It finally hit me why I like the P4 cast so much more then the P3 cast. *spoiler

#11Birth_By_SorrowPosted 12/6/2012 6:53:33 AM
Birth_By_Sorrow posted...
Sorry, the P4 cast deals with it in a much "less" mature manor whilst exhibiting some mature aspects (such as self acceptance) is what I should have said.


"Mitsuru" not "Mitsuo" gosh. I need my head examined. : /
#12ArtiRockPosted 12/6/2012 7:14:15 AM
Birth_By_Sorrow posted...
Sorry, the P4 cast deals with it in a much "less" mature manor whilst exhibiting some mature aspects (such as self acceptance) is what I should have said.


I believe the problem is that their problem is essentially over once they have their dungeon finished. It is why Teddie is a better developed character than the rest of them, because his problems are acknowledged during the plot so he actually grows as a character. Does he change? Not really (which is good), but he does come to a bit of a resolution over the course of the story. The problem with the other main characters is that their problems are handled in the social links, so they do not actually get acknowledgement in the main plot. So they don't actually truly get a resolution. Their problems just fall off the face of the planet in terms of the main plot.

However, the P4 cast does spend more time with one another. So they do feel like friends. Yukiko and Chie already were friends. The cast from P3 came together because of circumstances. While the same can be said for P4, it's not in the same boat. Naoto and Kanji are the only ones I can see not hanging out with our protagonist.
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This is the duty of the Grim Angels.
#13your_mom1Posted 12/6/2012 7:14:38 AM
First of all, Persona 3 was too serious IMO, and it interfered with the characterization. I didn't take the Shinjiro/Ken part very seriously because it was so overdramatic and cliche. Plus, people below 12 hardly ever commit crimes, especially murder. They just haven't grown enough to even consider those options yet. I would have been happy if Ken just didn't exist, because even his VA was annoying.

Also, the characters themselves were cliche. My example for this is Junpei vs Yosuke . Junpei was stereotypical comedy relief creeper guy that always gets made fun of, and although he evolves from that, he veers off into being too serious for the sake of drama. TBH I actually liked where his character went in The Answer, but it took a whole game of him being cliche and stereotypical to get there. Yosuke kind of filled the comic-relief role for P4, such as the bike scenes at the beginning, but he actually felt like he had substance from the beginning. In other words, his character was more dynamic. And really, P3 had a more serious tone overall. Sure they had their trips, but even at the end of the beach trip, they learn about Yukari's father. The game just had a different tone, whereas P4 was casual outside of the mystery.
#14ArtiRockPosted 12/6/2012 7:22:16 AM
your_mom1 posted...
First of all, Persona 3 was too serious IMO, and it interfered with the characterization. I didn't take the Shinjiro/Ken part very seriously because it was so overdramatic and cliche. Plus, people below 12 hardly ever commit crimes, especially murder. They just haven't grown enough to even consider those options yet. I would have been happy if Ken just didn't exist, because even his VA was annoying.

Also, the characters themselves were cliche. My example for this is Junpei vs Yosuke . Junpei was stereotypical comedy relief creeper guy that always gets made fun of, and although he evolves from that, he veers off into being too serious for the sake of drama. TBH I actually liked where his character went in The Answer, but it took a whole game of him being cliche and stereotypical to get there. Yosuke kind of filled the comic-relief role for P4, such as the bike scenes at the beginning, but he actually felt like he had substance from the beginning. In other words, his character was more dynamic. And really, P3 had a more serious tone overall. Sure they had their trips, but even at the end of the beach trip, they learn about Yukari's father. The game just had a different tone, whereas P4 was casual outside of the mystery.


All of the characters are cliche. The fact that P4 was casual outside of the mystery bothers me more than P3 actually. You'd think that these characters that were almost killed would take it more seriously.
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This is the duty of the Grim Angels.
#15your_mom1Posted 12/6/2012 7:25:39 AM
ArtiRock posted...
Birth_By_Sorrow posted...
Sorry, the P4 cast deals with it in a much "less" mature manor whilst exhibiting some mature aspects (such as self acceptance) is what I should have said.


I believe the problem is that their problem is essentially over once they have their dungeon finished. It is why Teddie is a better developed character than the rest of them, because his problems are acknowledged during the plot so he actually grows as a character. Does he change? Not really (which is good), but he does come to a bit of a resolution over the course of the story. The problem with the other main characters is that their problems are handled in the social links, so they do not actually get acknowledgement in the main plot. So they don't actually truly get a resolution. Their problems just fall off the face of the planet in terms of the main plot.

However, the P4 cast does spend more time with one another. So they do feel like friends. Yukiko and Chie already were friends. The cast from P3 came together because of circumstances. While the same can be said for P4, it's not in the same boat. Naoto and Kanji are the only ones I can see not hanging out with our protagonist.

I agree that Teddy's was integrated into the story well, but they can't do that for everyone. How would you interweave Yukiko and Kanji's slinks into the story? And even if you could, it would get cluttered. Persona 3 had half of them in social links (girls, but they had some development in the story) and half in-story (dudes). I didn't like that because social links give a better way to understand the character because they don't have to interweive it into the story. Junpei's slink in P3P really helped to flesh out his character. Same with Adachi in P4G, but less so, since I really didn't get much from his slink...
#16redhawks401Posted 12/6/2012 7:31:13 AM
i honestly dont know where this is heading anymore, i posted here to answer the topic creators statement about the p3 cast not "hanging out" im assuming like regulars teenagers do, and then i went on to tell him why the p3 cast couldnt just "hang out" like the p4 cast could, and then these two guys come out of nowhere to bash on me and saying how the p4 cast is more "less" mature in some ways but more mature in others, which is crap btw p3 cast is logically more mature because they went throught harder stuff and had to deal with more tragic stuff than the p4 cast, oh and sorry i realized i didnt explained myself with mature-emo thing so let me get that out of the way: the feel of p3 is emo while the story line, plot, and character are more mature while the feel of p4 is more hipster and D2E and the characters deal with your average teenage issues.

onto other things, the guy who said that mitsuru and yukari were dealing with the same issue is an idiot, just because they both lost their fathers doesnt mean its the same issue, there is HUGE difference in their situation (i wont spoil it for those who havent played the game, and im including you since you obviously didnt pay enough attention)

oh and be glad that you have such strong friends, but just because your friends deal with things the way they do doesnt mean that thats the average concensus for teenage responsive behavior towards major issues in their lives, on a serious note, and tell your friend with the alcoholic mom to keep going forward and to not let it get him down.

PS: now a days cliches are not consideered poor writting anymore since technically everything in the media is cliche now a days specially in video games, so stop criticising things based on how cliche they, judge on how they twist said cliches to make the story interesting and unique, which is something both p3 and p4 did masterfully
#17thompsontalker7Posted 12/6/2012 7:32:17 AM
I felt that the P3 characters became friends in a stronger way than in Persona 4. In P4, they just reach out to people and become friends with them either by rescuing them from the TV or meeting them in school like with Chie, Yukiko, and Yosuke. Minato took a group of mutual acquaintances and turned them into not necessarily best buds, but rather people that could rely on each other.

This makes the social links more powerful in a sense, since (especially in the FEMC's case) you're bringing SEES together though them.

Too bad this isn't fully covered in the game, with the exception of Yukari and Mitsuru, who truly showed progress. Everyone was too busy grieving in The Answer to realize that they had each other, but by the end of The Answer, you could tell they finally realized that.
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Not removing this until Dr. Dre's Detox album is out. Start:11/22/08
"you being a sad little social misfit weirdo is a fantasy of mine lol"- thedan11
#18ArtiRockPosted 12/6/2012 7:34:42 AM
I agree that Teddy's was integrated into the story well, but they can't do that for everyone. How would you interweave Yukiko and Kanji's slinks into the story? And even if you could, it would get cluttered. Persona 3 had half of them in social links (girls, but they had some development in the story) and half in-story (dudes). I didn't like that because social links give a better way to understand the character because they don't have to interweive it into the story. Junpei's slink in P3P really helped to flesh out his character. Same with Adachi in P4G, but less so, since I really didn't get much from his slink...

That is the thing though, they need to be somehow, because otherwise you do not really get to know the characters. The friendship you have with them is a base one at best. Yukiko could simply be resolved by having her talk to her parents about it. Your character does not need to be present to resolve her issues. The same goes for Kanji. Simply talking through it makes it easier. Kanji wants acceptance, and he gets that from the protagonist and company. He does not have much to his character, so it already is incorporated. That's just how simple his character is. The only problem is that you never really talk to his mother about this, as Kanji's mother was worried about this as well. The other ones do not matter in the least. Their social links are: I have a problem, and now I don't. Which does not even matter, because their initial problem does not get solved. I feel like S.Links do not work well with party members too much. Unless it is something that they are doing on the side. Like say, Fuuka.
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This is the duty of the Grim Angels.
#19kratoscar2008Posted 12/6/2012 7:39:07 AM
P4 characters relationship is rushed for me, they just meet and bang they are BFF. P3 relatioship between SEES its more realistic as theirs has its upsides and downs. P2 well the whole cast has had their problems but they are very close like in P4 but its more worked there.

P4 cast had it easier since they didnt had a looming treath to worry about, the P3 cast actually developed their friendship during the game unlike the P4 cast that relatiosnhip was developed at the momment they met.

P3 cast is better overall.
#20thompsontalker7Posted 12/6/2012 7:40:52 AM
Let's not forget that they managed to develop friendships while being the only ones worrying about the Dark Hour/The Fall.

In Persona 4 everyone knew about the murders, so the reassurance of the police let the Investigation Team breathe a bit.
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Not removing this until Dr. Dre's Detox album is out. Start:11/22/08
"you being a sad little social misfit weirdo is a fantasy of mine lol"- thedan11