Was seventh generation a disapointment?

#31rudgerlightPosted 4/30/2013 2:15:27 PM(edited)
darkstar4221 posted...
rudgerlight posted...
His point was that game prices have actually gone down. And he's absolutely right, especially when you account for inflation. Prices really haven't "increased dramatically" over the years. That's disingenuous.

EDIT: bah! you edited your post! Anyways, your point can be used against you. What difference does it make why prices went down? That doesn't change that prices used to be higher. You're also forgetting that at the same time as the PS1 stores were selling N64 some games for $70. (I'd include the higher priced Saturn games, but that was usually cause they were imports)


No it hasn't, back then Atari games were sold for $25-30 now it's $60 for a new video game, and if the publishers are generous they will lower the price to $40 in five months.

Inflation isn't a factor when it comes to video games, because software which consists of bits and data is infinitely reproducible. What increases the cost of video games is the demands that developers end paying to publishers, and the licensing fees for manufacturers to develop make new consoles. And if the console is expensive and restrictive than the cost to develop games for that system is expensive (ie 7th generation consoles).

What matters is prices in the previous generation, not prices during the SNES era. BTW many PSX games were sold for $40 in 1999, there was no DRM on the PSX, and it was very to pirate games on the PSX.


Are you seriously suggesting that inflation doesn't matter because something is made digitally? I would really suggest researching what inflation means before writing something like that again.

EDIT: for an example of how inflation affects costs, here's a website telling you how to calculate for inflation:

http://www.westegg.com/inflation/

Try entering $25 in 1980 and see what happens.
#32TheRedneck14Posted 4/30/2013 2:40:03 PM
From: rudgerlight | #025
"I'll probably get fired for this, but one thing I really don't like about the way games are made today is that game developers can't just make games. During game pitches there will be a marketing guy there who will cut in in the middle of presenting gameplay ideas and say, 'so this is the part where we want the customer to pay a little bit more.' This is not something the devs want or plan from the beginning. It is something that marketing forces onto the development process."


That is depressing.
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#33darkstar4221Posted 4/30/2013 2:51:46 PM(edited)
rudgerlight posted...
darkstar4221 posted...
rudgerlight posted...
His point was that game prices have actually gone down. And he's absolutely right, especially when you account for inflation. Prices really haven't "increased dramatically" over the years. That's disingenuous.

EDIT: bah! you edited your post! Anyways, your point can be used against you. What difference does it make why prices went down? That doesn't change that prices used to be higher. You're also forgetting that at the same time as the PS1 stores were selling N64 some games for $70. (I'd include the higher priced Saturn games, but that was usually cause they were imports)


No it hasn't, back then Atari games were sold for $25-30 now it's $60 for a new video game, and if the publishers are generous they will lower the price to $40 in five months.

Inflation isn't a factor when it comes to video games, because software which consists of bits and data is infinitely reproducible. What increases the cost of video games is the demands that developers end paying to publishers, and the licensing fees for manufacturers to develop make new consoles. And if the console is expensive and restrictive than the cost to develop games for that system is expensive (ie 7th generation consoles).

What matters is prices in the previous generation, not prices during the SNES era. BTW many PSX games were sold for $40 in 1999, there was no DRM on the PSX, and it was very to pirate games on the PSX.


Are you seriously suggesting that inflation doesn't matter because something is made digitally? I would really suggest researching what inflation means before writing something like that again.

EDIT: for an example of how inflation affects costs, here's a website telling you how to calculate for inflation:

http://www.westegg.com/inflation/

Try entering $25 in 1980 and see what happens.


There is no shortage of video games because video games can be easily reproduced (ie copied/pirated). I can make hundreds of copies of FF13, the only thing is it's illegal under copyright law. As a matter fact the only thing keeping the cost of video games is so high is copyright/patent law and the licensing fees that are tied to it. Inflation is not a huge factor when it come to the cost of developing software. It's the licensing fees that developers have to pay to the publishers/manufacturers that are costly.

One of the reasons why blu-ray is expensive and barley usable is because it's heavily protected by ip. For any developer to use a blu-ray disc they have to pay a patent licensing fee, and that fee goes to Toshiba/Sony/Philips, etc. For the consumer it's illegal to rip blu-ray movies and video games. There are copyright standards to how blu-ray should be made. There is drm on blu-ray movies, it's a disaster.
#34oshawott4everPosted 4/30/2013 2:40:57 PM
Jaime_Benn posted...
Not for me. I enjoyed the 2D fighting game genre revival.


This so much. I've been having a blast with going to all these FGC tournaments.
#35rudgerlightPosted 4/30/2013 3:15:14 PM
darkstar4221 posted...
There is no shortage of video games because video games can be easily reproduced (ie copied/pirated). I can make hundreds of copies of FF13, the only thing is it's illegal under copyright law. As a matter fact the only thing keeping the cost of video games is so high is copyright/patent law and the licensing fees that are tied to it. Inflation is not a huge factor when it come to the cost of developing software. It's the licensing fees that developers have to pay to the publishers/manufacturers that are costly.

One of the reasons why blu-ray is expensive and barley usable is because it's heavily protected by ip. For any developer to use a blu-ray disc they have to pay a patent licensing fee, and that fee goes to Toshiba/Sony/Philips, etc. For the consumer it's illegal to rip blu-ray movies and video games. There are copyright standards to how blu-ray should be made. There is drm on blu-ray movies, it's a disaster.


And again, you really don't understand what inflation means. Inflation directly relates to the cost of EVERYTHING. It's the devaluing of a currency, so people need to get paid more as inflation goes up - no matter what it is you're doing. Basic, really really basic, economics. For your own sake, I would seriously avoid talking about inflation again unless you do some research as to what it is I'm talking about.

Also, licensing fees were higher back in cartridge days and is a major reason a lot of developers stopped making games on Nintendo systems. You're also ignoring that 360 games are made on DVDs yet cost the same as PS3 games, so I doubt it has to do with anything BluRay related since 360 was the main target for most "AAA" games 7th gen.
#36darkstar4221Posted 4/30/2013 3:44:52 PM(edited)
rudgerlight posted...
darkstar4221 posted...
There is no shortage of video games because video games can be easily reproduced (ie copied/pirated). I can make hundreds of copies of FF13, the only thing is it's illegal under copyright law. As a matter fact the only thing keeping the cost of video games is so high is copyright/patent law and the licensing fees that are tied to it. Inflation is not a huge factor when it come to the cost of developing software. It's the licensing fees that developers have to pay to the publishers/manufacturers that are costly.

One of the reasons why blu-ray is expensive and barley usable is because it's heavily protected by ip. For any developer to use a blu-ray disc they have to pay a patent licensing fee, and that fee goes to Toshiba/Sony/Philips, etc. For the consumer it's illegal to rip blu-ray movies and video games. There are copyright standards to how blu-ray should be made. There is drm on blu-ray movies, it's a disaster.


And again, you really don't understand what inflation means. Inflation directly relates to the cost of EVERYTHING. It's the devaluing of a currency, so people need to get paid more as inflation goes up - no matter what it is you're doing. Basic, really really basic, economics. For your own sake, I would seriously avoid talking about inflation again unless you do some research as to what it is I'm talking about.

Also, licensing fees were higher back in cartridge days and is a major reason a lot of developers stopped making games on Nintendo systems. You're also ignoring that 360 games are made on DVDs yet cost the same as PS3 games, so I doubt it has to do with anything BluRay related since 360 was the main target for most "AAA" games 7th gen.


Inflation is an increase in the money supply, people don't get paid more as inflation goes up, it's the cost of things that become more expensive, but that doesn't mean publishers have to pay developers more money. But not everything becomes more expensive, the cost of computers, televisions and many electronic goods are cheaper than they were in the past. Intangible things like music and movies are cheaper. Video games would be cheaper, if developers could avoid many licensing fees, and the copyright laws were drastically reduced.

Again the price video games isn't directly effected by inflation given that software can be easily reprodced. It's the licensing fees that have increased in cost.
#37Shadowbird_RHPosted 4/30/2013 3:39:33 PM
I was a step in the wrong direction, but I still had (and am having) a lot of fun with what came of it.
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#38Golden MavenPosted 4/30/2013 3:43:06 PM
It was, by far, the most consistent generation. Maybe the tops games don't compare to the top games of yesterday, but overall, I tip my hat to the consistency of the generation. I did not experience many droughts, unlike the previous gens. Too much nostalgia in here, I don't miss going to video stores every weekend, hoping I don't bring home a dud. Get real guys, for every Chrono Trigger, you had 20 stinkers.
#39rudgerlightPosted 4/30/2013 4:41:54 PM
darkstar4221 posted...
Inflation is an increase in the money supply, people don't get paid more as inflation goes up, it's the cost of things that become more expensive, but that doesn't mean publishers have to pay developers more money. But not everything becomes more expensive, the cost of computers, televisions and many electronic goods are cheaper than they were in the past. Intangible things like music and movies are cheaper. Video games would be cheaper, if developers could avoid many licensing fees, and the copyright laws were drastically reduced.

Again the price video games isn't directly effected by inflation given that software can be easily reprodced. It's the licensing fees that have increased in cost.


No, inflation is caused by the increase in the money supply, but its effect is a devaluation in currency, hence why $25 in 1980 would be worth $68 today. That is for people, goods, whatever.

The cost of computers and TVs went down because of efficiencies in technology and manufacturing processes. I never claimed the cost of goods is solely determined by inflation.

Movies aren't any cheaper now than they were 10 years ago, in fact ticket prices are nearly double in some areas. I have no idea where you got the impression it was otherwise. Music is cheaper because of new distribution methods and big music labels no longer having a stranglehold on the industry.

Games are going through a similar phase right now, but that in no way is what you were arguing since this whole thing started with you saying "The retail price for video games went up by $10." And I responded by pointing out you are wrong when you remember what games used to cost only 15 years ago and then when you account for inflation (which is a concept you still don't seem to be grasping). If you only started gaming with a PS1 or PS2 I can understand why you have this concept that games went up in price, but if you played practically anything else you'd know that's not the case.

Also, reproduction has absolutely nothing to do with inflation. Why do you keep mentioning it?
#40darkstar4221Posted 4/30/2013 5:13:20 PM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]