Super Smash Canon: Round 1: Fight 2: Sonic vs. Pit at Earthwalker Kingdom

#1Goshner2Posted 2/10/2013 3:47:41 PM
Read the OP before voting - Results (51 votes)
Sonic
54.9% (28 votes)
28
Pit
45.1% (23 votes)
23
This poll is now closed.
This is an idea I've had for a while. Which of the smashers would win in a tournament if they had all their powers available to them and we weren't in control of them? In other words, it's a battle based on how strong they are canonically!

Who fights whom and where they fight has been decided by randomthingychooser.com. I swear, it actually picked these fights. Some of them are amazing coincidences.

Here's how this is going to work. Each topic (like every other day or so), there will be a fight to vote on. Before voting, read the OP. I will have listed things to consider in the fight. Here are a few rules/things to expect:

1. As a default, all characters have every ability/item they have ever had in any canon game available to them unless I specify otherwise. I will almost always specify that godlike items such as the Star Rod or the completed Triforce do not count.

2. Items and abilities do not stack. For example, Link will have 99 arrows because that is the max he has ever had in any game (and, yes, Link in this tournament is a combination of all Links).

3. Any ability or item or whatever that occurs as a result of a glitch or a cheat does not count.

4. I will tell you anything relevant about their surroundings that might affect the fight in any way.

5. Any contradiction between games I will resolve (if I don't please point it out to me and I will make a ruling). For example, Yoshi will not dissolve in water.

6. Health should not be taken literally. In other words, Mario doesn't die in 3 hits. However, it should be taken into consideration for comparisons. For example, while Mario doesn't actually die in 3 hits, 3 points of health is still a much smaller amount than Link's 20 hearts. I won't specify an exact exchange rate for any character ever, but I'll let you interpret it as you wish.

7. Since there has been questions and confusion, I am reminding you here that I do not list everything that they can do/have. I am only listing things that I feel need to be said (and on occasion for humor).

So, here we go:

Sonic:
Has one Chaos Emerald with which he can use Chaos Control
Can turn into a werehog... not sure if that will help...
I think Sonic had some sort of armor and a sword or something in that Black Knight game... Sure he can summon that at will I guess. I don't really care. But if it gets destroyed, he can't summon it anymore. Unless he can. I don't know...whatever...

Pit:
I admit, I've never played a Kid Icarus game before. If there is any potential problem/contradiction or a question you want to ask, point it out and I will make a ruling. As far as I know, he can't fly forever. Whatever his maximum amount of time flying is is how long he can fly here.

Earthwalker Kingdom:
The combatants are fighting on the planet of Sauria in the far reaches of the Lylat System, in the kingdom of sentient Triceratops, Earthwalker Kingdom. For no apparently reason, the Earthwalkers are in the middle of a fight with the T-Rex army while our combatants duke it out. They should probably watch out for that lest they be eaten or crushed. They can go inside the temple in the middle, but that would be a terrible idea since there is a giant mutant T-Rex inside. I don't know how it's still alive or why it's back inside the temple. It just is.
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Deceased Prince of Popcorn of the Skyward Sword Board
"And I will never support Chrom." -Doug314
#2Goshner2(Topic Creator)Posted 2/10/2013 3:48:36 PM
Round 1:

Fight 1: Bowser vs. Mario at Hyrule Field Winner: Mario

Fight 2: Pit vs. Lucario at Mute City Race Track Winner: Pit

Fight 3: Sonic vs. Samus at Norfair Winner: Samus

Fight 4: Lucas vs. Donkey Kong at Death Mountain Winner: Lucas

Fight 5: Fox vs. Ganondorf at Fountain of Dreams Winner: Ganondorf

Fight 6: Mr. Game and Watch vs. Yoshi at Delfino Plaza Winner: Yoshi

Fight 7: Luigi vs. Snake at Shadow Moses Island Winner: Snake

Fight 8: Peach vs. Ike at DK Isle Winner: Ike

Fight 9: R.O.B. vs. Falco at Corneria City Winner: Falco

Fight 10: Captain Falcon vs. Pokemon Trainer at Onett Winner: Pokemon Trainer

Fight 11: Jigglypuff vs. Pikachu at Planet Pikmin Winner: Pikachu

Fight 12: Olimar vs. Link at Gallian Countryside Winner: Link

Fight 13: Wolf vs. Marth at Central Station Winner: Wolf

Fight 14: Ness vs. Meta Knight at Diamond City Winner: Ness

Fight 15: Ice Climbers vs. Diddy Kong at Sky World Winner: Diddy Kong

Fight 16: King Dedede vs. Zelda at Spear Pillar Winner: Zelda

Fight 17: Kirby vs. Wario at Pooptown (Animal Crossing) Winner: Kirby

Losers' FFA:

Fight 1 at Wario Woods: Winner: Sonic
Wario
Bowser
Captain Olimar
Sonic
Lucario
Marth

Fight 2 at Yoshi's Island: Winner: Meta Knight
Fox
Jigglypuff
Mr. Game & Watch
Luigi
Meta Knight
Peach

Fight 3 at Green Greens: Winner: Donkey Kong
Ice Climbers
R.O.B.
Captain Falcon
Donkey Kong
King Dedede

Round 2:

Fight 1: Wolf vs. Meta Knight at Mt. Silver Winner: Meta Knight

Fight 2: Sonic vs. Pit at Earthwalker Kingdom

Fight 3: Pokemon Trainer vs. Link inside Nova

Fight 4: Diddy Kong vs. Kirby at Windfall Island

Fight 5: Mario vs. Lucas at Bowser's Castle

Fight 6: Samus vs. Snake at New Pork City

Fight 7: Pikachu vs. Yoshi at Dragon's Gate

Fight 8: Ness vs. Zelda at Krokodile Isle

Fight 9: Falco vs. Ike at Phendrana Drifts

Fight 10: Ganondorf vs. Donkey Kong at Underworld
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Deceased Prince of Popcorn of the Skyward Sword Board
"And I will never support Chrom." -Doug314
#3ssj_duelistPosted 2/10/2013 3:51:50 PM
Sonic easily. People need to stop over rating, by leaps and bounds, Pit's power.
#4Goshner2(Topic Creator)Posted 2/10/2013 3:54:49 PM(edited)
Announcements/Comments/Questions section:

Just a reminder, the only fight you can vote on right now is the fights for Round 2. And, I don't really think the only other fight in Round 2 is going to get enough votes to make a difference.

I would also like to point out that if Pit loses this fight, we lose another character who can do extra damage to Ganondorf.
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Deceased Prince of Popcorn of the Skyward Sword Board
"And I will never support Chrom." -Doug314
#5Goshner2(Topic Creator)Posted 2/10/2013 3:54:24 PM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
#6Goshner2(Topic Creator)Posted 2/10/2013 3:55:27 PM
ssj_duelist posted...
Sonic easily. People need to stop over rating, by leaps and bounds, Pit's power.


I don't care if he is strong, never doubt the power of moving really fast.
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Deceased Prince of Popcorn of the Skyward Sword Board
"And I will never support Chrom." -Doug314
#7HejiruPosted 2/10/2013 4:17:54 PM(edited)
I admit, I've never played a Kid Icarus game before. If there is any potential problem/contradiction or a question you want to ask, point it out and I will make a ruling. As far as I know, he can't fly forever. Whatever his maximum amount of time flying is is how long he can fly here.


He can't fly at all, at least not without help. The only times he can fly are when he has the three sacred treasures or when Palutena or Viridi are giving him the ability- and when they do that it only lasts five minutes. (That's a canon thing, not just a gameplay element so it's not like taking health literally or anything.) You said no god-like items, and the three sacred treasures would probably count as that. But this fight entirely depends on whether Palutena is helping Pit or not. So I think we need to know that.
In the original game, Palutena was imprisoned and Pit rescues her at the end. In Uprising she is helping him (for most of the game, at least.) He can still fight on his own, but he can't fly at all without help.

ssj_duelist posted...
Sonic easily. People need to stop over rating, by leaps and bounds, Pit's power.


I don't think people overstate Pit's power, I think it's the fact that he has a goddess helping him most of the time. Pit on his own is pretty average as far video game heroes go.
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"The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction has to make sense." -Tom Clancy
#8lolGoshnerPosted 2/10/2013 4:19:04 PM
Hejiru posted...
I admit, I've never played a Kid Icarus game before. If there is any potential problem/contradiction or a question you want to ask, point it out and I will make a ruling. As far as I know, he can't fly forever. Whatever his maximum amount of time flying is is how long he can fly here.


He can't fly at all, at least not without help. The only times he can fly are when he has the three sacred treasures or when Palutena or Viridi are giving him the ability- and when they do that it only lasts five minutes. (That's a canon thing, not just a gameplay element so it's not like taking health literally or anything.) You said no god-like items, and the three sacred treasures would probably count as that. But this fight entirely depends on whether Palutena is helping Pit or not. So I think we need to know that.
In the original game, Palutena was imprisoned and Pit rescues her at the end. In Uprising she is helping him (for most of the game, at least.) He can still fight on his own, but he can't fly at all without help.


First of all, what do the sacred treasures do? Unless they do something like grant any wish or destroy planets or stop time, I don't count them as godlike.

Second, I would say that since she isn't actually in the fight, he could just keep getting blessed by her (unless she needs to be near him). This explanation could work, but I would prefer the sacred treasure one.
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Deceased Racist, Homophobic, Antisemitic, and Smelly Prince of Popcorn
#9HejiruPosted 2/10/2013 4:31:40 PM
lolGoshner posted...
Hejiru posted...
I admit, I've never played a Kid Icarus game before. If there is any potential problem/contradiction or a question you want to ask, point it out and I will make a ruling. As far as I know, he can't fly forever. Whatever his maximum amount of time flying is is how long he can fly here.


He can't fly at all, at least not without help. The only times he can fly are when he has the three sacred treasures or when Palutena or Viridi are giving him the ability- and when they do that it only lasts five minutes. (That's a canon thing, not just a gameplay element so it's not like taking health literally or anything.) You said no god-like items, and the three sacred treasures would probably count as that. But this fight entirely depends on whether Palutena is helping Pit or not. So I think we need to know that.
In the original game, Palutena was imprisoned and Pit rescues her at the end. In Uprising she is helping him (for most of the game, at least.) He can still fight on his own, but he can't fly at all without help.


First of all, what do the sacred treasures do? Unless they do something like grant any wish or destroy planets or stop time, I don't count them as godlike.

Second, I would say that since she isn't actually in the fight, he could just keep getting blessed by her (unless she needs to be near him). This explanation could work, but I would prefer the sacred treasure one.


Um... I don't know, the games don't make it too clear. Palutena wasn't physically near Pit in Uprising but she apparently couldn't help him in the original NES game. I'd assume that'd be because Medusa was preventing her somehow. So I think distance isn't a factor.

As for the treasures... I'm not sure if they'd be considered godlike, actually. It's basically treated as the "ultimate weapon" needed to kill Medusa. The arrows of light pierce through any enemy (except Medusa), the mirror shield protects him from being turned to stone (in addition to protecting him like any other shield) and the wings of pegasus give him unlimited flight. In Uprising, the arrows of light are the only thing that can kill Ornes, which is known for being an unkillable enemy. But they aren't insta-kill weapons in Uprising. (I'm not sure if they're insta-kill in the NES game, actually. I've never managed to get that far.)
So I guess they're probably not god-like. But Palutena is up to you. It might be against the rules for the same reason Meta Knight can't summon allies.
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"The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction has to make sense." -Tom Clancy
#10Goshner2(Topic Creator)Posted 2/10/2013 6:35:28 PM
Hejiru posted...
lolGoshner posted...
Hejiru posted...
I admit, I've never played a Kid Icarus game before. If there is any potential problem/contradiction or a question you want to ask, point it out and I will make a ruling. As far as I know, he can't fly forever. Whatever his maximum amount of time flying is is how long he can fly here.


He can't fly at all, at least not without help. The only times he can fly are when he has the three sacred treasures or when Palutena or Viridi are giving him the ability- and when they do that it only lasts five minutes. (That's a canon thing, not just a gameplay element so it's not like taking health literally or anything.) You said no god-like items, and the three sacred treasures would probably count as that. But this fight entirely depends on whether Palutena is helping Pit or not. So I think we need to know that.
In the original game, Palutena was imprisoned and Pit rescues her at the end. In Uprising she is helping him (for most of the game, at least.) He can still fight on his own, but he can't fly at all without help.


First of all, what do the sacred treasures do? Unless they do something like grant any wish or destroy planets or stop time, I don't count them as godlike.

Second, I would say that since she isn't actually in the fight, he could just keep getting blessed by her (unless she needs to be near him). This explanation could work, but I would prefer the sacred treasure one.


Um... I don't know, the games don't make it too clear. Palutena wasn't physically near Pit in Uprising but she apparently couldn't help him in the original NES game. I'd assume that'd be because Medusa was preventing her somehow. So I think distance isn't a factor.

As for the treasures... I'm not sure if they'd be considered godlike, actually. It's basically treated as the "ultimate weapon" needed to kill Medusa. The arrows of light pierce through any enemy (except Medusa), the mirror shield protects him from being turned to stone (in addition to protecting him like any other shield) and the wings of pegasus give him unlimited flight. In Uprising, the arrows of light are the only thing that can kill Ornes, which is known for being an unkillable enemy. But they aren't insta-kill weapons in Uprising. (I'm not sure if they're insta-kill in the NES game, actually. I've never managed to get that far.)
So I guess they're probably not god-like. But Palutena is up to you. It might be against the rules for the same reason Meta Knight can't summon allies.


Yeah, we are just going with the Sacred Treasures. They aren't god-like at all. So, we don't need to worry about the Palutena discussion.
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Deceased Prince of Popcorn of the Skyward Sword Board
"And I will never support Chrom." -Doug314