Why do most pros hate Nero?

#51darkslayer001Posted 7/1/2013 9:54:42 AM
LordKaizer posted...
SBK91 posted...
Why are you comparing with Dante lol?

Because he's in the game and takes time away from Dante.

Both are different characters,

Different=/=good.

with one focusing on options and the other on damage.

Except Dante has both more options and higher damage.

Nero isn't useless

He has fewer, poorer, more generic options than Dante, struggles more in a game built around him, is worse in all but three situations, less developed story-wise and has a horrible personality. He's worse than useless, he's disadvantageous to have in the game.

but from a casual's standpoint

Casuals don't play higher difficulties nor understand combat mechanics. Their view is irrelevant.

And the same goes for Dante generally most casuals find him difficulty to use

*goes to Youtube*
*watches any Dante boss fight*
*uses Real Impact*
*Devil Triggers on final hit*

Moving along.

has't learned how to properly use styles.

Which would be a problem if Swordmaster wasn't best the vast majority of time.

I only said Nero can hold his ground

He doesn't.

has enough depth for a different and a new character.

Vergil had a similar number of better and more varied options, and was made from boss scraps.

so I wasn't comparing.

I am. Nero takes time and resources from Dante for an inherently more boring playstyle *press button at arbitrary time*.

Surely Nero could be expanded in future titles with new weapons

With most the moves taken up by redundant Exceed versions.

substituting styles for some devil bringer options.

Or give Dante weapon specific grabs a la Izuna Drop.

But I can't seem to think on any new ideas for expanding Dante's combat after DMC4.

Fully developed weapons and Styles. Fill out the inputs for every weapon (back-to-forward, multiple aerial attacks *including specials*, strings and Crazy Combos, Style+Melee, grabs, DT specific attacks, charge inputs, the works). Expand the four primary Styles with new attacks (Gunslinger should be as developed as Swordmaster; they owe us a rocket launcher Crazy Combo), and add one or two more. Do to DMC5 what NG2 did to NG1.

Also, make enemies offensively capable for a change.


you're hatred for nero is off the chart. than again you can't really blame nero for lack of detail around him since capcom wanted to rush DMC 4 instead of taking their times to perfect the game. just saying.


lol he is incredibly biased against Nero.
All are your opinions buddy, believe it or not he is not useless and was made for a different playstyle which turned out to be good whether you like it or not. And he did not by any means hinder Dante's progression in gameplay. I find it impressive that they managed to bring two full characters with their own potential in story and combat wise with a short dev time.
really goes on to say how much DmC screwed the pooch with their 5 yr dev time.

and the moves you described for expanding Dante,, he already has it lol. all you are asking for are new animation moves with the same input. I am talking about the leap DMC3 took with DMC4. replacing current moves with new ones and adding more moves doesn't take that leap. Sure that would be more than enough for the next DMC, but like i said i can't think of anything new such as single style to on the fly style-switching
#52Ink-RibbonPosted 7/1/2013 1:34:52 PM
SBK91 posted...
Why are you comparing with Dante lol?

Because he's in the game and takes time away from Dante.

Both are different characters,

Different=/=good.

with one focusing on options and the other on damage.

Except Dante has both more options and higher damage.

Nero isn't useless

He has fewer, poorer, more generic options than Dante, struggles more in a game built around him, is worse in all but three situations, less developed story-wise and has a horrible personality. He's worse than useless, he's disadvantageous to have in the game.

but from a casual's standpoint

Casuals don't play higher difficulties nor understand combat mechanics. Their view is irrelevant.

And the same goes for Dante generally most casuals find him difficulty to use

*goes to Youtube*
*watches any Dante boss fight*
*uses Real Impact*
*Devil Triggers on final hit*

Moving along.

has't learned how to properly use styles.

Which would be a problem if Swordmaster wasn't best the vast majority of time.

I only said Nero can hold his ground

He doesn't.

has enough depth for a different and a new character.

Vergil had a similar number of better and more varied options, and was made from boss scraps.

so I wasn't comparing.

I am. Nero takes time and resources from Dante for an inherently more boring playstyle *press button at arbitrary time*.

Surely Nero could be expanded in future titles with new weapons

With most the moves taken up by redundant Exceed versions.

substituting styles for some devil bringer options.

Or give Dante weapon specific grabs a la Izuna Drop.

But I can't seem to think on any new ideas for expanding Dante's combat after DMC4.

Fully developed weapons and Styles. Fill out the inputs for every weapon (back-to-forward, multiple aerial attacks *including specials*, strings and Crazy Combos, Style+Melee, grabs, DT specific attacks, charge inputs, the works). Expand the four primary Styles with new attacks (Gunslinger should be as developed as Swordmaster; they owe us a rocket launcher Crazy Combo), and add one or two more. Do to DMC5 what NG2 did to NG1.

Also, make enemies offensively capable for a change.




I think you're my new hero. XD

Very amazing view about the whole Nero thing. I couldn't have said better myself. Nero is the worst thing that could happen to DMC. I wouldn't mind playing a game called Devil May Cry Rising, where a new character gets a chance. However, DMC is and it'll always be about Dante and killing demons.

There is no room for love plots in Devil May Cry. Good thing we'll probably have the chance to play another one, this time without Nero. ;)
#53SBK91Posted 7/1/2013 3:35:40 PM
you're hatred for nero is off the chart.

He's boring as Hell and resembles Dante for no reason.

you can't really blame nero for lack of detail around him since capcom wanted to rush DMC 4

All the more reason not to waste time trying to develop a second character from the ground up.

he is incredibly biased against Nero.

For good reason: every toy Nero gets is one Dante didn't.

All are your opinions buddy,

Nero having less options than Dante, dealing less damage and being worse the majority of the time is fact, not opinion.

believe it or not he is not useless

Addressed.

was made for a different playstyle

Dante could have used all his tools (better).

which turned out to be good

How can it be a good thing to spend most of the game as a worse, limited character, at the expense of the proper character?

And he did not by any means hinder Dante's progression in gameplay

DMC3 Dante has five DAs, five Guns, and six Styles. DMC4 Dante has three DAs, three Guns, and five Styles, most of which is recycled. Wonder why that is.

really goes on to say how much DmC screwed the pooch with their 5 yr dev time.

Agreed.

he already has it lol.

Name one back-to-forward input Dante has in DMC4, or a weapon that has multiple aerial strings without SM/GS. He has no grabs, and only two in DMC3 (Free Ride and Wild Stomp). One Style+Melee input with no directional variations, no air special that isn't an aerial version of the ground equivalent, no DT unique attacks (just alterations), and no weapon with multiple Crazy Combos without SM/GS. DMC4 GS is trash, and needs to be brought as high or higher than DMC3's.

I am talking about the leap DMC3 took with DMC4.

Style switching in exchange for nerfed Styles? Meh. DMC3 already had 'everything-at-once' with Vergil. Exceed is an execution barrier if you want to do decent damage.

replacing current moves with new ones and adding more moves doesn't take that leap.

Even if you triple to quadruple the moveset? I disagree. A large enough evolutionary leap is the same about the same as a revolutionary one (see NG2).

but like i said i can't think of anything new such as single style to on the fly style-switching

IMO, it's more important for next entry to reestablish the brand and get on the right track after the letdown's of DMC4 and DmC. In other words, a proper sequel to DMC3.

Nero is the worst thing that could happen to DMC.

If you think Nero and Tameem are bad, just wait until they add multiplayer...
#54NostalgiaRulesPosted 7/2/2013 11:13:36 AM
While it's true, Nero's move set was very much limited compared to Dante's and Nero only has three weapons, his claw grab was very addictive and fun to use. There was a different animation for the claw grab depending on the type of enemy that he grabbed. It's true, he wasn't NEARLY as fun to play with as DMC Dante was, but he was fun enough. I'll put it this way:


Dante fun meter: 100

Nero fun meter: Meh...between 60 and 70

And for those saying Nero's story is lame because of a "cheesy love story," you might want to steer clear of the DmC Vergil's Downfall novel. DmC Vergil and Kat fall in love and kiss each other. And after Kat's memory is wiped clean, I think it's pretty obvious how she starts to feel towards DmC Dante toward the end of the game.
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Newer isn't always better.
And I shall keep Dante's Force Edge polished and sharp till he comes back.
#55smithkakarotPosted 7/3/2013 8:09:50 AM
NostalgiaRules posted...
And for those saying Nero's story is lame because of a "cheesy love story," you might want to steer clear of the DmC Vergil's Downfall novel. DmC Vergil and Kat fall in love and kiss each other. And after Kat's memory is wiped clean, I think it's pretty obvious how she starts to feel towards DmC Dante toward the end of the game.


That...sounds almost Twilight-tier.
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"Welcome to Oblivion!"-Vegeta
#56roxas9001Posted 7/3/2013 9:36:06 AM
Can't stand nero
#57darkslayer001Posted 7/3/2013 10:29:15 AM
I feel bad for those who don't like Nero considering Donte is a butchered version of him and is supposed to replace/represent Dante. You guys must have really hated DmC.
#58Malus_X6Posted 7/3/2013 11:00:10 AM
From: darkslayer001 | #057
I feel bad for those who don't like Nero considering Donte is a butchered version of him and is supposed to replace/represent Dante. You guys must have really hated DmC.

Truth.
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PSN: LordMalus
XBL: LordMalusDCLXVI
#59NostalgiaRulesPosted 7/3/2013 2:56:32 PM
Malus_X6 posted...
From: darkslayer001 | #057
I feel bad for those who don't like Nero considering Donte is a butchered version of him and is supposed to replace/represent Dante. You guys must have really hated DmC.

Truth.


DmC made me appreciate DMC 2 whole lot more. I'd rather hear DMC 2 Dante's silence than cursing all the time in DmC.
---
Newer isn't always better.
And I shall keep Dante's Force Edge polished and sharp till he comes back.
#60Malus_X6Posted 7/3/2013 6:08:28 PM
NostalgiaRules posted...
Malus_X6 posted...
From: darkslayer001 | #057
I feel bad for those who don't like Nero considering Donte is a butchered version of him and is supposed to replace/represent Dante. You guys must have really hated DmC.

Truth.


DmC made me appreciate DMC 2 whole lot more. I'd rather hear DMC 2 Dante's silence than cursing all the time in DmC.

Goes without saying, really.
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PSN: LordMalus
XBL: LordMalusDCLXVI