Is Maya's skill Thoughtlock any good?

#11atomicbreathPosted 1/4/2013 10:42:54 AM
Does suspension increase the time an enemy is TLed?
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#12Aqua69696Posted 1/4/2013 11:30:55 AM
One of my main problems with it is the enemy seems to have a short "changing" animation, where he kinda shakes his head. It wastes a lot of the time, especially if you get the sequence perk.
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#13I have no namePosted 1/4/2013 11:39:59 AM
Thoughtlock a suicide psycho for example, converge pulls every other one near it (and probably a badass, too). They all immediately blow themselves up, and/or drop all their grenades

This exact same thing can be pulled off simply by chucking grenade at an enemy's feet and converging them right before it goes off. I've done it countless times with a MIRV and a group of bandits. EXP Loaders can be converged and shot for the same effect.
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#14ZarnonElchrisPosted 1/4/2013 12:51:31 PM
atomicbreath posted...
Does suspension increase the time an enemy is TLed?


Yes. Anything that modifies or relys on Phaselock works the exact same way with Thoughtlock. They are for all intents and purposes, the same thing.
#15eacaraxePosted 1/4/2013 1:19:10 PM
I have no name posted...
This exact same thing can be pulled off simply by chucking grenade at an enemy's feet and converging them right before it goes off. I've done it countless times with a MIRV and a group of bandits. EXP Loaders can be converged and shot for the same effect.


...and your point to this is what, exactly? If we're talking about only clustering enemies together and blowing them away, you don't even need Maya for that. Any schmuck with a slag singularity grenade and a rocket launcher can do that. Of course, at the end of that if there's a badass in the cluster they're still alive, and mighty angry at you.

Where thoughtlock shines here is that badass is now either fighting on your side, drawing fire from what else is around, or standing around peacefully waiting to be headshot. And, taking a crapload of fire damage if a helios subsequence jumped around more than once or twice.
#16BiggyDXPosted 1/4/2013 6:34:53 PM
I think if the ability came with a damage/damage reduction buff as well as high aggro it would make a very good skill. But as it is, it would be the last gamechanger I would ever pick.
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#17capnovanPosted 1/4/2013 8:46:39 PM(edited)
isn't it true that while an enemy is thoughtlocked, you cannot hurt him? EDIT: you CAN hurt them while TL'ed.

EDIT: Ok I tried the build posted by eacaraxe and here's what I noticed.

There's a pause from the time you cast TL till the time TL'ed enemy draws aggro (1-2secs?) that's pretty poor and almost negates the +4 second duration TL provides

It seemed Converge didn't work 100% of the time (it sure seemed the enemies were close enough for Converge to work)

Having TL'ed enemy die and have Sub-Sequence kick in and cause another TL+Converge+Helios (in my case 3 successive times) was pretty ******* cool

My Verdict: Better than Scorn but not quite as good as Ruin. My first attempt using TL was uninspiring and had a poor opinion of it. This time using eacaraxe's build (which was different than the one I used previously) I liked it better, but not enough to give up Ruin for.
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#18kiwimyweeweePosted 1/4/2013 8:40:12 PM
capnovan posted...
isn't it true that while an enemy is thoughtlocked, you cannot hurt him?


No
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#19eacaraxePosted 1/4/2013 9:52:16 PM
capnovan posted...
My Verdict: Better than Scorn but not quite as good as Ruin. My first attempt using TL was uninspiring and had a poor opinion of it. This time using eacaraxe's build (which was different than the one I used previously) I liked it better, but not enough to give up Ruin for.


A couple quick notes about that build:

It's a sniper build, intended for use with a chrono binder mod for 10/5 or 11/5 suspension and 10/5 or 9/5 helios, to offset that brief delay. Using an amp shield also helps push up Maya's sniper damage, what with not having too many sniping skills that put it into the stratosphere. You also want to fight at the longest ranges possible, since you're very much a glass cannon set up that way.

It works best with a Maliwan slag sniper -- any will do, since it's not your damage vehicle -- and a fire/corrosive sniper for use against bandits/loaders, or a jakobs. It's a simple 1-2 punch -- slag a group of enemies (since you have converge, it's simple with Maliwan snipers' elemental cloud effect) then switch weapons for the kill.

If you don't feel like juggling weapon types for elemental effects, here's a "pure" sniper build that uses Wreck since with subsequence you're guaranteed 100% phaselock uptime:

http://talent.87bazillion.com/2/siren.php?055001545150054000000500000000

This one works very well with a Vladof sniper, since wreck (and other associated skills) pushes your fire rate into the stratosphere, and a scheming cat mod (since it buffs wreck, and other skills that you max). That also gives you the option of equipping SMG's for emergency situations.
#20havok718Posted 1/4/2013 10:31:55 PM
Change the tides of battle? A beefed up phaselock already does that. And I'd like to use my phaselock more often, not less.