Dotabuff shutdown

#41PooiPosted 1/25/2013 6:51:47 PM
Also, my take on this:

Dotabuff, uses their glorified replay downloader to compile data and establish stats.

Valve doesn't care.

Dotabuff tries to monetize their traffic by introducing DBR and other features.

Valve loses their ****. Pushes for an undeveloped and until now, unsupported WebAPI the same week.

Dotabuff, now on the verge of losing a lot of potential income tries to rally its supporters into getting Valve to support their DBR.

End of observation.

DBR will die, hero stats, etc is gonna be fine. I think they'll try to adapt their site to the WebAPI, because Valve isn't going to fold.

One of the problems I can think of is that a lot of games will have to be "refreshed" when players change privacy settings, if you want personal stats. A reliable DBR can't be established when there are players with anonymous IDs (-1).

An example of the information you get from the WebAPI http://pastebin.com/FTJE4kYj
#42MezmorizorPosted 1/25/2013 6:54:35 PM
From: Pooi | #038
You are talking about data mining like it's a bad thing. Are you sure you're not confusing the general term with something like tracking your internet habits?

Also this entire quote is unfounded:

They were going to show anybody who had plus everybody's DBR, and they were obviously planning on making the site nearly useless without buying plus in the future.

That's because it is. Especially data mining that is a flagrant violation of the game's TOS.

And no, that quote wasn't unfounded. As soon as valve cock blocked their plus features, DB shuts down their site. The WebAPI would let them keep tracking the freebie stats, so they were in it for the money. Take a look at maplestory or apps like this on the appstore:
http://eumlab.com/pro-metronome/

In maplestory's case, they introduced the cash shop ~6-7 years ago. When it was released nothing in there affected gameplay in any way, shape, or form. Then they added pets, which let you train while not losing money. Then they added 2x exp and drop cards. Those are self explanatory. Today, you can't play endgame if you don't spend thousands on gear(or the ingame currency equivalent).

For the app, in the free version they advertise a laundry list of features, but without the pro version the only thing it does is keep time in basic patterns. You can't do subdivisions, you can't save tempos to the metronome, you can't add the visual effects, etc.
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#43PooiPosted 1/25/2013 6:54:47 PM
-1 = 4294967295 for an unsigned 32 bit integer.
#44MezmorizorPosted 1/25/2013 6:59:49 PM
Also, they got a lot more than just match stats from their API method. They were doing the same thing people constantly harass facebook for, but it's okay when DB does it?
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#45PooiPosted 1/25/2013 7:11:26 PM(edited)
Mezmorizor posted...

That's because it is. Especially data mining that is a flagrant violation of the game's TOS.


Why is it? Define data mining first then explain to me why it is a bad thing.


And no, that quote wasn't unfounded. As soon as valve cock blocked their plus features, DB shuts down their site. The WebAPI would let them keep tracking the freebie stats, so they were in it for the money. Take a look at maplestory or apps like this on the appstore:
http://eumlab.com/pro-metronome/


Developing and testing their site for a WebAPI that's been unsupported until yesterday takes how long? Anyway, I agree, they're trying to monetize their site, but that still doesn't make this less false:


They were going to show anybody who had plus everybody's DBR, and they were obviously planning on making the site nearly useless without buying plus in the future.



In maplestory's case, they introduced the cash shop ~6-7 years ago. When it was released nothing in there affected gameplay in any way, shape, or form. Then they added pets, which let you train while not losing money. Then they added 2x exp and drop cards. Those are self explanatory. Today, you can't play endgame if you don't spend thousands on gear(or the ingame currency equivalent).

For the app, in the free version they advertise a laundry list of features, but without the pro version the only thing it does is keep time in basic patterns. You can't do subdivisions, you can't save tempos to the metronome, you can't add the visual effects, etc.


Yada, yada. I don't really care about Maplestory, what's that about?
#46MezmorizorPosted 1/25/2013 7:11:25 PM
From: Pooi | #045
Mezmorizor posted...

That's because it is. Especially data mining that is a flagrant violation of the game's TOS.


Why is it? Define data mine first then explain to me why it is a bad thing.


And no, that quote wasn't unfounded. As soon as valve cock blocked their plus features, DB shuts down their site. The WebAPI would let them keep tracking the freebie stats, so they were in it for the money. Take a look at maplestory or apps like this on the appstore:
http://eumlab.com/pro-metronome/


Developing and testing their site for a WebAPI that's been unsupported until yesterday takes how long? Anyway, I agree, they're trying to monetize their site, but that still doesn't make this less false:


They were going to show anybody who had plus everybody's DBR, and they were obviously planning on making the site nearly useless without buying plus in the future.



In maplestory's case, they introduced the cash shop ~6-7 years ago. When it was released nothing in there affected gameplay in any way, shape, or form. Then they added pets, which let you train while not losing money. Then they added 2x exp and drop cards. Those are self explanatory. Today, you can't play endgame if you don't spend thousands on gear(or the ingame currency equivalent).

For the app, in the free version they advertise a laundry list of features, but without the pro version the only thing it does is keep time in basic patterns. You can't do subdivisions, you can't save tempos to the metronome, you can't add the visual effects, etc.


Yada, yada. I don't really care about Maplestory, what's that about?

It's extracting data to usable forms. That's not inherently a bad thing, but it almost always ends up with the third party selling your information.

Maplestory started out as having a harmless monetization system, but now you're forced to spend thousands in order to really play the game. I guess I'm just cynical because I've seen this type of thing too happen way too much, but the parallels seem obvious to me.
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what are "herpes"~samuelskip
#47HeroshiX2Posted 1/25/2013 7:26:05 PM
http://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/17aao9/valve_shuts_down_dotabuff/

More info, including a reply by cyborg matt.
#48Hail_BerserkPosted 1/25/2013 7:35:47 PM
I liked dotabuff a lot but the message rly saddens me on the page. Its almost like they are saying blow up Icefrogs's email, and quit playing dota 2 we get no l33t ranks. I mean it is still a beta and still undergoing many changes .

DB: Hey valve were gonna create a ELO system for dota 2 just like league

ICEFROG: BALLS NO YOUR NOT

DB: Icefrog will not let us do what we want with his game so were deleting everything ='((
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#49DragooneerZeroPosted 1/25/2013 7:41:00 PM
if you build your entire site's functionality around an unsupported method of interfacing with another service, you literally have zero right to complain when changes in that service disrupt the functionality of your site. this is like if someone's website had some ghetto non-API way of extracting data from twitter and then threw a tantrum when twitter updated and broke their method. valve is under no obligation to keep alive that functionality which it never pledged to support in the first place.
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#50Lawl_b0tPosted 1/25/2013 7:49:04 PM
Did all of the data from DOTAbuff influence metagame? Isn't data from an officially competitive game a good thing?
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