Ninja Gaiden 3: Razor's Edge

Phandral posted...

With this game facing an imminent release on PS3/360, I find my interest in it building up again. However I recalled just how much of a disappointment vanilla NG3 was and now I'm curious if one of my biggest gripes has been resolved, that being Izuna Drop spam being the only viable solution to dealing with 90% of the enemies.

I read another thread where someone griped that there is input reading and annoyingly evasive enemies and that has left me rather concerned that there are only one or two sure ways to kill an enemy with each weapon, and that news is very disconcerting.

Can anyone confirm or deny this and/or provide more details?

Well here in RE most enemies except those lower grade soldiers will evade your izuna drop. They are programmed to recognize YX or >X (ST or >T in PS3) sequence. Once u input that X, they jump away. Especially, the Bird Fiends. Most ground attacks in Ultimate Ninja, they jump back and fly kick you. I use Momiji in UN 4 trial, and the most safe attack for me is run and spam UT. Otherwise, they took too much damage on me >.<

Phandral posted...

With this game facing an imminent release on PS3/360, I find my interest in it building up again. However I recalled just how much of a disappointment vanilla NG3 was and now I'm curious if one of my biggest gripes has been resolved, that being Izuna Drop spam being the only viable solution to dealing with 90% of the enemies.

I read another thread where someone griped that there is input reading and annoyingly evasive enemies and that has left me rather concerned that there are only one or two sure ways to kill an enemy with each weapon, and that news is very disconcerting.

Can anyone confirm or deny this and/or provide more details?

I put the important parts IN ALL CAPS LIKE THIS, because this post is tl;dr for most.


Alot has changed, you need to get out of the NG3 mindset and more into the NG2 (not NGS2) mindset.

I've been testing out the NG3:RE A.I. against the NG2 (360) A.I. for academic reasons. I still am, so my opinion could change.

Is the NG3:RE A.I as phenomenal as the NG2(360) A.I.? NO

With that being said: It isnt the trash NG3 was.

I cant be 100% positive but pretty certain THE GAME DOES NOT INPUT READ.. What it does do that makes people suspect to input reading is: an algorithm that assess the inputs you have entered to make an educated guess of what you'll enter next.

{NG3:RE A.I.example:
when you get in close proximity to an enemy and you like to input YX a logical guess for defense would be you are going to try and launch me,
if XY fails i notice you like to throw shirukens then a 360 X,
if a certian enemy is around you wont 360X, you will most likely Y}

you cant repeat alot, safe moves are expected. enemy switching back and forth/constantly seems vital.

Again I want to re-iterate these are my conclusions and not set-in-stone source code facts.

the longest pattern (on UN2) i've been able to get away with was with the lunar. Below is the pattern.

* means a split second hesitation is required or a no hesitation enemy switch

Multiple enemies recommended:
fish with YY*Y*

YYYX*YY->YY*Y->Y->XX*YXYYX or hold X (after the last *) instead of YXYYX(izuna drop)

RebornLS posted...

I cant be 100% positive but pretty certain THE GAME DOES NOT INPUT READ.. What it does do that makes people suspect to input reading is: an algorithm that assess the inputs you have entered to make an educated guess of what you'll enter next.

I recognize your conclusions are still in the hypothetical stage so are not to be considered at this point etched in stone. IMO and experience there is some aspect of input reading in the game. Admittedly, I haven't played the game below UN difficulty in a stretch, so it could be my perspective on certain salient points of combat is askew, but there is an aspect to the combat where many of the assailants directly respond to the player's button pushes with behavior they wouldn't attempt otherwise.

For instance, there is one strategy to the combat I call "Goading Throws," in which the player by use of correct timing and button presses at a certain point it will cause certain of the less powerful targets to attempt a "red glow" throw (RGT) which then will allow an evasive player start a SoB chain (or OT in the case of the LS.)

This is not to be confused with the Grip of Murder sequences in which the whole point is to chain SoB retaliations, in those cases several of the weaker attackers will most often automatically try for RGTs regardless of player input.

If I die and replay a particular gauntlet where I was goading throws but this time not try to force one, then the same attackers will not try for a RGT, would this not then be proof of some form of input read?

Again, perhaps I misunderstand your detailed and well-considered observations and if so then my apologies ninja brother.
---
Ganbatte-yo! Ikken hissatsu!!!
Dojo for the Lazy Ninja: http://www.youtube.com/user/M0ANINR0NIN?feature=mhw5

BurningFlareX posted...

thettunhan posted...

Phandral posted...

With this game facing an imminent release on PS3/360, I find my interest in it building up again. However I recalled just how much of a disappointment vanilla NG3 was and now I'm curious if one of my biggest gripes has been resolved, that being Izuna Drop spam being the only viable solution to dealing with 90% of the enemies.

I read another thread where someone griped that there is input reading and annoyingly evasive enemies and that has left me rather concerned that there are only one or two sure ways to kill an enemy with each weapon, and that news is very disconcerting.

Can anyone confirm or deny this and/or provide more details?

Well here in RE most enemies except those lower grade soldiers will evade your izuna drop. They are programmed to recognize YX or >X (ST or >T in PS3) sequence. Once u input that X, they jump away. Especially, the Bird Fiends. Most ground attacks in Ultimate Ninja, they jump back and fly kick you. I use Momiji in UN 4 trial, and the most safe attack for me is run and spam UT. Otherwise, they took too much damage on me >.<

Doesn't ANY Izuna work? Any of the weapons? There are like, a BUNCH of moves that lead to Izuna's on most weapons. Or do they just read those 2 launchers?

Probably some can comfirm this. I am not 100% certain. I tried Kasumi XXXXY to launch and its still random. They still dodge sometimes.