So....what's with the lack of general alarm?(2nd Boss Spoilers)

#1HarvPosted 6/23/2012 2:50:12 PM
First off, if you don't know what I'm talking about, then get out of this thread. Don't spoil this for yourself. The element of surprise is a wonderful thing.

*I'm warning you*

I feel it's necessary to discuss this damn thing. I googled it and there was little discussion anywhere that I could find. At least enough to sedate my curiosity.

I have to say, I'm 26, I've played a lot of games in my day, and I've seen some weird ass, and/or creepy ass monsters. Earthbound, Legend of Legaia, and Conker's Bad Fur Day spring to mind immediately, but I think "The Immoral Beast" elicited the most genuine surprise from me. This is my real life dialogue when first witnessing the Immoral Beast...

"..."

"..."

"..."

"..."

"..."

"..."

That's exactly what I said. I've NEVER had a boss leave me speechless like that. I was genuinely disturbed for an inconclusive amount of time. Excuse ME for not bracing myself for a hungry sex craved butt monster with teeth. Which leads me to another observation.

I simply HAD to show this boss to people, and this is the conclusion I came up with. I deliberately didn't tell anybody what was coming to keep my findings more authentic. Once I regained mental capacity my initial thought was "butt monster" but for a minute I thought "Vagina Monster?", then I realized "There are no lips to be seen on the toothy opening, therefore 'butt monster'"

I noticed that guys who saw it that I suspected are insecure about their sexuality labeled it as a "Vagina Monster" whereas guys who I suspected are secure about their sexuality said it was a "butt monster" similarly to what I thought.

This was before Catherine even mentioned anything about "Never doing anything like THAT before..." which didn't even register until my most recent playthrough, which confirms my suspicion about The Immoral Beast further.

So was anyone else as disturbed by this boss as I was? Has anyone else noticed anything regarding my "Vagina or Butt Monster" observation? I'd love to discuss this thing in greater detail.
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"Don't make a fool out of me, that's my job."-Me
#2bond007106Posted 6/23/2012 3:51:47 PM(edited)
I was disturbed by most of the bosses to a greater or lesser extent (except Shadow Vincent and Thomas Mutton; I thought they were cool).
I wasn't especially disturbed by the Immoral Beast, though; maybe somewhere in the mid-range compared to other bosses (it is a butt, by the way. Or to be more precise, it is a backwards torso. Its 'arms' are actually legs, its real arms are used as legs, it butt sticks out the top, and the genitals ought to be a bit above its nose. But they're not there, for what should be obvious reasons.)
I was disturbed more by The Child, and even more so Child with a Chainsaw (that one disturbed me the most, but I still couldn't help laughing at the ridiculousness of it).

As for what the Immoral Beast represents, I'm of the opinion that it simply represents the affair in general, and Catherine's apparently lustful nature, rather than any specific acts. Especially as I have my doubts over whether they ever actually had sex.
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http://myanimelist.net/animelist/kunino-sagiri
#3KaitengiriPosted 6/30/2012 2:30:05 AM
I'm actually quite secure in my sexuality, and I saw and thought Vagina monster. "butt monster" just felt too. . .low brow for a game like this. If it was about sexuality, then vagina is more likely. If it wanted you to be insecure about sexuality, they would have designed the monster to look more like man, instead of the obvious curves.
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But 90% of EVERYTHING is (%*$.
#4bond007106Posted 7/1/2012 1:56:29 PM
That's all well and good, but if you look at the overall anatomy of the entire monster, it's very clear that that is its bottom. By the direction the legs and arms are pointing, it can be nothing else.
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http://myanimelist.net/animelist/kunino-sagiri
#5KaitengiriPosted 7/2/2012 3:33:05 AM
bond007106 posted...
That's all well and good, but if you look at the overall anatomy of the entire monster, it's very clear that that is its bottom. By the direction the legs and arms are pointing, it can be nothing else.


You realize the vagina is only an inch and a half away from the anus, right? Plus it's an over exaggerated sexual characterization. I mean, the eyes, nose, and mouth are located on the BACK.
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But 90% of EVERYTHING is (%*$.
#6bond007106Posted 7/2/2012 7:12:25 AM
I really see nothing on the Immoral Beast that could correspond to vulva. It just seems like wishful thinking to me.
Look at this picture of the Immoral Beast (sorry about the test on it, but it is otherwise by far the best picture I could find):
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lqtz42lilU1r2yun5o1_500.jpg
You can see by the way its feet and hands are pointing that the top in its current pose, the side its nose is on, is the front of the body, and the underside is the back. It has clear buttocks underneath. The vulva ought to be more-or-less right in between its eyes. But there's very clearly nothing there.
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http://myanimelist.net/animelist/kunino-sagiri
#7KaitengiriPosted 7/4/2012 4:03:30 PM
bond007106 posted...
I really see nothing on the Immoral Beast that could correspond to vulva. It just seems like wishful thinking to me.
Look at this picture of the Immoral Beast (sorry about the test on it, but it is otherwise by far the best picture I could find):
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lqtz42lilU1r2yun5o1_500.jpg
You can see by the way its feet and hands are pointing that the top in its current pose, the side its nose is on, is the front of the body, and the underside is the back. It has clear buttocks underneath. The vulva ought to be more-or-less right in between its eyes. But there's very clearly nothing there.


Actually, the basic anatomy of the body suggests that where it's nose and lips are is a back, and the entire structure of the shoulders and feet means that it's likely that the monster is designed by nature to simple exist that way, making the nose and lips dorsal. Honestly, I could go on about this forever, but the main focus of the monstrosity is, obviously, the buttocks shaped region and the gaping maw. Now, the argument could be made for an anal region, but if you look at the design of the creature, there's a part near the dorsal-anterior side that starts the small of the back into the cleft, which is consistent with a back shape seen from above.

Also, what you said about "Not seeing anything resembling a vulva" is quite interesting. I was about to make fun of you for that, but looking closer, it's rather interesting. If the gaping maw with teeth is supposed to be an anus, wouldn't it stand to reason there WOULD be a vulva visible? And there's no pubic bone, either. Also, note that the gaping mouth is ventral to the body, and not medial. If they were attempting to design an anus monster, you'd think the maw would closer represent that, wouldn't you? If I wanted to make a clear statement, I'd definitely draw it more towards the center, and in fact, I would probably make it vertical, not horizontal and superficial to the main trunk.

I originally believed it was best open to interpretation, but the more I look at it, I think your original theory is quite off. I believe that if you see it as an anus monster, then it means that you're quite unfamiliar with female anatomy.
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But 90% of EVERYTHING is (%*$.
#8mastercheeze313Posted 7/4/2012 4:58:09 PM
When I first saw it, I couldn't even figure out what it was. I had to do some research to figure this boss out.
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Whats a signature?
#9bond007106Posted 7/5/2012 2:57:53 PM(edited)
Kaitengiri posted...
Actually, the basic anatomy of the body suggests that where it's nose and lips are is a back, and the entire structure of the shoulders and feet means that it's likely that the monster is designed by nature to simple exist that way, making the nose and lips dorsal. Honestly, I could go on about this forever, but the main focus of the monstrosity is, obviously, the buttocks shaped region and the gaping maw. Now, the argument could be made for an anal region, but if you look at the design of the creature, there's a part near the dorsal-anterior side that starts the small of the back into the cleft, which is consistent with a back shape seen from above.

Also, what you said about "Not seeing anything resembling a vulva" is quite interesting. I was about to make fun of you for that, but looking closer, it's rather interesting. If the gaping maw with teeth is supposed to be an anus, wouldn't it stand to reason there WOULD be a vulva visible? And there's no pubic bone, either. Also, note that the gaping mouth is ventral to the body, and not medial. If they were attempting to design an anus monster, you'd think the maw would closer represent that, wouldn't you? If I wanted to make a clear statement, I'd definitely draw it more towards the center, and in fact, I would probably make it vertical, not horizontal and superficial to the main trunk.

I originally believed it was best open to interpretation, but the more I look at it, I think your original theory is quite off. I believe that if you see it as an anus monster, then it means that you're quite unfamiliar with female anatomy.


I think you're looking at it too closely (both figuratively and literally speaking).
I don't think they intended for it to be examined in such minute detail, and I don't think that any part of it is supposed to correspond on any bodily orifice.
I think it is just a backwards torso with a face on its arse. The mouth is just that, a mouth. One added to complete the face, to give somewhere for the tongue to project from, and to add to the general level of creepiness.
The buttocks are an object of desire among humans, they have been for millennia. That fact sexualises the monster enough as it is. I don't think anything further is necessary. It is, after all, just a simple grotesque.


I would, however, like to bring you up on the whole front/back debate again.
Take another look at this picture:
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lqtz42lilU1r2yun5o1_500.jpg
Look at the arms. Look at the hands. Look at the thumbs. Notice that the hands point out and the thumbs are on the downward side (the side nearest to the viewer). Look also it it's legs. Look at which way its knees and feet are pointing. In both cases, that position is only possible if, like I said, the torso has it's back underneath and its front on top (just try out that pose yourself if you want proof).
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http://myanimelist.net/animelist/kunino-sagiri
#10KaitengiriPosted 7/5/2012 9:11:43 PM
bond007106 posted...
I think you're looking at it too closely (both figuratively and literally speaking).


I didn't read the rest of your post just for that line. Just saying that automatically invalidates not only what you're about to say just on principal, but the entire point of the topic to begin with.

Good game, see you later.
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But 90% of EVERYTHING is (%*$.