Anyone else think the direction Levine went with the plot was cheap? (spoilers)

#1seinPosted 10/6/2013 3:11:19 AM
Specifically in regards to the whole multi-verse/alternate timeline factor.
It seems so gimmicky in this setting, and unnecessarily makes the story far more complicated and convoluted than it ever needed to be.

I mean something as simple as choosing to have toast and eggs instead of waffles for breakfast can become a super complicated and overwrought ordeal when applied to alternate universes. It just seemed like a super cheap way to make a complex plot device, when the setting itself was more than enough to build off of.

For me the story started to go down hill fast after finding the weapon smith's dead body. I was really becoming attached to that Columbia and the goings on in it, only to have it all but completely abandoned in place for an alternate version, and then another one after that, and then another after that one.

I really wish Levine would've kept the plot grounded in this regard. One reality, one version of all the characters, and one consequence/result. Bioshock 1 managed to stay compelling and complex without resorting to the multi-verse, and Infinite's Columbia in my opinion could've been even more so without it.

IMO the surreal wow-factor of all this taking place in a floating city in the sky was significantly diluted by the whole multiple universe thing.
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#2Demon 50Posted 10/6/2013 9:12:38 AM
Agree. I was hoping that after making the first jump to get the weapons maker you'd take him back to the original universe. I understand why they went the way they did. They wanted the story to be focused more on the characters than the setting (almost the opposite of Bioshock 1). However I ended up not caring as much as I would have because by the end of the game you've made so many universe jumps that who's to say which Comstock you even defeat? I know going by the story you shouldn't really care which one it is, but I couldn't help it. It's like in Comic Books when they show an alternate Earth being destroyed, you don't really care cause it's not the 'main' one you're invested in.
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#3Dark_EpathyPosted 10/6/2013 10:23:14 AM
Yes, I agree completely. Columbia was a fantastic setting, with wonderful themes to explore--and all of it was wasted for the sake of some cheap plot twists.

I was most interested in this game when all I knew about it was the appearance--Booker going to Columbia to bring Elizabeth to some shady guys in New York. That would have been very interesting, in my opinion, not some crazy tale about alternate universes and constants and variables and ghosts coming from alternate realities but not really.

Like you said, you end up not caring. Too much of the immediacy is lost.
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#4FernieODSTPosted 10/6/2013 10:26:12 PM
It's not only the cheap "Multiverse" copout that bugged me. What bugged me most was how Ken Levine went from making a game about a city, to a game about Booker and Elizabeth, and then recently in an interview he just flat out said "Bioshock Infinite is all about Elizabeth. Burial at see is even more about Elizabeth". It's incredibly hard to get invested in a game when almost everything else is more interesting then Elizabeth. The fact that the overall point of tha game was to tell her story disappointed me. In my opinion, she isnt a very interesting character. Her powers are interesting to an extent, but as soon as they mention "Wish fulfillment" they tend to lose any meaning.

I didn't like Elizabeth, and many other people didn't either. So the game fell short for me. And I have a feeling that so will the DLC if he keeps trying to force Elizabeth on us.
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#5sein(Topic Creator)Posted 10/6/2013 10:51:04 PM
FernieODST posted...
It's not only the cheap "Multiverse" copout that bugged me. What bugged me most was how Ken Levine went from making a game about a city, to a game about Booker and Elizabeth, and then recently in an interview he just flat out said "Bioshock Infinite is all about Elizabeth. Burial at see is even more about Elizabeth". It's incredibly hard to get invested in a game when almost everything else is more interesting then Elizabeth. The fact that the overall point of tha game was to tell her story disappointed me. In my opinion, she isnt a very interesting character. Her powers are interesting to an extent, but as soon as they mention "Wish fulfillment" they tend to lose any meaning.

I didn't like Elizabeth, and many other people didn't either. So the game fell short for me. And I have a feeling that so will the DLC if he keeps trying to force Elizabeth on us.



I kinda agree, but overall as a character, I thought she was a nice contrast to Booker, and the self-righteous wickedness of the elitist denizens of Columbia.

What really bugged me was how she inexplicably avoids injury during battle. Just running around the battlefield, gunfire,explosions, and vigors going off and not a scratch. Wish they would've offered some in-game explanation for this.

Almost anything would've sufficed, besides the implied "she just doesn't get hurt,don't ask questions, deal with it" reason we all just have to accept. >_'<
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"The flames wouldn't be eternal, if they actually consumed anything "
#6ssj_duelistPosted 10/8/2013 1:46:07 AM
Ken Levine is a spin doctor and after so many forced changes about the game, he just copped out and made up half assesd excuses to justify this game's plot.
#7simonbelmont2Posted 10/8/2013 9:03:30 AM
I agree completely TC and the plot developments bugged me after I completed the game.

The simple story of Booker trying to rescue Liz and survive the revolution was compelling enough, the game didn't need a convoluted plot involving multiple worlds. The game also wasted characters like Slade and Fitzroy who didn't get much screen time.

It felt like the devs threw in the multiverse plot to help themselves get out of narrative problems. A prime example is the weapons stash, when Booker and Liz find the weapons the devs didn't bother to give them a logical way to move the stash, they just made Liz open a portal to another timeline where the rebels already had the weapons, it felt like a cop out.
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#8Drag_ZEROPosted 10/8/2013 6:32:45 PM
I agree 100%. The whole multiverse thing always ends up seeing like such a cop-out to me, its as if the writers are like "we can't think of any good twists or any way to connect these dots on our own, so let's make some total bull and connect it with some multiverse mumbo jumbo space magic!"
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#9SkankhairPosted 10/10/2013 11:19:05 PM
sein posted...
What really bugged me was how she inexplicably avoids injury during battle. Just running around the battlefield, gunfire,explosions, and vigors going off and not a scratch. Wish they would've offered some in-game explanation for this.

Almost anything would've sufficed, besides the implied "she just doesn't get hurt,don't ask questions, deal with it" reason we all just have to accept. >_'<


They did offer an explanation. Neither the founders, nor the Vox, want to hurt a hair on her head. So in the midst of battle, they aim at *YOU*, not her. She hides, and the enemies go out of their way not to hurt it. It is explained and makes sense in terms of the story.

Of course this requires some suspension of disbelief, as sometimes she happens to be in the blast radius of something as she runs around. Get over it. It's a game. The little sisters in BioShock were specifically explicitly, inexplicably nigh-invulnerable (yes, I meant to say that, and they meant to do that, too).

The alternative is that Elizabeth does get hurt (and again: they did explain why she doesn't), and that would suck very badly. Escort missions suck. Elizabeth does not.

She also didn't get off without a scratch. Mentally, and physically, she changed due to the violence.
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#10FernieODSTPosted 10/10/2013 11:33:20 PM
Skankhair posted...
sein posted...
What really bugged me was how she inexplicably avoids injury during battle. Just running around the battlefield, gunfire,explosions, and vigors going off and not a scratch. Wish they would've offered some in-game explanation for this.

Almost anything would've sufficed, besides the implied "she just doesn't get hurt,don't ask questions, deal with it" reason we all just have to accept. >_'<


They did offer an explanation. Neither the founders, nor the Vox, want to hurt a hair on her head. So in the midst of battle, they aim at *YOU*, not her. She hides, and the enemies go out of their way not to hurt it. It is explained and makes sense in terms of the story.

Of course this requires some suspension of disbelief, as sometimes she happens to be in the blast radius of something as she runs around. Get over it. It's a game. The little sisters in BioShock were specifically explicitly, inexplicably nigh-invulnerable (yes, I meant to say that, and they meant to do that, too).

The alternative is that Elizabeth does get hurt (and again: they did explain why she doesn't), and that would suck very badly. Escort missions suck. Elizabeth does not.

She also didn't get off without a scratch. Mentally, and physically, she changed due to the violence.


If nobody but Lutece, Comstock, and Lady Comstock have seen Elizabeth, then how is it they know not to hurt her? Or that she IS the Lamb? The only ones allowed to see her are the scientists, right? Maybe it makes sense that the founders wouldnt hurt her, but theres no way the Vox would hesitate in hurting her. They wanted to kill kids.
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