from Darnassus to unleash another massacre of Alliance CIVILIANS, Varian would never have tried to use that thing.


Nobody is denying that Garrosh is a douchenozzle. But again the thing is, the entire group of Sunreavers should not be taking the blame. Jaina overreacted entirely, and ended up causing a place that was once a symbol of peace into a war zone, and tons of innocents were killed or imprisoned. What happened with Theramore was terrible, and the few behind stuff like that SHOULD be punished, but Jaina didn't go "we need to take out those responsible", it was "**** it kick them all out, kill everyone who might show the smallest resistance."

Also, it's funny that you should mention Varian when he is like "dude Jaina wtf"


So when we nuked Japan and killed, what, thousands of innocents, you thought that was the wrong thing to do? Because if we didn't do it then more people would've died over all. To end a war you have to make the opposition give up, and they won't do that if you're not making every single one of them responsible.


The difference is intent, the US did it to try and force Japan to surrender (not that I think it was a good move), Garrosh is not interested in surrender.


I've got problems with using a nuke too, but it had to be done.

As for Garrosh, he may not surrender, but who is to say we couldn't scare some of the other races of the Horde to surrender. (In theory of course)
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AJ McCannon's mom (in blue) : http://tinyurl.com/bs6heg7
#36game freakozoidPosted 2/6/2013 9:00:31 AM
Again by 'had to be done' are we to assume you mean 'wasn't really necessary at all and most likely did more harm than good."
#37GiantwaspfacePosted 2/6/2013 9:51:43 AM
As a stalwart Horde player, even I must admit the Horde have been up some some pretty shady stuff lately, but the butchering of innocent Sunreavers instead of just rounding them up and teleporting them out of the city totaly destroys any moral high ground the Alliance might have had. Both sides are just as brutal and deplorable as each other.

Still, Kudos to the writers for coming up some genuinely engaging plot turns as of late. Seriously, I've not seen this much discussion on WoW lore in ages.
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#38game freakozoidPosted 2/6/2013 9:52:59 AM
Giantwaspface posted...
As a stalwart Horde player, even I must admit the Horde have been up some some pretty shady stuff lately, but the butchering of innocent Sunreavers instead of just rounding them up and teleporting them out of the city totaly destroys any moral high ground the Alliance might have had. Both sides are just as brutal and deplorable as each other.

Still, Kudos to the writers for coming up some genuinely engaging plot turns as of late. Seriously, I've not seen this much discussion on WoW lore in ages.


To be fair, you can't really blame the Alliance for this move as even Varian criticized Jaina for it. This was all Jaina who up until this point still considered herself neutral.
#39CM101PlayPosted 2/6/2013 10:59:26 AM
game freakozoid posted...
Again by 'had to be done' are we to assume you mean 'wasn't really necessary at all and most likely did more harm than good."


I'd love it if no one had to die, but if things like these didn't happen more people would be killed overall when compared to the number of casualties that ill occur after something such as dropping a nuke or purging a city is done.
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AJ McCannon's mom (in blue) : http://tinyurl.com/bs6heg7
#40Ness0123456789Posted 2/6/2013 11:13:21 AM(edited)
Wyrmwarrior5 posted...
CM101Play posted...
I wouldn't call it slaughtering people for no reason when the Horde's been doing some pretty bad s*** since Arthas died.


That makes zero sense. 99% of the Sunreavers weren't even with the Horde, for one. And for two, two wrongs don't make a right.


The entire episode was to show Jaina's fall from grace, and how she can no longer see the line between Good and Evil. Right now, everything to Jaina is black and white. There are no individual races of the Horde, they're all simply Horde, and they're all, in her eyes, as evil as Garrosh is.

There's a reason why Varian is digusted with what she did, and tries to console your character by saying you were just following orders. You aren't supposed to feel good about the event, and like I said earlier, it's show a fall of grace for Jaina, and how she's quickly becoming another Garrosh.

It should also be mentioned that NOTHING you do in Dalaran is sanctioned by the Alliance. What Jaina does there is of her own accord, Varian and the other leaders of the Alliance had no idea what she was doing until AFTER she did it. It's a wonder Varian didn't imprison her for it but...I suppose he still feels he needs her to lead the Kirin Tor, though that's quickly proving to be a mistake at this rate.
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