Lemme introduce you to an awesome show and Kanji/Naoto's awesomeness

#21Inertion5Posted 1/27/2013 9:39:54 AM
Rogue_Thoughts posted...
I don't get why people think Kanji's gay. No one thinks Yukiko is desperate for a boyfriend or wants to date Chie, Rise is an exhibitionist, or Naoto wants a a sex change, so why does everyone harp on Kanji's shadow? He's said himself that he only thought that he might be gay because he doesn't like to be around girls, because every girl has made fun of his hobbies.

If he was gay? Cool. Desperately labeling him as "gay" when he's clearly not? Not cool.

People think Kanji is gay cause everyone is so set on "accepting" these last few years.

People think better of themselves if they accept people for who they are, which is fine.
But when there's someone with a possibility of being gay they immediately jump to that conclusion without a second thought. If someone disagrees they tell them they're in denial and aren't accepting of people.
It just proves how people can't think for themselves and are incredibly easy to mold with forced opinions, media and whatnot.
#22CrimsonmistPosted 1/27/2013 10:00:19 AM
I think the TC should feel terrible for ever showing anyone an episode of Extra Credits.

Thanks for poisoning minds with pretentious drivel structured in the format of college lecture notes filled with various inaccuracies throughout its run (as well as wonderful awkward moments such as the "game addiction" episodes), wherein not only is it preached about how seriously game should be taken as a medium, as an artform to the point that "fun" (albeit according to them the traditional definition is what is considered rather than the concept as a whole but I still find it suspect) is essentially secondary because "games are evolving", all the while refusing to abandon the schtick of chipmunk voices and hiring artists (of whiched they have recently whored out different ones almost every other week) to draw stick figures and pull images from from various sources via a google search.

I understand that this is only for the purposes of bringing up P4 with Kanji and Naoto and that I am complaining almost exclusively for the sake of complaining. But I think you should feel more shame than I do for this (for no other reason that my own dislike of the show and bits of irrationality).
I might make this my sig...
#23Paradox_Knight(Topic Creator)Posted 1/27/2013 1:13:39 PM
You know this isn't some amateur show right? These are actually professionals of the industry. One works in the gaming industry and as a teacher/consultor, another worked and I believe still does with Pixar.

I feel no shame. These are good thought exercises and are good for broadening your horizons. There's nothing to prevent games from being what they've always been, but there's a lot of space for games to become more and they've been doing that for the past few years.

Just because you decide you're too alienated by certain ideas or fear that this is what becomes the whole of gaming when it clearly won't is not my problem. It's yours.

Also, it's far more interesting to see the people desperately trying to argue that Kanji isn't gay then those who just accept that he might have homosexual or bisexual tendencies.

Why? Because one group has just shrugged it. Went "Kanji can like guys if he wants, I'm cool with that" and others are going "NO! Kanji is NOT gay because I BELIEVE he's not gay and I'll pull everything I can to SHOW YOU GUYS that he's TOTALLY not gay! Why? Because people just accepting that he might like guys bothers me for some reason!"

Man. You guys just can't relax and enjoy a show or what? They're here to speak their piece and they encourage discussions and debates about the subject they touch on, why go on hating about something like that? About a show that wants you to become more educated about games, the world and to openly participate in arguing and debating your piece if you disagree with them?

What're you? A misguided elitist without the substance to back that attitude? And yes. I know I'm acting in a relatively unkind manner of which I'd use a stronger word but that'd get censored. It's part of the goal. Sometimes you need to take a stronger stance for your point to get across while simultaneously serving a bit of a slap in the face because some people don't learn otherwise, despite how it subconsciously superimposes the image of an antagonist unto myself and risks my word becoming colored by the target of this text.

Though I will also note. I'm making this more general since if one person speaks this way, others probably think the same and it's best to just address them all at once.
Made on 18/03/2012 due to recent games
We need a reclassification: DLC is Downloadable Content. DUK is Downloadable Unlock Key for locked on disc content.
#24Mana_RunighaPosted 1/27/2013 1:20:37 PM
Paradox_Knight posted...
It's pretty damn downright simple.

Kanji got a crush unto Naoto during the period when he thought Naoto was a guy. When Naoto was then revealed to be a girl, he still had emotions towards her. It would seem that the gender barrier doesn't really affect Kanji when it comes to determining who he's attracted to.

This would indicate Kanji would be closer to being Bisexual.

Additionally, during the "Up Close and Personal" mission. Kanji reacts with more interest to having Yosuke pressed up against him then he does towards the idea of hitting on women, this might be more due to his slow nature to catching unto things but it certainly shows that he does hold certain interest towards the same gender.

The better question I have to ask is:

Why do people keep on insisting that he has no interest in the male gender when he clearly shows such interest? Are they just afraid that a character they like happens to have a bisexual or homosexual orientation? Do they not want a character who has that trait to their person? Are they just really homophobic about the whole issue and are hiding away behind some made-believed idea of theirs that they're just saying that their interpretation of the events are more accurate or just deciding to shield themselves with the idea that if it is their opinion then it must be true rather then face the actual truth that's shown pretty damn clearly to them?

Basically. Why aim for the "Kanji is straight, not gay" option when there's a clear "Kanji is bisexual" option, which would be closer to an actual possibility for Kanji, as Kanji being purely straight is pretty much a non-option.

This video was made before P4G which toyed with Kanji's ambiguous sexuality more than vanilla. Also, people think the shadows are Freudian when they are actually Jungian, hence why Naoto and Kanji get these interpretations.

I'm of the Kanji is bisexual, but mostly prefers girls camp.
#25SolKarellenPosted 1/27/2013 1:35:33 PM
It bothers me because there's actually no specific scene implying that he's ACTUALLY homosexual. All that's there is his Shadow, which I see as a representation of how Kanji thanks he's perceived by others after the rumors about his sexuality started spreading. Kanji wants to be accepted as a guy who likes to sew, and not be ridiculed for something people think he is based upon stupid rumors. It's still an aesop about homosexuality--don't label someone as "gay" based upon ridiculous criterion, and accept them if they are. Having a feminine hobby like sewing is not a requirement of being gay, nor does it instantly make you gay.

Shadows are highly amplified versions of their inadequacies, but don't, per se, actually represent their feelings. Does Rise really want to strip in front of everyone? No! That's what she thinks people only want from her "false" stage persona (Hehe). Was Yukiko really pulling an operation babe hunt of her own? No! It was displaying how Yukiko lacked the ability to make her own decisions and latched onto others--her "princes".
"There'd come a time when life'd pull us apart. S'not a reason to avoid people."
#26Inertion5Posted 1/27/2013 1:46:20 PM
Paradox_Knight posted...
Also, it's far more interesting to see the people desperately trying to argue that Kanji isn't gay then those who just accept that he might have homosexual or bisexual tendencies.

My point stands. You're desperately trying to make a character gay even if it's never implied.
We say he's not gay cause there's no evidence. His shadow doesn't mean he likes men. Rise's shadow doesn't mean she's a stripper. I'll just stop with the shadow talk since everyone mentions it but you all just ignore it.

Kanji might be bi, okay, but not because of his shadow. Kanji is just as gay/bi as Dojima and Daisuke and whoever else.
#27CrimsonmistPosted 1/27/2013 2:29:14 PM(edited)
Paradox_Knight posted...
You know this isn't some amateur show right? These are actually professionals of the industry. One works in the gaming industry and as a teacher/consultor, another worked and I believe still does with Pixar.

I'm aware of their professions, however I've no respect for James or any instructor at Digipen (who also is part of "Rainmaker games" which as far as I know has made nothing notable that puts into practice what the show preaches and acts as a consulting company as far as I can tell), an institution that trains future game designers in schools of thought so inadequate that teaching a player how to play a game through gameplay and visual cues alone INSTEAD of tutorials is such a foreign concept that their minds are blown when it takes an arrogant loud mouthed animator who likes Megaman X to blow their mind (Egoraptor...).

And this is something Extra Credits HAS spoken on,and I realize that as soon as his students go to other classes or out to actually work on games he has no degree of control on what they do or are forced to do, I just find it very awkward that there could be even ONE professor like him at that institution that brings fresh faces to big development houses to teach this fundemental rule of teaching a player how to play a game, that I still am seeing tutorial screens. Made even worse that he is head of a company that consults on games (none of which I can find them credited mind so I cannot truly comment on how well his employees are handled in this regard but if I were to make assumptions i'd be in the negative). But really this is more my hatred for particular games than him, I just feel perhaps he isn't as influential or relevant or correct as any could imagine or imply by him BEING INVOLVED IN THE GAMES INDUSTRY as brought up.

And of course how could I forget Daniel. An animator for Pixar, one of many. But this isn't his show, no, as the show is written by James all of this are his self masturbatory thoughts put into text as if ready to teach a class of people, written in such a way that the assumption must be that said class apparently have the mental capacity of a small bird.

Don't get me wrong, every once in a while they have a good idea on a subject to speak on, they must because even though I lack respect for them they reached where they have for a reason, that just doesn't mean that EVERY THING they have to say is valid just because they have involvement (and I am very loose with that saying) and it can't be when they claim to research games they love but make such simple mistakes in their own research: such as claiming the Courier from Fallout New Vegas has amnesia (which according to J.E. Sawyer is not the case) in their episode on Amnesia in games.

So what if comes down to is as I mentioned in my prior post; irrational hatred. But beyond that I feel that there is a change EC is hypocritical, it has DEFINITELY flubbed research on a few occasions which would be forgivable if such a flub wasn't a big part of an episode and if the show wasn't presented in the manner that it is: something to teach me. I believe this has always been a horrible show. One with potential, one that can be so much more than it is. But as far as I have seen it is not.
I might make this my sig...
#28Paradox_Knight(Topic Creator)Posted 1/27/2013 2:24:57 PM
Alright. I can get behind what you say now.

I don't mind people hating on a show if they've got some good reasons behind it. I still enjoy it and as I say repeatedly, I tend to dive often into thought experiments. I tackle something seriously but I don't latch unto it seriously, if that makes any sense. I draw what I can from any debate or arguments I have and take what I feel is worth taking towards advancing myself, whether it's from my opposition or from what I myself thought up as the debate draws on, I regard being on the side of failing logic and reasoning as a teaching tool if that helps to make it clearer.

And I'm drifting off the subject... In any case. I've got a cup of coffee to go make for myself.
Made on 18/03/2012 due to recent games
We need a reclassification: DLC is Downloadable Content. DUK is Downloadable Unlock Key for locked on disc content.