Things that better and worse in DmC combat?

#1Farting_NewtPosted 2/6/2013 12:14:43 AM
Now here's a switch, why don't we point out positive things they did right for a change, and then some things we didn't like...see how quickly this derails--I'll go first

LIKES

Drive - obviously the most improved aspect of Dante's swordplay, the only game in series where you don't have to go out of your way to combo into it, love the way it buffers off of the initial death blossom spin. Went from terrible to OP in this installment.

Round Trip - Also marvelously improved in utility, though this one I didn't have as much issue with before, used in conjunction with prop shredder or trillion stabs it looks like a meat grinder...

The little vibrations on pause combos - Why did no one think of this sooner? Not even Kamiya thought of this in Bayonetta...

Enemy Step - Always great in every game, but something about this one makes it really combo-able...bigger hit-box I think? (or maybe just rake)

Relaunch heaven - Someone payed attention in DMC4, roulette spin was definitely the coolest move Nero had IMO. The way that a just charge eryx is perfectly timed to smack relaunch victims is perfect.

Demon/Angel dodge - I really like these, especially Demon dodge

DISLIKES

Whip abuse - I see too many angel pulls in videos, don't people know Calibur is cooler anyway?

Revenant - I actually like most of the way this gun is balanced (OMG usable gun damage in DMC)--I just really wish it could ground bounce like Nero's old charge shot, would have been perfect given the way it now relaunches in the air. Then again the only way I know to get someone on the ground from air combo in this game is Enemy Step'd Helm Splitter, so not exactly a super frequent occurrence anyway.

Kablooey - seriously what the hell NT, this gun is a throwaway. Sure it's abusive, but it doesn't look cool, or feel cool to use, it just makes it harder to switch between E&I and Revenant.

Not enough special moves for Angel/Demon weapons - I get that you're suppose to switch frequently, but I wish they were more fleshed out individually. It does encourage me to frequently use all 5 melee weapons in combos though. They wasted open inputs by not giving us double tap circle moves...

No DT only moves - I miss these...

No taunt - yeah, I'd actually use these from time to time, I'm surprised NT didn't make it a big middle finger

Bosses - not quite up to snuff with some of the more memorable bosses in series.

That's actually about it...everything else feels pretty much right at home when you get used to it. I don't even mind the lack of lock-on, it has it's advantages alongside it's disadvantages.
#2fallenangel2100Posted 2/6/2013 12:27:17 AM
Yea pretty much this but to add

Paid dlc costumes especially a dmc3 skin that easilly couldave been rewards for DMD,HOH,HAH

Withheld content to save capcom some face (vergil, BP)

Coulda had more enemies to kill from scrapped designs

Add midbosses to make up for so few "real" bosses
#3Psychochild27Posted 2/6/2013 12:33:09 AM(edited)
The little vibrations on pause combos - Why did no one think of this sooner? Not even Kamiya thought of this in Bayonetta...


To be fair, every combo string in Bayonetta has a delayed input. I can see that getting profoundly annoying in short time.

Kablooey - seriously what the hell NT, this gun is a throwaway. Sure it's abusive, but it doesn't look cool, or feel cool to use, it just makes it harder to switch between E&I and Revenant.


Kablooey is the best gun in the game by far. E&I is trash and Revenant has a grating glitch which if you use it on a prone enemy, it -does- relaunch enemies eighty feet in the air and off towards the horizon (I've gotten my fair share of unintended Environmental kills from it, killing my style gain).

Kablooey's great for setting up simultaneous kills (Especially against Pathos/Bathos, who get one-shot by the explosion), it's great filler in ground combos in place of E&I cancels to set up damage down the line or if you're killing time waiting for an enemy to attack you as short of shielded enemies it doesn't incur hit stagger or interrupt them in any fashion making it a decent taunt substitute, it does fantastic damage, and the Gun Special Detonation is so ridiculously easy to pull off and work into combos, it makes a lot of attacks that are lacking a decent punch (See... ironically most all of Eryx's charge attacks) pretty spectacular from the added explosion.

Honestly, it's the one weapon not in the demo that's actually worth a damn.
#4Farting_Newt(Topic Creator)Posted 2/6/2013 12:31:46 AM
Yeah DLC pretty much sucks, but that wasn't as much in vogue when any of the other games came out otherwise I'm sure they'd have cashed in as well...

More bosses would have been nice, I actually like the way they're implemented in the first game where you meet the same bosses multiple times and they get more complicated. Bob was the only really cool one I thought, and that's mostly just because he's in trip-o-vision.
#5megaultrarice34Posted 2/6/2013 12:36:01 AM
Huh? Wasn't Drive in DMC4 really good though? And Roundtrip in DMC1 was also solid. That being said, both techniques have been buffed in DmC to overpowered levels.
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#6Farting_Newt(Topic Creator)Posted 2/6/2013 12:37:07 AM
lol I've seen that revenant glitch many times when trying to make it behave like Nero's charge bullet.

I need to experiment more with Kablooey I guess, I can do some serious stun abuse with it, but it doesn't really feel like a 'combo' to me so I don't tend to use it. I'm just combo-happy... I thought Aquilla was actually a pretty good weapon not in the demo, you kinda have to switch to it just for utility sake, but it harbors Round Trip, Calibur, and the pull-in moves which are all excellent reasons to swap it in for one attack and back out again.

Eryx is alright, but probably my least favorite gauntlet in series
#7fallenangel2100Posted 2/6/2013 12:38:29 AM
Farting_Newt posted...
Yeah DLC pretty much sucks, but that wasn't as much in vogue when any of the other games came out otherwise I'm sure they'd have cashed in as well...

More bosses would have been nice, I actually like the way they're implemented in the first game where you meet the same bosses multiple times and they get more complicated. Bob was the only really cool one I thought, and that's mostly just because he's in trip-o-vision.


What wouldave been a GREAT nod to dmc1 would be to fight different hunters throughout the campaign especially with kat sayin Hunter'S NT coulda just used the different designs of hunters to add variety and make each one far more tricky to battle
#8Farting_Newt(Topic Creator)Posted 2/6/2013 12:39:46 AM
I could never wait through the start-up time of drive in 3 or 4, they made the buffer start counting much sooner and dropped the wind-up animation. The buffer on the scythe works similarly, plus they held over the just-charge benefits from 4--I think stinger is actually the black sheep in my playbook now...only coming out for style points

also stinger occasionally goes the complete wrong direction.
#9Psychochild27Posted 2/6/2013 1:17:15 AM(edited)
Farting_Newt posted...
also stinger occasionally goes the complete wrong direction.


All forward forward inputs do. I was just trying to screw around on the carnival level and I just managed to do three backwards Streaks in a row. Absolutely infuriating.

I need to experiment more with Kablooey I guess, I can do some serious stun abuse with it, but it doesn't really feel like a 'combo' to me so I don't tend to use it.


Try using it more like Lucifer and finding out how/where you can use the detonation to bounce enemies back to you when you knock them away in lieu of using demon pull. Also, it's pretty great to have the darts on a few mooks in case you go for a Demon Dodge->Trinity Smash set-up and you realize that one of the Stygians will hit you before you can get out of the animation. Slap a detonate and enjoy the even bigger style boost.

I thought Aquilla was actually a pretty good weapon not in the demo, you kinda have to switch to it just for utility sake, but it harbors Round Trip, Calibur, and the pull-in moves which are all excellent reasons to swap it in for one attack and back out again.


You know how you said you didn't feel like you were comboing with Kablooey? Round Trip's that same deal for me, but with even more of a disconnect because you don't have to do anything to earn that ridiculous hit stun paired with the obscenely long duration it will immobilize a target. Calibur's okay, though I still prefer Nero's far too much because I don't feel like I'm in control of whether or not it'll actually work half the time and Buy-In... I've got no qualms with that.

However, combined with how goofy Tornado looks and how Big Slick generally feels broken because it rarely works as advertised outside the Training Room which deposits the enemy at perfect comboing height for Aquila (Everywhere else, it's usually too low to follow up with anything other than Slam/Rake/Helmbreaker) means it doesn't get much love for me outside of Buy-In and using the first two swings of its ground combo as a large radius "Jab" to transition into other weapons' delayed combos as soon as possible.
#10ShamanCluePosted 2/6/2013 1:31:41 AM
I'm not a fan of the pull mechanics in general (even in DMC4).

Feels...slow.

Vergil's "Trick" and "Air Trick" on the otherhand, that's classy. Maybe it's just the animation not the mechanic itself ("Trick" and "Angel Pull" are essentially the same)

Agree on Stinger/Forward input attacks being annoying; although it does stop me from spamming them. Since you have pulls I guess you have other options for closing distance. Still annoying though.

Eryx is underwhelming (where's "Killer Bee"?!)

Enemy Step is wayyyyy easier to pull of in DmC.

Really like Osiris actually; it grew on me (love the aerial pause combo + rake).

Aquila is okay, I just use it for crowd + flashy pull ins to not rely on Demon Pull.

Surprisingly a huge fan of the Arbiter. It's slow and clunky but the sheer weight of the weapon is intoxicating. Great job to NT on that (I thought I would hate it).

Rebellion is okay, I wish they would've come up with SOMETHING original though (all of the moves are sourced from DMC1->4)