Here's why the Wii U has second place on lock this gen.

#31CoolioKDudePosted 7/23/2014 5:59:43 AM
VanderZoo posted...
That's nonsense. 3rd party games do and will sell XB1. They're a bigger selling point for PS4 this gen, but XB1 will still get a lot of sales from them.

It outsold Wii U last month, despite Wii U having Mario Kart 8 and being $100 cheaper. And all XB1 had last month was 3rd party games.


and you know... a $100 dollar price cut that put it's price on par with the PS4... not like anyone was waiting for that though amirite? also in the US yes, the X1 outsold the Wii U but it's a well known fact the the X1 is selling like crap everywhere else in the world(like way worse than the Wii U) so it's quite possible that the Wii U outsold it worldwide we don't have actual numbers but we do know that Wii U software shot up like 450% in June so that's a petty good picture of how the system is selling.
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#32EoinPosted 7/23/2014 6:31:59 AM
Arucaurd posted...
If the XB1's sales of systems from multiplats have been undermined severely by Sony, which they have, they must rely heavily on first titles to beat Nintendo.

See, now you are finally starting to express the bare beginnings of the argument that you wanted to make ("Wii U has second place on lock"). You are still, however, oversimplifying the reality. It is not just a matter of first party games and third party games. I've already mentioned just some of the other things that matter.

Arucaurd posted...
Nintendo has a vastly superior first party/exclusive lineup than the XB1.

This is purely subjective. Some people will agree with you. Some people will agree that Nintendo's first party library is better but disagree with you saying it's "vastly superior". Others will just outright disagree. Presenting this as objective fact is silly.

Arucaurd posted...
Mario titles alone from the last gen sold more that the entirety of the XB360's first party lineup combined.

So?

This isn't last generation. Mario titles aren't selling like that this generation. NSMB, 3D World and Mario Kart 8 have all sold very well, but clearly none of them have pushed the Wii U into the kind of territory that makes it impossible for the Xbox One to catch. If "Mario titles alone" were going to ensure second place for the Wii U this generation, then they'd already have done so.

Arucaurd posted...
Nintendo also has several big things ready for the holidays, and if they perform well this season, it's going to be hard to make a case for XB1 going forward.

The "several big things" that Nintendo has ready for the holidays don't seem to be much different from games that we've already seen not helping out the GameCube that much, plus some toys. Can you say for sure that Smash will do much more than MK8 (as in, sell lots of software but only provide a moderate hardware sales bump)? If you think it will, why? Where's your reasoning?

Your argument originally was that the Xbox One was going to lose to the Wii U because the Xbox One was losing to the PS4 in an area where the Wii U lost to the PS4 even more badly. Now you've improved that, giving areas where the Wii U really might have advantages over the Xbox One, but you're downplaying what the Xbox One has and overplaying the Wii U's advantages - giving historical reasons that no longer apply, or simply declaring a subjective preference to be objective fact.

I also think it's a bit strange that you're ignoring the one clear, unambiguous advantage that the Wii U definitely does have - Japan. Wii U in Japan aren't really good, but are likely to be around 10 times the level of Xbox One sales (perhaps more). Japanese sales may make up a small difference elsewhere.
#33VanderZooPosted 7/23/2014 6:54:22 AM
Wii U just doesn't have enough games to sustain sales. It got Mario Kart 8, which is either going to be the biggest or second biggest seller Wii U ever gets. Next is Smash Bros, but then what?

Zelda isn't as big a seller as people think it is. So what else does Wii U have? It's only got Mario Kart and Smash to drive sales in any substantial way, Nintendo doesn't have any bigger 1st party titles and they have no 3rd party to rely on.

Meanwhile, XB1 will get Halo, Gears of War, Arkham Knight, The Witcher 3, Dragon Age, Assassin's Creed, Mortal Kombat X, Evolve, Destiny, MGS V, COD: Advanced Warfare, Fary Cry 4, sports games, the next GTA, Fallout etcetcetc.

These games will probably drive PS4 sales more than XB1, but they will still sell XB1 units.

Wii U simply doesn't have enough games to compete. It's the same issue with GC and N64, there just weren't enough games outside of Nintendo's 1st party.

I remember back in the 5th gen, I loved the N64, and whenever I asked a person why they preferred PS1 over N64, the answer was ALWAYS the same; "PS has more games".

Same issue, Wii U gets less games, it will get less sales. It's really that simple.
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#34RobJ24Posted 7/23/2014 7:03:07 AM
PS4 and Xbox One are more entertainment boxes than they are gaming consoles, and the home equivalent to mobile phones when compared to the Wii U, previous home consoles, and handheld consoles (alot of people call mobile phones handheld gaming consoles, while there's nothing wrong with casual gaming on phones, but like PS4 and Xbox One, they're not dedicated gaming consoles) Even the "games" aren't really games like they are on Wii U and previous consoles, PS4 and Xbox One "games" are more like either interactive movies or simulators. They both also have indie games but so do phones and computers (Windows, Mac, and Linux) so I don't know why the Wii U is always being compared to the PS4 and Xbox One. PS4 and Wii U are selling for different reasons (hype for PS4 and games for Wii U) though both are outselling Xbox One which doesn't have neither hype or games.
#35BahamutBBobPosted 7/23/2014 7:06:12 AM
VanderZoo posted...
That's nonsense. 3rd party games do and will sell XB1. They're a bigger selling point for PS4 this gen, but XB1 will still get a lot of sales from them.


This. Most of the CoD fanboys will likely still be Xbots. Plus the dudebro third party exclusives.

I know I'll pick up an X1 for Crackdown, but that's because Crackdown and Crackdown 2 were some of my favorite games last gen. I already have a PS4 and Wii U.
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#36vermilion99Posted 7/23/2014 7:09:02 AM
This topic makes no sense.

The 360 and PS3 shared many of the same 3rd party titles and both sold, what, 70-80 mil worldwide. There is definitely a market there for those brands. The WiiU on the other hand is back to being a console mainly for Nintendo fans. It doesn't have the motion controls that captured the worlds attention for a few years and made the Wii a secondary console and a console that casuals would buy. Instead it's back to a normal controller and franchises that will sell to the hardcore Nintendo fan base like the GCN did. Problem is, the U has much worse 3rd Party support than the GCN did. The original Xbox outsold the GameCube by a small margin even with Nintendos offerings and decent 3rd party support. Why would u think the WiiU will stay ahead of the One with Nintendos offerings and no 3rd party support?
#37Arucaurd(Topic Creator)Posted 7/23/2014 7:10:50 AM
Eoin
This is purely subjective. Some people will agree with you. Some people will agree that Nintendo's first party library is better but disagree with you saying it's "vastly superior". Others will just outright disagree. Presenting this as objective fact is silly.


I'm not talking from a subjective point though, I'm using sales numbers, which are hard data. A spinoff of the Mario franchise outsold two generations of Halo sales with just two games.

This isn't last generation. Mario titles aren't selling like that this generation. NSMB, 3D World and Mario Kart 8 have all sold very well, but clearly none of them have pushed the Wii U into the kind of territory that makes it impossible for the Xbox One to catch. If "Mario titles alone" were going to ensure second place for the Wii U this generation, then they'd already have done so.


They are still selling better than the XB1's titles and Wii U is still currently selling at #2 weekly. It's still too early to show for certain with absolute numbers, but it isn't trending well for XB1 seeing how poor its software sales are.

Your argument originally was that the Xbox One was going to lose to the Wii U because the Xbox One was losing to the PS4 in an area where the Wii U lost to the PS4 even more badly. Now you've improved that, giving areas where the Wii U really might have advantages over the Xbox One, but you're downplaying what the Xbox One has and overplaying the Wii U's advantages - giving historical reasons that no longer apply, or simply declaring a subjective preference to be objective fact.


Yeah but it's always painfully obvious that third parties have never been a big part of the Nintendo game plan, so even if the Wii U is completely cut out of the third party market, it's not as big a blow to them, because they're focusing on first parties which is unaffected. Almost the entirety of the XB1's "major" releases are multiplats, and Sony is taking an ever growing share of that market. They only have 2 real killer apps.

Historical reasons can show trends that aren't easily bucked.
#38VanderZooPosted 7/23/2014 7:11:53 AM
RobJ24 posted...
PS4 and Xbox One are more entertainment boxes than they are gaming consoles, and the home equivalent to mobile phones when compared to the Wii U, previous home consoles, and handheld consoles (alot of people call mobile phones handheld gaming consoles, while there's nothing wrong with casual gaming on phones, but like PS4 and Xbox One, they're not dedicated gaming consoles) Even the "games" aren't really games like they are on Wii U and previous consoles, PS4 and Xbox One "games" are more like either interactive movies or simulators. They both also have indie games but so do phones and computers (Windows, Mac, and Linux) so I don't know why the Wii U is always being compared to the PS4 and Xbox One. PS4 and Wii U are selling for different reasons (hype for PS4 and games for Wii U) though both are outselling Xbox One which doesn't have neither hype or games.


No that's not correct. PS4 is as much if not more of a dedicated gaming console than the Wii U and XB1. Sony focused exclusively on PS4 as a gaming console, no gimmick's. It has better graphics than the Wii U, better online, a more developer friendly architecture and a controller more gamers are comfortable with. Just because it also does multimedia better doesn't mean it's less of a gaming machine.

And you say it's more of an entertainment unit and less of a gaming console than past consoles, but the PS3 was a better multimedia machine than the PS4 in many way, so that's wrong as well.

Nintendo tried another gimmick with the gamepad, MS did try to make the Xbox One more of an entertainment console, hence all the talk originally about TV and sports.

And PS4 isn't selling on hype, that's an excuse Nintendo and MS fanboys like to use because they refuse to admit PS4 is a better gaming machine.

If PS4 were selling on hype, we'd see PS4 hardware selling well, but games not. But week after week, almost without fail, PS4 games are at the top of the sales chart. So it's weird to say PS4 has no games or isn't selling based on games, when PS4 games are selling so well.
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#39GeminiX7Posted 7/23/2014 7:15:12 AM
The WiiU is just barely beating the X1, which doesn't have any of its major first party or third party titles out, with one of its best selling series, Mario Kart. And you honestly the WiiU has "second place on lock"? Are you really that daft or is this a joke topic?
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#40sonicsonicPosted 7/23/2014 7:19:34 AM(edited)
vermilion99 posted...
This topic makes no sense.

The 360 and PS3 shared many of the same 3rd party titles and both sold, what, 70-80 mil worldwide. There is definitely a market there for those brands. The WiiU on the other hand is back to being a console mainly for Nintendo fans. It doesn't have the motion controls that captured the worlds attention for a few years and made the Wii a secondary console and a console that casuals would buy. Instead it's back to a normal controller and franchises that will sell to the hardcore Nintendo fan base like the GCN did. Problem is, the U has much worse 3rd Party support than the GCN did. The original Xbox outsold the GameCube by a small margin even with Nintendos offerings and decent 3rd party support. Why would u think the WiiU will stay ahead of the One with Nintendos offerings and no 3rd party support?


True, the PS3 and 360 sharing a lot of 3rd party titles and the 360 still selling well cannot be denied. However, you can't turn a blind eye to the fact that the 360 was released first, the PS3 was awfully priced and now this gen the PS4 is priced competitively and Microsoft have had to release a SKU dropping Kinect.

Sony dropped the ball last gen, they picked it back up if you are comparing PS4 to X1.
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