uh. Wind Waker kinda isn't very good... (to me)

#1UncleGrubbyPosted 6/6/2014 9:05:20 PM
I love 2D Zelda. Link to the Past, Link's Awakening, Link Between Worlds - all games I thoroughly enjoyed. But I don't really like the 3D Zeldas nor do I think they are very good. Too much fluff and cutscenes and talking, finicky controls, back tracking, annoying camera, slow animations and so on. I tried to like Ocarina, got about halfway and bailed. Same with Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword. The one I never played, though, was Wind Waker. I love the look of the game, especially this HD version, and I thought maybe this would be the 3D Zelda that worked for me. It doesn't. I just finished Dragon Roost Cavern and I'm already losing steam. The game is just... annoying to play.

Can anyone explain what it is about the 3D Zeldas that really puts me off? Ok, I mean I guess I just did but I wonder what you all think. Do you feel the same? The 2D games are just so snappy, expertly designed and enchanting. The 3D ones... they just feel slow, bloated and loose and become really dull. I really want to like Wind Waker but I just don't.
#2NovaLevossidaPosted 6/6/2014 9:08:31 PM
s...l...o...w... t...e...x...t... s...p...e...e...d...

That really drags down the pacing. Pacing in general is a problem with them. There's a lot more filler content than meaningful content compared to the old 2D games. If you can't add more dungeons and want to make filler content, just make it optional sidequests, you know? Nothing kills pacing like mandatory filler content and that slow text speed.
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#3IokuaPosted 6/6/2014 9:08:53 PM
You are the only person I've ever heard gripe about the controls being "finicky", or having slow animations, or about having too many cutscenes and talking. It sounds like you're expecting the games to be stuck in the past, and to feel antiquated. If you're so hung up on the 2D games and have such ridiculous complaints then perhaps you should stick with said 2D games. Play A Link Between Worlds on the 3DS, I expect you'll enjoy it.
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#4UncleGrubby(Topic Creator)Posted 6/6/2014 9:12:50 PM
Iokua posted...
You are the only person I've ever heard gripe about the controls being "finicky", or having slow animations, or about having too many cutscenes and talking. It sounds like you're expecting the games to be stuck in the past, and to feel antiquated. If you're so hung up on the 2D games and have such ridiculous complaints then perhaps you should stick with said 2D games. Play A Link Between Worlds on the 3DS, I expect you'll enjoy it.


Yeah, I did. It was awesome. It was way better than any of the 3D titles. Wind Waker DOES have clunky controls by comparison. I was just using the Grappling Hook and it was such a chore. Also, accidentally climbing up ledges you bump against, swinging the camera to see enemies, accidentally falling off bridges and ledges... ugh.
#5DorotimusWitikPosted 6/6/2014 9:12:58 PM
Well, they are necessarily slower paced games. Everything in a 2D dungeon is generally pretty tight... hallways typically tend to be 2-3 Links across and rooms are maybe 12 x 12 Links long. In a 3D Zelda game, that's enough for maybe one small area in a room... and all those extra Links to travel adds up to quite a different rate of pacing. Some people enjoy it because it means there is usually more to take in visually, but for someone looking for a concise gameplay experience, it can be a bit of a turn-off. And there's no question that it's easier to think about puzzles when you are looking at them from a bird's eye view than when you are looking at little pieces of them from a first person perspective.

Basically, the 3D Zeldas are more immersive... and there's a cost for that. Most people don't mind the price, but you apparently do.
#6UncleGrubby(Topic Creator)Posted 6/6/2014 9:15:10 PM
DorotimusWitik posted...
Well, they are necessarily slower paced games. Everything in a 2D dungeon is generally pretty tight... hallways typically tend to be 2-3 Links across and rooms are maybe 12 x 12 Links long. In a 3D Zelda game, that's enough for maybe one small area in a room... and all those extra Links to travel adds up to quite a different rate of pacing. Some people enjoy it because it means there is usually more to take in visually, but for someone looking for a concise gameplay experience, it can be a bit of a turn-off. And there's no question that it's easier to think about puzzles when you are looking at them from a bird's eye view than when you are looking at little pieces of them from a first person perspective.

Basically, the 3D Zeldas are more immersive... and there's a cost for that. Most people don't mind the price, but you apparently do.


Way too much story and talking, too. Just slap a sword in Link's hand and send him off! It's not Shakespeare!
#7DorotimusWitikPosted 6/6/2014 9:17:24 PM(edited)
That isn't something intrinsic and isolated to 3D Zelda though. It started carrying over to 2D Zelda starting with... I think Minish Cap. And really, it's been the trend for the games to just plain get wordier over time. There's no question that LTTP was wordier than the original and that OoT was wordier than that... and that Twilight Princess was much worse in that regard than OoT.
#8Bomber_RocketPosted 6/6/2014 9:20:07 PM
UncleGrubby posted...
DorotimusWitik posted...
Well, they are necessarily slower paced games. Everything in a 2D dungeon is generally pretty tight... hallways typically tend to be 2-3 Links across and rooms are maybe 12 x 12 Links long. In a 3D Zelda game, that's enough for maybe one small area in a room... and all those extra Links to travel adds up to quite a different rate of pacing. Some people enjoy it because it means there is usually more to take in visually, but for someone looking for a concise gameplay experience, it can be a bit of a turn-off. And there's no question that it's easier to think about puzzles when you are looking at them from a bird's eye view than when you are looking at little pieces of them from a first person perspective.

Basically, the 3D Zeldas are more immersive... and there's a cost for that. Most people don't mind the price, but you apparently do.


Way too much story and talking, too. Just slap a sword in Link's hand and send him off! It's not Shakespeare!


What? Zelda is based around the story. If you don't like plot heavy series Zelda isn't for you
#9DorotimusWitikPosted 6/6/2014 9:22:53 PM
Bomber_Rocket posted...
UncleGrubby posted...
DorotimusWitik posted...
Well, they are necessarily slower paced games. Everything in a 2D dungeon is generally pretty tight... hallways typically tend to be 2-3 Links across and rooms are maybe 12 x 12 Links long. In a 3D Zelda game, that's enough for maybe one small area in a room... and all those extra Links to travel adds up to quite a different rate of pacing. Some people enjoy it because it means there is usually more to take in visually, but for someone looking for a concise gameplay experience, it can be a bit of a turn-off. And there's no question that it's easier to think about puzzles when you are looking at them from a bird's eye view than when you are looking at little pieces of them from a first person perspective.

Basically, the 3D Zeldas are more immersive... and there's a cost for that. Most people don't mind the price, but you apparently do.


Way too much story and talking, too. Just slap a sword in Link's hand and send him off! It's not Shakespeare!


What? Zelda is based around the story. If you don't like plot heavy series Zelda isn't for you


have you ever played Legend of Zelda? If you have, you should realize what you are saying is only situationally true.
#10UncleGrubby(Topic Creator)Posted 6/6/2014 9:25:46 PM(edited)
DorotimusWitik posted...
That isn't something intrinsic and isolated to 3D Zelda though. It started carrying over to 2D Zelda starting with... I think Minish Cap. And really, it's been the trend for the games to just plain get wordier over time. There's no question that LTTP was wordier than the original and that OoT was wordier than that... and that Twilight Princess was much worse in that regard than OoT.


Too many words for such silliness. I just want to play. And don't get me wrong, I play and enjoy (certain) wordy RPGs. It just doesn't work for Zelda. Zelda is more like an action-adventure game and it really needs a less-is-more simplicity when it comes to the story. And Twilight Princess was by far my least favorite Zelda game. What a somber bore. My favorite is Link's Awakening. So delightfully weird! It would be wonderful if they used the ALBW engine and assets to do a remake with controls that weren't limited by 2 buttons. If they can do it for the Pokemon GBA games they can do it for Link's Awakening!