Is the wiiU weak?

#11DiscostewSMPosted 10/23/2013 9:20:02 AM
guttertalk posted...
There's a difference between "weak" and "weaker."

The Wii U uses a RISC architecture which is capable of a lot, but the PowerPC is an old design, which Nintendo tried to compensate some for.

One reason several ports look bad is that the 360 and even PS3 had a design based on brute forcing instructions through the pipelines. The Wii U can actually handle more instructions more efficiently, but that requires a significant reworking of the game code.

Likewise, the Jaguar has its own set of problems, but the X1 and PS4 are going to rely on a lot of cores to take care of those problems. The Wii U is weaker, but it's not "3 cores vs 8 cores" weaker. That's a simplification that's not as bad as comparing clock speeds but somewhat similar.


PowerPC is an old design, but x86 is even older. As far as cores are concerned, very few games have been able to make use of more than 3 cores without some major diminishing returns because they can't split up the processing sections into equal parts. Heck, there are a lot that are still reliant on 2 cores for maximum efficiency.
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#12guttertalkPosted 10/23/2013 9:56:48 AM
DiscostewSM posted...
guttertalk posted...
There's a difference between "weak" and "weaker."

The Wii U uses a RISC architecture which is capable of a lot, but the PowerPC is an old design, which Nintendo tried to compensate some for.

One reason several ports look bad is that the 360 and even PS3 had a design based on brute forcing instructions through the pipelines. The Wii U can actually handle more instructions more efficiently, but that requires a significant reworking of the game code.

Likewise, the Jaguar has its own set of problems, but the X1 and PS4 are going to rely on a lot of cores to take care of those problems. The Wii U is weaker, but it's not "3 cores vs 8 cores" weaker. That's a simplification that's not as bad as comparing clock speeds but somewhat similar.


PowerPC is an old design, but x86 is even older. As far as cores are concerned, very few games have been able to make use of more than 3 cores without some major diminishing returns because they can't split up the processing sections into equal parts. Heck, there are a lot that are still reliant on 2 cores for maximum efficiency.


I'm going to nit: PowerPC 7xx is a specific design of RISC that's not had much of a roadmap for a while. Saying that x86 is an old design is a bit misleading since the A4-5000 SoC design is a bit removed and different from the Pentium Pro x86. There are newer RISC and x86 designs.

But the A4-5000 is a *mobile* processor. TechRadar has a good write-up of the issues with it as a gaming processor: http://www.techradar.com/us/reviews/pc-mac/pc-components/processors/amd-a4-5000-apu-1153738/review

I agree that anyone thinking games will use all 8 cores is assuming a LOT. Sony announced that their party chat supports 8 people. Folks think that's not going to take some threads and processing?

But that doesn't mean the Wii U is almost as powerful as the PS4. It's not. But I think many are exaggerating the difference.
#13vectorman5Posted 10/23/2013 10:04:15 AM
The inferior ports are more the fault of lazy or (more likely) underfunded dev teams than the WiiU itself.
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#14Baha05Posted 10/23/2013 10:16:12 AM
Weak in comparison to the PS4/X1, stronger then the PS3/360. Ports are a matter of optimizing a game to run on the new hardware which some devs don't put as much effort.
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#15lightningbugxPosted 10/23/2013 10:45:52 AM
DiscostewSM posted...


PowerPC is an old design, but x86 is even older. As far as cores are concerned, very few games have been able to make use of more than 3 cores without some major diminishing returns because they can't split up the processing sections into equal parts. Heck, there are a lot that are still reliant on 2 cores for maximum efficiency.


PowerPC was designed in the mid 90s and went through changes.
x86 was designed in the 70s specifically for cheap, low-power processors for the hobbyist and cheap market. And in order to maintain backwards compatibility, its semantics can never change, but its instruction library can be appended.

In the design of the CPU it takes many clock cycles to perform one operation. Pipeline design allows multiple operations to simultaneously exist, 1 on each stage. With all of this, the 4 stage CPU in the Wii U has over 1 GHz clock rate. If the CPU gets a statement that requires the pipeline to always be flushed out, its minimum effective clock rate is a little over 250 MHz. Meanwhile, the Jaguar CPU is 14 stage with 6 of them handling the x86 part. If every operation flushed it out operating at 1.6 Ghz, it will run around 114.3 MHz.

The Wii U has the most advanced CPU among both the PS3/X360 era and the PS4/XB1 era. If Sony and MS were smart, they should have requested a new x86 type CPU but designed with a more optimal instruction set.
#16pearl arowanaPosted 10/23/2013 5:43:35 PM
Here is some comparison sheet

GPU

PS4 AMD Radeon Graphics Core Next engine w/ 1152 shaders
XBxone 853 MHz AMD Radeon GPU w/ 768 shaders
WiiU AMD "Latte" 550 MHz GPU w/ 320 shaders

PS4 1.8 terrarflops
XBone 1.3 terraflops
WiiU 0.3 terraflops

CPU

PS4 - 8 Core CPU x86
XBone 8 Core CPU x86
WiiU Tri Core Power PC

RAM

PS4 8GB GDDR5
XBone 8GB DDR3
WiiU 2GB DDR3


no bluray
no dvd
no audio cd support
no ethernet port
no massive storage
no big ram
no fast cpu
no fast gpu
no cross game chat
no multi touch
no unified account
no 3.0 usb
no region free
no third party
full price rehashes and hd ports
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#17Wii_TruthPosted 10/23/2013 5:48:33 PM
I hear the Wii U is not weak. It can bench about 300 pounds.
#18stevieb1234567Posted 10/23/2013 7:52:32 PM
avigeant83 posted...
Need For Speed, Splinter Cell, Deus Ex all look better on the Wii U than the 360/PS3 and it will just improve. It's weak compared to the xbone and PS4 but it's not that drastic as most will think.


No n4s rivals coming to wii u
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