Honest Duping Discussion

#121Saturnine9(Topic Creator)Posted 11/13/2012 11:03:05 AM
AngryOldFeral posted...
What's essentially saying with the "don't know can't hurt" is that unless you were forced to play with everyone with the identical copies of your weapon, you wouldn't know it was a copy. If you're a non-duper, the likelihood of you dealing with multiple clones of your own weapons are pretty slim if you only play with other non-dupers (or go into super-recluse mode and refuse to even play online, like some folks) ...

I raise you this question, Saturnine: With the random loot engine designed the way it is, what makes you think that out of the 1,000,000+ people playing the game (global sales were 1.77mil according to VGChartz... how accurate that is, though, i'm not sure) don't already have "your" gun?

This game loves to recycle itself quite often if you stop to look at it. "87 bazillion guns" still becomes repetitive when the components that make up the factors of the gun's stats are limited.


To be honest, that doesn't really bother me as much as people seem to think it should. The fact that there are "x" number of identical copies of my gun out there shouldn't really worry me, especially if the chances of me ever finding them are near impossible.
The point I was trying to stress was duplication of weapons is a method that is artificially and synthetically replicating guns. Farming weapons and gear legitimately gets you said weapon and/or gear once per drop, and it's all the way it was meant to be. But replicating a gun, that falls under a whole other argument involving ethics, what you think is right or wrong, developer intentions, the list goes on and on. That's my main concern. It really doesn't bother me how the game generates weapons and the possibility of weapon replicates. But duping is something I'm primarily against, and don't support.
Also, I'm curious. Some people have suggested that Gearbox supports duping because they haven't fixed it since it was also in the first game. But what it this is their temporary fix for the poor drop rates, allowing more rare weapons to circulate?
Just a thought, just speculation. Tell me what you think it is.
#122Kpt_KapowskiPosted 11/13/2012 11:09:54 AM
Saturnine9 posted...
AngryOldFeral posted...
What's essentially saying with the "don't know can't hurt" is that unless you were forced to play with everyone with the identical copies of your weapon, you wouldn't know it was a copy. If you're a non-duper, the likelihood of you dealing with multiple clones of your own weapons are pretty slim if you only play with other non-dupers (or go into super-recluse mode and refuse to even play online, like some folks) ...

I raise you this question, Saturnine: With the random loot engine designed the way it is, what makes you think that out of the 1,000,000+ people playing the game (global sales were 1.77mil according to VGChartz... how accurate that is, though, i'm not sure) don't already have "your" gun?

This game loves to recycle itself quite often if you stop to look at it. "87 bazillion guns" still becomes repetitive when the components that make up the factors of the gun's stats are limited.


To be honest, that doesn't really bother me as much as people seem to think it should. The fact that there are "x" number of identical copies of my gun out there shouldn't really worry me, especially if the chances of me ever finding them are near impossible.
The point I was trying to stress was duplication of weapons is a method that is artificially and synthetically replicating guns. Farming weapons and gear legitimately gets you said weapon and/or gear once per drop, and it's all the way it was meant to be. But replicating a gun, that falls under a whole other argument involving ethics, what you think is right or wrong, developer intentions, the list goes on and on. That's my main concern. It really doesn't bother me how the game generates weapons and the possibility of weapon replicates. But duping is something I'm primarily against, and don't support.
Also, I'm curious. Some people have suggested that Gearbox supports duping because they haven't fixed it since it was also in the first game. But what it this is their temporary fix for the poor drop rates, allowing more rare weapons to circulate?
Just a thought, just speculation. Tell me what you think it is.


GBX doesnt support duping, no matter what people say to try to justify their cheating.
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#123SVT_MikePosted 11/13/2012 11:14:46 AM
I have farmed bosses for over a month. I have quite a few oranges and just finally got a conference call. Earned everything I got. That being said... I duped some of the stuff i already earned for my other characters and my kids characters. I enjoy farming bosses though... so still havent traded for stuff I want.. just farm.

If someone wants to dupe.. who cares.
#124Saturnine9(Topic Creator)Posted 11/13/2012 7:36:07 PM
Kpt_Kapowski posted...
Saturnine9 posted...
AngryOldFeral posted...
What's essentially saying with the "don't know can't hurt" is that unless you were forced to play with everyone with the identical copies of your weapon, you wouldn't know it was a copy. If you're a non-duper, the likelihood of you dealing with multiple clones of your own weapons are pretty slim if you only play with other non-dupers (or go into super-recluse mode and refuse to even play online, like some folks) ...

I raise you this question, Saturnine: With the random loot engine designed the way it is, what makes you think that out of the 1,000,000+ people playing the game (global sales were 1.77mil according to VGChartz... how accurate that is, though, i'm not sure) don't already have "your" gun?

This game loves to recycle itself quite often if you stop to look at it. "87 bazillion guns" still becomes repetitive when the components that make up the factors of the gun's stats are limited.


To be honest, that doesn't really bother me as much as people seem to think it should. The fact that there are "x" number of identical copies of my gun out there shouldn't really worry me, especially if the chances of me ever finding them are near impossible.
The point I was trying to stress was duplication of weapons is a method that is artificially and synthetically replicating guns. Farming weapons and gear legitimately gets you said weapon and/or gear once per drop, and it's all the way it was meant to be. But replicating a gun, that falls under a whole other argument involving ethics, what you think is right or wrong, developer intentions, the list goes on and on. That's my main concern. It really doesn't bother me how the game generates weapons and the possibility of weapon replicates. But duping is something I'm primarily against, and don't support.
Also, I'm curious. Some people have suggested that Gearbox supports duping because they haven't fixed it since it was also in the first game. But what it this is their temporary fix for the poor drop rates, allowing more rare weapons to circulate?
Just a thought, just speculation. Tell me what you think it is.


GBX doesnt support duping, no matter what people say to try to justify their cheating.


Very glad to hear it, truth be told. I'd hate to see a great gaming company like Gearbox support gamebreaking methods like this.
#125pro9b17Posted 11/13/2012 7:54:50 PM
From: Saturnine9 | #001
Hey guys, please don't take this the wrong way if you regularly dupe. Try to hear me out before you comment. Thanks.

So I just recently hit Level 50 and started regularly farming some of the notable bosses for my favorite Legendaries. Eventually I learned of the so-called "duping" method and I looked into it a little more. I was crestfallen to learn that people were getting entire inventories full of Legendary loot... Just by clicking a few buttons and dashboarding, etc.

Some people say that duping isn't ruining your gaming experience if you're not doing it or you just play invite-only. But my issue with duplicating guns is more complex than that. It saddens me that I work so hard to get honest Orange-grade guns, but in the end there is no way to prove that I got them myself. So, effectively... I might as well just hop on board and dupe just like everyone else.

Let me know your thoughts on the matter. Again, please don't hate me for my play-style. This is a game and I hope to have a conduct-worthy discussion about a certain aspect of said game.

Cheers.


You answered your own problem in your post. You are working so hard, spending countless hours to get a legendary to drop. Nobody likes doing that, and judging by the content of this post, neither do you. Gearbox f***ed up the drop rates in this game. In BL1 it was perfect. What else do you expect people to do? Gearbox did not think this through.
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#126liinnPosted 11/13/2012 7:55:18 PM
My opinion is this.

If farming feels like work to you, to a point where when others get it for free upsets you, you should stop farming. It's a game. Have fun.

I rarely farm. But I did a few sessions from time to time, even sessions where anything that might drop, I probably have it already. So, I was doing it just for kicks. People who love to farm, will farm, despite what other options are available to them.

Dup, to me, does not mean cheat. But it does make rare item kinda meaningless. That's the downside for me. For example. I rarely see any Chubbies. So, if I were to see someone using a Bunny launcher, with his reload bouncing everywhere. I'd think that's super cool, and rare. And how lucky he is, or that he must have been playing for hours on end to have that happen. But now, not so much. That's the downside. The upside, is that I can have one too.

But if you feel it's earned vs. not earned, and not thinking in terms of pros and cons of fun taken away or fun added, I guess farming is not fun for you, and maybe you should look for other fun stuff to do in this game. There're still plenty to do.
#127Saturnine9(Topic Creator)Posted 11/13/2012 8:03:48 PM
SVT_Mike posted...
I have farmed bosses for over a month. I have quite a few oranges and just finally got a conference call. Earned everything I got. That being said... I duped some of the stuff i already earned for my other characters and my kids characters. I enjoy farming bosses though... so still havent traded for stuff I want.. just farm.

If someone wants to dupe.. who cares.


I'm assuming you didn't read the other eleven pages of this thread? Not trying to be mean and I definitely don't hold it against you, it's a very long thread. But in those several pages, the question you ask of "Who cares" was explored and discussed in great depth. What I'm saying is, quite a few people care. There is more to the issue than meets the eye.
Although to be honest, in your particular case, it REALLY doesn't affect anyone else. But a lot of the time dupers don't behave as you do, which is why this thread exists.
So I don't really blame you. Dupe for your kids, that's fine with me really. If they want it, then do as you please. But if those weapons circulate outside of your kids' and your accounts, then I'll start to care.
#128JonnyJAB87Posted 11/13/2012 8:10:46 PM
Those dupers wouldn't be at the top of the leader boards if they didn't cheat. I feel affected!
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#129Saturnine9(Topic Creator)Posted 11/14/2012 12:12:41 PM
pro9b17 posted...
From: Saturnine9 | #001
Hey guys, please don't take this the wrong way if you regularly dupe. Try to hear me out before you comment. Thanks.

So I just recently hit Level 50 and started regularly farming some of the notable bosses for my favorite Legendaries. Eventually I learned of the so-called "duping" method and I looked into it a little more. I was crestfallen to learn that people were getting entire inventories full of Legendary loot... Just by clicking a few buttons and dashboarding, etc.

Some people say that duping isn't ruining your gaming experience if you're not doing it or you just play invite-only. But my issue with duplicating guns is more complex than that. It saddens me that I work so hard to get honest Orange-grade guns, but in the end there is no way to prove that I got them myself. So, effectively... I might as well just hop on board and dupe just like everyone else.

Let me know your thoughts on the matter. Again, please don't hate me for my play-style. This is a game and I hope to have a conduct-worthy discussion about a certain aspect of said game.

Cheers.


You answered your own problem in your post. You are working so hard, spending countless hours to get a legendary to drop. Nobody likes doing that, and judging by the content of this post, neither do you. Gearbox f***ed up the drop rates in this game. In BL1 it was perfect. What else do you expect people to do? Gearbox did not think this through.


The grind is only worth the payoff. Some people say that you should enjoy the game and if you don't you shouldn't play, but that's a ridiculous notion. No, I don't really enjoy hours of farming if there are no rewards in the end and if my efforts bear no fruits. But that's mostly because I never have friends to farm with me and I do like the challenge to a certain reasonable extent. So I go both ways, sort of...
But they really did screw these drop rates up, big time. Terramorphous, for example, was (intended) to be a 15 minute long raid boss for four player co-op. Even when I farm him and it takes ten seconds to kill him with OP gear, he still has yet to drop a Legendary other than the regular class mods after 50 farming runs. That's plain stupid.
However, I still think that we shouldn't resort to duping just because bosses are harder to farm. Get a party, get some great gear (cough BEE AND CC cough) and just farm and try having some fun, spicing it up here and there with different weapons and approaches if you can. Chat while you farm, talk about things, do SOMETHING for Christ sake. Duping should really be your absolute last resort and the last thing on your mind. Try not to be so quick to resort to duping.
#130Saturnine9(Topic Creator)Posted 11/14/2012 2:42:54 PM
liinn posted...
My opinion is this.

If farming feels like work to you, to a point where when others get it for free upsets you, you should stop farming. It's a game. Have fun.

I rarely farm. But I did a few sessions from time to time, even sessions where anything that might drop, I probably have it already. So, I was doing it just for kicks. People who love to farm, will farm, despite what other options are available to them.

Dup, to me, does not mean cheat. But it does make rare item kinda meaningless. That's the downside for me. For example. I rarely see any Chubbies. So, if I were to see someone using a Bunny launcher, with his reload bouncing everywhere. I'd think that's super cool, and rare. And how lucky he is, or that he must have been playing for hours on end to have that happen. But now, not so much. That's the downside. The upside, is that I can have one too.

But if you feel it's earned vs. not earned, and not thinking in terms of pros and cons of fun taken away or fun added, I guess farming is not fun for you, and maybe you should look for other fun stuff to do in this game. There're still plenty to do.


Of course it feels like work, but like all great things in life (making it philosophical, like a boss) what comes from the hard toils are great treasures. It's a lot of fun to farm for weapons and finally obtain them, it also adds more playability for me. I see no reason to stop farming a boss just because I don't appreciate people duping weapons. Maybe I didn't understand that last point you made but that's what I got from it.