Lore: Is this CHIM stuff canon ? +2 other Lore questions.

#31SixChamberMagnuPosted 12/15/2011 12:59:33 PM
*Likes this*
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#32Tyheam00Posted 12/15/2011 1:14:31 PM
It's as if the game is logically trying to break the 4th wall, and we are all caught in the middle of the battle trying to make sense of whats going on.
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#33RajhinPosted 12/15/2011 1:37:29 PM
Here's the zero summing Moth Priest mentioned earlier.

http://www.imperial-library.info/content/etada-eight-aedra-eat-dreamer
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#34AdimaxPosted 12/15/2011 2:17:59 PM
ddrake2006 posted...
This is the best topic I have ever had the pleasure of reading.

Ditto. After loads of "quests sux in this game lol" and "this game is broken destruction is a joke", this is amazingly interesting read.

Much love all around. Except to the haters.
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#35shadeauxPosted 12/15/2011 2:55:33 PM
All sounds very dark-towerish... I would love to have a story arc based around attacking/defending the towers of creation.
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#36Brenz0rPosted 12/15/2011 8:49:56 PM
Slade8 posted...
He no longer works at Bethesda (I believe he left/was fired when he was midway done writing Mankar Camoran's speeches for TES IV) but he has released some unofficial writings of his for the TES lore community to enjoy. Those can be found on the Imperial Library website.

He did contract work for Knights of the Nine and I think Shivering Isles, and they brought him back to work on Skyrim. But yes, he left halfway through writing Camoran's stuff in Oblivion.
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#37DarkElven00Posted 12/15/2011 10:34:18 PM
Great thread.
To add to the thread,
CHIM (to my knowledge) is not a reference to the Construction set but instead was used to explain the retcon that Cyrodill (which was a jungle) became what it is now. (CHIM changed Cyrodill).

In addition, Vivec has so far not been established to CHIM in-game so it is arguably non-canonical, as is all of Michael Kirkbride's out-of-game work.
#38BhelliumPosted 12/15/2011 10:41:50 PM
Brenz0r posted...
Slade8 posted...
He no longer works at Bethesda (I believe he left/was fired when he was midway done writing Mankar Camoran's speeches for TES IV) but he has released some unofficial writings of his for the TES lore community to enjoy. Those can be found on the Imperial Library website.

He did contract work for Knights of the Nine and I think Shivering Isles, and they brought him back to work on Skyrim. But yes, he left halfway through writing Camoran's stuff in Oblivion.


Some of the books at least.

Idk if he actually did plot stuff.
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#39Brenz0rPosted 12/15/2011 10:54:45 PM(edited)
DarkElven00 posted...
In addition, Vivec has so far not been established to CHIM in-game so it is arguably non-canonical, as is all of Michael Kirkbride's out-of-game work.

He had it in Morrowind, and certainly had it by the time he wrote the Lessons. There's a whole lot about CHIM in those, what it is, and how to reach it, even if it is often hard to draw out. The Mythic Dawn Commentaries are AFAIK the first source that explains the retcon of Cyrodiil changing from a jungle to a medieval forest ("CHIM. Those who know it can reshape the land. Witness the home of the Red King Once Jungled."), or at least that and Many-Headed Talos (http://www.imperial-library.info/content/many-headed-talos), and the Commentaries are from Oblivion. The concept has been around since long before TESIV.

Regarding the CS:

"Vivec put on his armor and stepped into a non-spatial space filling to capacity with mortal interaction and information, a canvas-less cartography of every single mind it has ever known, an event that had developed some semblance of a divine spark."

Lesson 19. Yeah, that's the CS he's describing. He also describes it in Lesson 22 as the thought-realm of God (you could, from a gamist perspective, take the sleeping godhead to be the game engine; by "attaining CHIM" you use the console and construction set to change aspects of the world that the game engine creates, adding and deleting things at your leisure).
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"We get serious about fictional girl underpants, and kid around when it comes to topics like world hunger." ~Teepo on CAGN
#40QuantumMechonisPosted 12/15/2011 11:16:53 PM

From: DarkElven00 | #037
Great thread.
To add to the thread,
CHIM (to my knowledge) is not a reference to the Construction set but instead was used to explain the retcon that Cyrodill (which was a jungle) became what it is now. (CHIM changed Cyrodill).

In addition, Vivec has so far not been established to CHIM in-game so it is arguably non-canonical, as is all of Michael Kirkbride's out-of-game work.


On the contrary, I'm fairly certain that Michael Kirkbride's stuff is canon to the lore. The reason being that the Elder Scrolls universe is much much vaster than that can be presented, technically, as a computer game. All of these out-of-game posts/articles written by Kirkbride and several other writers are designed to add to the lore of the Elder Scrolls series. I believe the main stance on whether it is canon or not are these three questions: "Does it contradict the established lore?", "Is it interesting?", and "Have the developers specifically said it is not canon?"

Basically if it doesn't contradict established lore (in-game that is) and is interesting (as in not just plain generic fantasy), then it should be treated as canon until the developers say otherwise.
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