Do you think the stormcloaks are uneducated, savage beasts?

#11blackmageomegaPosted 5/8/2013 12:40:41 PM
clone11 posted...


Except Skyrim has always been part of the Empire, so there was no marching in and the Imperials worship Talos too, yet are not the ones throwing a fit. As well as the fact that the ban was not enforced until Ulfric decided he couldn't keep his s*** together. But that's okay, since Ulfric doesn't actually care about Talos worship, it is entirely only a means to an end for him.

Are the actions of Stormcloaks justifiable because of the Talos ban? Maybe. However, when you look at the bigger picture of the whole issue, they appear quite silly.


You're right about Ulfric having ulterior motives but speaking of big picture: It's obvious the White-Gold Concordant was written with a future civil war in mind. It's how the Thalmor want to destabilise the region. Ok sure the Empire didn't take it seriously and didn't actively persecute the Nords for continuing to worship Talos but that could never have been a sustainable agreement.

Sooner or later the Aldmeri Dominion would have gotten word about their lax handling of the situation and have said they were purposely breaking their agreement and all hell would have broken loose again.

That's the beauty of the whole storyline though, no one can really claim the moral high-ground in the civil war.

The Stormcloaks are all morons because they didn't follow along with the rest of the act.
The Imperials are all morons because they're being willfully tricked into destabilising the region which is exactly what the Thalmor wanted to happen.
Ulfric is a git for wanting to use the situation to further his own political goals and become High King.
Tullius is a git (at first) for dismissing the locals beliefs as nonsense and a git further on for being smart to realise the big picture but not doing anything to remedy the situation apart from throw more bodies at the pile.
#12RebelElite791Posted 5/8/2013 12:48:18 PM
blackmageomega posted...


I guarantee you if you waltz into ANY country


*twitches violently*
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#13blackmageomegaPosted 5/8/2013 12:54:02 PM
RebelElite791 posted...
blackmageomega posted...


I guarantee you if you waltz into ANY country


*twitches violently*


Region fine, you know what I meant. Or was the twitching because bringing up real world stuff relating to Skyrim and that whip-ridden horse carcass?
#14Dovah_AhPosted 5/8/2013 12:56:39 PM
They're not uneducated, but I think their cause is dumb. After the great war, and the empire on the brink of collapse, I think it was a stupid move. Ulfric just wants power, plus he could be used by the Thalmor(Read the dossier in the Thalmor embassy).

I don't think they had a strong reason to rebel like Hammerfell. Pretty funny the empire just let Hammerfell go instead of starting a civil war. Probably because they knew they'd be crushed by the redguards, but actually have a chance against the Nords.
#15RebelElite791Posted 5/8/2013 12:57:07 PM
blackmageomega posted...
RebelElite791 posted...
blackmageomega posted...


I guarantee you if you waltz into ANY country


*twitches violently*


Region fine, you know what I meant. Or was the twitching because bringing up real world stuff relating to Skyrim and that whip-ridden horse carcass?


The twitching was because the Empire didn't waltz into Skyrim and ban *their* god. Talos is a Cyrodiilic god too, and Skyrim has been a part of the Empire since its inception.
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#16blackmageomegaPosted 5/8/2013 1:11:03 PM
RebelElite791 posted...
The twitching was because the Empire didn't waltz into Skyrim and ban *their* god. Talos is a Cyrodiilic god too, and Skyrim has been a part of the Empire since its inception.


Oh that. Yeah I know Cyrodil worships the 9 gods so it was one of theirs etc but it's also common knowledge that the Nords favoured Talos above the others because of who he was. As far as the typical Nord of Skyrim was concerned the holy pantheon was "Talos and friends". In most religions with multiple deities you'll find disciples of one deity above the others so if you come along and impose a ban on one of them to most of them it's a case of "oh we lost a God, that sucks" but for the disciples of the deity it's a case of "WE LOST WHO!?"

Just toe the line into real life a minute. I'm assuming we're both in landmasses where the primary religion is one with a single all-powerful deity so let's look at Saints instead. If the church came along and said "Saint Patrick never deserved to be a Saint and must stop being revered as such" the Irish would go absolutely bananas at the notion because he's their patron Saint. I'm just pulling a random name/country of my rear end here but ya get the message I'm trying to convey, right?
#17ZoidberggzusPosted 5/8/2013 1:26:05 PM
Here's my problem with it:

Tullius claims that they were signing the Concordat to appease them, then find time to strike. If that's the case, then just friekin' tell the stormcloaks that. The stormcloaks are mad because they think that the Empire has betrayed them, and abandoned Talos. If the Empire took just one day to assemble a meeting with Ulfric and tell him the big picture, then instead of enemies, the empire would have ALLIES in the stormcloaks to help attack when the time is right.

But if no one in the Empire is aware of that option that they had, then I don't believe they are fit to be in charge of anything.
#18SchesparnPosted 5/8/2013 1:30:40 PM
I think Ulfric is a moron. So the 'other side' in this war made one of their treaty conditions outlawing Skyrim's favored god.

Do you tighten your bond with the OTHER people (the Empire) fighting against these god-outlawers, and thrash out your differences later?

Or do you start a fight with THEM TOO, causing your side and their side to lose men and resources? While the third side (your original enemies) is free to regain its momentum and its own resources.
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#19Necro_Fear89Posted 5/8/2013 1:33:21 PM
Zoidberggzus posted...
Here's my problem with it:

Tullius claims that they were signing the Concordat to appease them, then find time to strike. If that's the case, then just friekin' tell the stormcloaks that. The stormcloaks are mad because they think that the Empire has betrayed them, and abandoned Talos. If the Empire took just one day to assemble a meeting with Ulfric and tell him the big picture, then instead of enemies, the empire would have ALLIES in the stormcloaks to help attack when the time is right.

But if no one in the Empire is aware of that option that they had, then I don't believe they are fit to be in charge of anything.


They can't "Tell" them that. Ulfric kicked a hornet's nest, and made himself to be a rebel with a cause. While I understand why the Stormcloaks are upset, I don't believe the man leading the cause is in it for the noble reasons he portrays, his soldiers are dying for a cause they believe is right and they will reach Sovngarde regardless but I think Ulfric is in it more for himself than for Talos. All his actions from killing Torygg to starting a civil war point to that from my point of view, to make his cause seem just and to make himself seem stronger. Still, I always join the stormcloaks, because then at least in a small way I am opposing the Aldmeri Dominion.
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#20CarbideTitanPosted 5/8/2013 2:00:08 PM
blackmageomega posted...
CarbideTitan posted...

My god's are smiling at me Imperial.


Ancestors. My *ancestors* are smiling at me Imperial. Can you say the same?


I edited it for his post...
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