DMC3 had a good story!

#111FireMage7777Posted 11/28/2012 8:01:42 PM
mmSNAKE posted...
It's both actually.

Villain isn't a role. It's a description. People just use it as synonym because in a lot of times antagonist is a villain, there can be antagonist where there is no villain character. Any of man vs nature stories, movies like Rocky and such. Also villains can also be protagonists (the broken empire book series). In a sense the anti-hero Kain can fit that description until you get enough story to understand that he is the "big good".

Antagonist is the role that is named after a force which opposes the protagonist. Vergil opposes Dante but overall he isn't the "big bad", Arkham is. That is what makes him the main antagonist, who or what the villain is was irrelevant to my original post.

posting in topic because Legacy of Kain and its best character were mentioned

The clans tell tales of him...Few know the truth.


Villain IS a role, which isn't mutually exclusive with the antagonist. Plslrn2literature

And you're right Vergil DOES oppose Dante, hence why he is the main antagonist, whereas Arkham who is the big bad doesn't really oppose Dante or his ideals, and is more of a threat is the main villain. Class dismissed
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How do you say "I need more power" in dinosaur? RAAAAAWR!!!
#112FireMage7777Posted 11/28/2012 8:03:08 PM
roxas9001 posted...
FireMage7777 posted...
Wow, Retcon your opinion is worse than I thought


Don't Care DMC4 is terrible overall.


No, it isn't
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How do you say "I need more power" in dinosaur? RAAAAAWR!!!
#113roxas9001Posted 11/28/2012 8:04:15 PM
mmSNAKE posted...
Don't Care DMC4 is terrible overall.

And why is it terrible if I may ask?


1. Nero
2. Dante being a joke
3. Nerfed Styles.
4. The worst backtracking in the series.
5. Is indirectly response for this abomination.
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Not changing this until DmCrap flops.
I dislike 90% of the FF fanbase.
#114mmSNAKEPosted 11/28/2012 8:22:24 PM(edited)
And you're right Vergil DOES oppose Dante, hence why he is the main antagonist, whereas Arkham who is the big bad doesn't really oppose Dante or his ideals, and is more of a threat is the main villain. Class dismissed

No that is not the way it works. In that case anything that directly opposes Dante would have a bigger role. Those hell minions. No. Arkham was the cause, and the problem why Dante was put throughout most of this. Vergil just tagged along for his own agenda. The big bad, is the major cause of grief in a story. It's what defines the main antagonist, hell even if that antagonist is hidden until the very end it still makes them the main one because they are the force behind it all.

And hell yeah he opposes Dante. Dante stood for some sort of good, otherwise he wouldn't stick his neck out to kill Demons or help others. Arkham does not care who he hurts to gets what he wants, and being the one that started that mess that makes him the main problem.

Villain IS a role, which isn't mutually exclusive with the antagonist. Plslrn2literature

EDIT:
Please look up villain in the dictionary BEFORE you make that sort of remark. It is not mutually exclusive, it can go one way but it doesn't hold for every case. Villain is also the description of what sort of the person is. Again villain can be a protagonist. The juvenile insult doesn't help either.
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Beatings will continue until morale improves!
#115mmSNAKEPosted 11/28/2012 8:12:56 PM
1. Nero
2. Dante being a joke
3. Nerfed Styles.
4. The worst backtracking in the series.
5. Is indirectly response for this abomination.


1) what about him? He was a new way to play the game.

2) What's that supposed to mean, I'm not a mind reader.

3)in what sense? You have more options than EVER before.

4) Eh? How does that matter, when you get down to it it all boils down to just fights. This isn't a grand adventure. This argument was beaten to death in the day and it still doesn't change. Backtracking is bad yeah, but it doesn't distract or destroy the combat experience that this game is focused on.

5)???? That is dumb speculation. All it did was sell well. Which warranted another game. How they went about that is a whole different story and has nothing to do with DMC4.

Try a bit harder.
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Beatings will continue until morale improves!
#116FireMage7777Posted 11/28/2012 8:14:19 PM
roxas9001 posted...
mmSNAKE posted...
Don't Care DMC4 is terrible overall.

And why is it terrible if I may ask?


1. Nero
2. Dante being a joke
3. Nerfed Styles.
4. The worst backtracking in the series.
5. Is indirectly response for this abomination.


First two are reasons why its good, they were actually buffed, only thing that is even accurate, and yet DMC1 and 3 are massively guilty as well...in fact DMC3's backtracking is arguably worse due to the fact that you are given less content in 3's backtracking than 4's, and that last one is some laughable thing you just came up with. You may leave
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How do you say "I need more power" in dinosaur? RAAAAAWR!!!
#117FireMage7777Posted 11/28/2012 8:22:09 PM
mmSNAKE posted...
And you're right Vergil DOES oppose Dante, hence why he is the main antagonist, whereas Arkham who is the big bad doesn't really oppose Dante or his ideals, and is more of a threat is the main villain. Class dismissed

No that is not the way it works. In that case anything that directly opposes Dante would have a bigger role. Those hell minions. No. Arkham was the cause, and the problem why Dante was put throughout most of this. Vergil just tagged along for his own agenda. The big bad, is the major cause of grief in a story. It's what defines the main antagonist, hell even if that antagonist is hidden until the very end it still makes them the main one because they are the force behind it all.

And hell yeah he opposes Dante. Dante stood for some sort of good, otherwise he wouldn't stick his neck out to kill Demons or help others. Arkham does not care who he hurts to gets what he wants, and being the one that started that mess that makes him the main problem.

Villain IS a role, which isn't mutually exclusive with the antagonist. Plslrn2literature

Please look up villain in the dictionary BEFORE you make that sort of remark. It is not mutually exclusive, it can g one way but it doesn't hold for every case. The juvenile insult doesn't help either.


Vergul IS the antagonist...I mean seriously how does one argue against this, he outright claims it due to directly opposing Dante and his IDEALS (this is a key words so take notes). Now Arkham is the primary villain as A Vergil's motives are less evil than Arkham's and B he doesn't truly oppose Dante's ideals (there's that word again) Thank you for your time
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How do you say "I need more power" in dinosaur? RAAAAAWR!!!
#118mmSNAKEPosted 11/28/2012 8:25:50 PM
You did not understand a damn thing I said. Antagonist is what is the driving force against the protagonist and his agenda. Arkham was the cause of the problem, he was the big bad. He is the main antagonist....It's that simple. He is also a villain.

Vergil fits deuteragonist a hell lot more than antagonist, because he even sides with Dante against the "big bad".
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Beatings will continue until morale improves!
#119ShadowZero007Posted 11/28/2012 8:27:04 PM
FireMage7777 posted...
mmSNAKE posted...
And you're right Vergil DOES oppose Dante, hence why he is the main antagonist, whereas Arkham who is the big bad doesn't really oppose Dante or his ideals, and is more of a threat is the main villain. Class dismissed

No that is not the way it works. In that case anything that directly opposes Dante would have a bigger role. Those hell minions. No. Arkham was the cause, and the problem why Dante was put throughout most of this. Vergil just tagged along for his own agenda. The big bad, is the major cause of grief in a story. It's what defines the main antagonist, hell even if that antagonist is hidden until the very end it still makes them the main one because they are the force behind it all.

And hell yeah he opposes Dante. Dante stood for some sort of good, otherwise he wouldn't stick his neck out to kill Demons or help others. Arkham does not care who he hurts to gets what he wants, and being the one that started that mess that makes him the main problem.

Villain IS a role, which isn't mutually exclusive with the antagonist. Plslrn2literature

Please look up villain in the dictionary BEFORE you make that sort of remark. It is not mutually exclusive, it can g one way but it doesn't hold for every case. The juvenile insult doesn't help either.


Vergul IS the antagonist...I mean seriously how does one argue against this, he outright claims it due to directly opposing Dante and his IDEALS (this is a key words so take notes). Now Arkham is the primary villain as A Vergil's motives are less evil than Arkham's and B he doesn't truly oppose Dante's ideals (there's that word again) Thank you for your time


Arkham is a villain. He is also the story's antagonist.
Vergil serves as an antagonistic driving force but he does so as the deuteragonist.

"In literature, the deuteragonist is the second most important character, after the protagonist and before the tritagonist.[1] The deuteragonist may switch from being with or against the protagonist depending on the deuteragonist's own conflict/plot."
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In my restless dreams I see that town...
#120roxas9001Posted 11/28/2012 8:29:59 PM(edited)
mmSNAKE posted...
1) what about him? He was a new way to play the game.


He was made to appeal to chicks, DMC4 was to appeal to chicks.

2) What's that supposed to mean, I'm not a mind reader.

Instead of progressing forward he goes back, back into that annoying DMC3 mode.

3)in what sense? You have more options than EVER before.

I certainly don't have my Hyper Fist.

4) Eh? How does that matter, when you get down to it it all boils down to just fights. This isn't a grand adventure. This argument was beaten to death in the day and it still doesn't change. Backtracking is bad yeah, but it doesn't distract or destroy the combat experience that this game is focused on.

Backtracking itself isn't bad, its stupidly bad in this game though.

5)???? That is dumb speculation. All it did was sell well. Which warranted another game. How they went about that is a whole different story and has nothing to do with DMC4.

Those braindead clowns at Crapcom can't think of nothing without butchering things. I hope that they go outta business soon & DMC is sent back home to Kamiya where it belongs. DMC4 killed the series.
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Not changing this until DmCrap flops.
I dislike 90% of the FF fanbase.