Valid criticisms.

#251SagadegoPosted 1/15/2013 7:09:35 PM
DemonDog666 posted...
GloryChaos posted...
Oh. So we're comparing games with completely different graphical design and art style now? Quick, somebody get a screenshot of Warioland Shake It in here and compare it to Kirby's Epic Yarn.


It's the same series...

Sagadego posted...
GloryChaos posted...
Oh. So we're comparing games with completely different graphical design and art style now? Quick, somebody get a screenshot of Warioland Shake It in here and compare it to Kirby's Epic Yarn.


done

wario land
http://www.gamefaqs.com/wii/946578-wario-land-shake-it/images/screen-4

Kirby
http://www.gamefaqs.com/wii/997761-kirbys-epic-yarn/images/gs_screen-24


Which one is supposed to look better?


two different games, so two different artstyles, you cannot be this....
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#252DarkZV2BetaPosted 1/15/2013 7:09:42 PM
DemonDog666 posted...
DarkZV2Beta posted...
DemonDog666 posted...
DarkZV2Beta posted...
TP is a GameCube game. :/
Also, it didn't compare to the prettier Wii games, visually. It had some nice water, but so much of it was terribly ugly, blocky, smudgy, ect.


Even recent wii games look rather ugly blocky smudgy so... yeah not seeing your point.

I really don't see how this

http://gengame.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/skyward-sword-best-worst-zelda-3.png

Is radically better looking then this

http://legendzelda.net/wp-content/gallery/twilightprincess/zelda-twilight-princess-screen-3.jpg


Really? Cuz that's pretty night and day there.


Yes one is in a dark cave which simulates night and the other is during the day in a sunny field.


Maybe you're using a crappy 800x600 display.
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#253DemonDog666(Topic Creator)Posted 1/15/2013 7:15:04 PM
DarkZV2Beta posted...
Maybe you're using a crappy 800x600 display.


Nope 1280x768
#254aether17Posted 1/15/2013 7:15:15 PM
DemonDog666 posted...
stuff


Wii games not getting much better than launch is due to it being so similar to gamecube. Wii U is NOT similar to PS360, especially not the GPU, it's more modern. It's not all about the power, it's mainly about the tech. Recall the Aliens dev (before he was given the final specs) who stated that the Colonial Marines game will look better due to "more modern tech". Even he knows that the specs don't need to be amazingly better to get the game to look better. Why? Modern tech!

http://www.vg247.com/2012/05/25/gearbox-more-modern-tech-allows-wii-u-colonial-marines-to-be-better-visually/

The amount of stress the CPU can handle will probably surpass 360, but the most noticeable stuff will be the graphics. CPU's handle physics, ai, amount of objects moving and all of that may be about the same level as PS360, but it will be the GPU which will determine how far Wii U will go with graphics. Even with similar specs of RSX for example (PS3 GPU), Wii U's GPU would be superior due to its modern tech. I think you may be underestimating what newer tech can do. Remember that pic I showed you earlier:

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/623/directx9vs10th0.jpg

The differences will likely be around that level with respect to graphics. It will be the effects that will make the difference. Wii used the same effects as PS2/GC/Xbox (main factor to why it didn't make a noticable jump disregarding clock speeds), Wii U will use newer effects than PS360 (PS360 could sort of "fake" certain modern aspects, but at the cost of more power, while Wii U's GPU will be able to do that naturally without the same strains). The graphical difference might be around PS2 to Xbox, maybe more maybe less. The power of the engines and tech used will always determine how good graphics will look. A maxed out D9 graphics card will always look worse than a maxed out D10 card of similar specs (if the D10 card takes advantage of its capabilities.). It won't reach PS4720 graphics (never said it would), but it certainly won't fall behind as much in the graphics department like Wii did since the gap of graphics capability is much smaller. Wii had D7 effects, PS360 had D9 effects, HUGE difference. Wii U has at LEAST 10.1, vs D11 of PS4720, small difference. Well, all excluding power. At least we can agree that the graphics WILL surpass PS360. We should see what engines Nintendo is making to take advantage of the "GX2" (their "next Nintendo gen" graphics, "GX1" was for Gamecube/Wii) inside the GPU. Retro is making some engines, wonder what they'll cook up.

Epic states that UE4 will be even more scalable than UE3. Also, don't underestimate the smart phones either, because with the right methods, running UE4 games from consoles could be possible (unless Rein is over-exaggerating with the whole scalability part of the engine and would be taking back what he said). I don't know what smartphones have to do with Wii U though (obviously they'll likely pack less grunt), but look at Infinity Blade:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/6f/Infinity_Blade_Gameplay.jpg

It looks as good as PS360 Unreal Engine 3 games, it's an iOS game, graphics are amazing. Again, don't tell that to me, tell that to Mark Rein who made the claim, I'm not the one who's developing the engine.

Let's just drop this until we get further information. By E3, we should be able to much easier determine what kind of graphics we should expect, I just hope they announce new games using their new engines before that, E3 is just too far away.
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#255DarkZV2BetaPosted 1/15/2013 7:16:14 PM
DemonDog666 posted...
DarkZV2Beta posted...
Maybe you're using a crappy 800x600 display.


Nope 1280x768


A crappy 768, then. Still terrible.
No wonder.
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AMD CACHING = NOT YET FINISHED
Hey... just so you know...PC is a brand. ;). ~Lord_Kagato
#256Koi_TenchiPosted 1/15/2013 7:20:06 PM
Koi_Tenchi posted...
Curious about this since I've never heard about it before...

Controller situation a mess (some games needing wiimote (but won't work with plus) some needing wiimote+, some not supporting pro controller...


What Wiimote games don't work with Wiimotes that have Motion Plus? Or was that just poorly worded?


Bumping this valid question since it's getting lost in all the graphic discussions.
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#257DemonDog666(Topic Creator)Posted 1/15/2013 7:24:35 PM(edited)
@aether17 posted...I really don't see the point in buying a new console to play games that are comparable to ps3/360 games but look prettier and if I did I'd probably be a pc gamer. I never really was arguing graphics, I was arguing capabilities, I mean these trolls pretend devs learning how to use the wiiU better will make them play ps4/next xbox games...

My whole point with the phones was just because you can port the engine to something doesn't mean every game made the engine will be playable on it. This applies to both wiiU and phones. Also well yes Infiniblade does look good it's gameplay is extremely limited, if it can look that good in an open world with a few dozen enemies and fast combat then we'll talk.

I make the mistake of saying looks when I'm talking about gameplay and people think I'm talking about graphics.
#258DemonDog666(Topic Creator)Posted 1/15/2013 7:23:53 PM
DarkZV2Beta posted...
DemonDog666 posted...
DarkZV2Beta posted...
Maybe you're using a crappy 800x600 display.


Nope 1280x768


A crappy 768, then. Still terrible.
No wonder.


So what's good?
#259aether17Posted 1/15/2013 7:59:31 PM
DemonDog666 posted...
@aether17 posted...I really don't see the point in buying a new console to play games that are comparable to ps3/360 games but look prettier and if I did I'd probably be a pc gamer. I never really was arguing graphics, I was arguing capabilities, I mean these trolls pretend devs learning how to use the wiiU better will make them play ps4/next xbox games...

My whole point with the phones was just because you can port the engine to something doesn't mean every game made the engine will be playable on it. This applies to both wiiU and phones. Also well yes Infiniblade does look good it's gameplay is extremely limited, if it can look that good in an open world with a few dozen enemies and fast combat then we'll talk.

I make the mistake of saying looks when I'm talking about gameplay and people think I'm talking about graphics.


Well UE4 will have a more efficient way of doing certain CPU tasks, so you might not need to worry about games not playing better than PS360 since Wii U can use UE4. Just with toned down versions of the PS4720 physics (but still better than PS360).

Technically any UE4 game made would be able to run on Wii U, but toned down enough to support its power. Again, you believe Wii U wont handle them. I understand that, but Mark Rein is said what he said. Ask him about how it would be possible (he said it will be), i'm not developing the engine.
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#260DemonDog666(Topic Creator)Posted 1/15/2013 8:05:53 PM
aether17 posted...
Well UE4 will have a more efficient way of doing certain CPU tasks, so you might not need to worry about games not playing better than PS360 since Wii U can use UE4. Just with toned down versions of the PS4720 physics (but still better than PS360).

Technically any UE4 game made would be able to run on Wii U, but toned down enough to support its power. Again, you believe Wii U wont handle them. I understand that, but Mark Rein is said what he said. Ask him about how it would be possible (he said it will be), i'm not developing the engine.


He said you could port a game on the engine he didn't say you could port every game on the engine, alot of those psn/xbl skew games run on unreal.