Time for Lunatic, Pairing/Team comp advice

#11endgamecutter(Topic Creator)Posted 8/18/2013 9:42:51 PM
Flame552 posted...
*snip*


p.1: I think I prefer Sully X Donnel for my purposes. Sully already has Myrmidon, so with Donnel and can get a G-Force VV tank...or something else, depending on what I eventually decide my units are going to be

p.2: Donnel is confirmed in use. I honestly have no idea what to do with Brady, though. I mean, he can't VV tank, so he's either a skirmisher or a support. I feel like support is the better option, but since I've heard nothing but praise for him, I get the impression that he's better off frontlining. am I reading too much into that?

p.3 Already using it. They hit B rank support in my first file, and I found the supports pretty amusing, so I'm happy with this set on both a min/max and a story level.

p.4: I'm liking the sound of no NTR (I have no idea how anyone can possibly find NTR appealing in any way) and I've heard nothing but good thigns about Virion supports. But I'm not sure he really offers Severa anything. I mean, all of the breakers is kinda funny and to be fair would probably let Severa just dodgetank all the things forever, but it would kill her offence to do so. Plus it means I have to put up with an Archer, and I just don't like archers (well, RD Shinon was kinda fun because he just crit everything, but thats RNG)

p.5: I'm liking this idea. Saves me having to put up with the boring Stahl x Cord support that I already have mostly done, saves me having to bring Fred along, and as always, <3 Wyverns. If I can justify Virion/find another good husband for Cord, I'm sold on this Besides, I'm pretty sure this is flat out better for Gerome, who's auto in the final party because <3 wyverns

p.6: I assume Gerome is meant to be Gregor? In either case, sicne this file IS based around min/maxing, I'd like to maximize VV tanks, and BLOOD AND THUNDER can get G-Force VV, while Laurent can only get VV, so Tharja's stuck with the candyman.

P.7: I'd probably like the support and all, but Nah's the one child I'm pretty sure I'm going to not use. Besides, if I marry Nowi, then Morgan has pointy elf ears, and then I'd have to immediately delete the savefile lest it permanently taint my 3DS because seriously? !@#$ elves.

Also classes. I've been meaning to ask, why are Sages considered superior to Sorcerers? is 2 Speed/magic really worth that much? I'm under the impression that accuracy is never much of a concern, and Waste is 10MT vs Gale's 4MT. Even with Forges, doesn't Waste more than make up for the lower mag cap?
#12Misha-HeartPosted 8/18/2013 10:01:41 PM
endgamecutter posted...
p.1: I think I prefer Sully X Donnel for my purposes. Sully already has Myrmidon, so with Donnel and can get a G-Force VV tank...or something else, depending on what I eventually decide my units are going to be

p.2: Donnel is confirmed in use. I honestly have no idea what to do with Brady, though. I mean, he can't VV tank, so he's either a skirmisher or a support. I feel like support is the better option, but since I've heard nothing but praise for him, I get the impression that he's better off frontlining. am I reading too much into that?

p.3 Already using it. They hit B rank support in my first file, and I found the supports pretty amusing, so I'm happy with this set on both a min/max and a story level.

p.4: I'm liking the sound of no NTR (I have no idea how anyone can possibly find NTR appealing in any way) and I've heard nothing but good thigns about Virion supports. But I'm not sure he really offers Severa anything. I mean, all of the breakers is kinda funny and to be fair would probably let Severa just dodgetank all the things forever, but it would kill her offence to do so. Plus it means I have to put up with an Archer, and I just don't like archers (well, RD Shinon was kinda fun because he just crit everything, but thats RNG)

p.5: I'm liking this idea. Saves me having to put up with the boring Stahl x Cord support that I already have mostly done, saves me having to bring Fred along, and as always, <3 Wyverns. If I can justify Virion/find another good husband for Cord, I'm sold on this Besides, I'm pretty sure this is flat out better for Gerome, who's auto in the final party because <3 wyverns

p.6: I assume Gerome is meant to be Gregor? In either case, sicne this file IS based around min/maxing, I'd like to maximize VV tanks, and BLOOD AND THUNDER can get G-Force VV, while Laurent can only get VV, so Tharja's stuck with the candyman.

P.7: I'd probably like the support and all, but Nah's the one child I'm pretty sure I'm going to not use. Besides, if I marry Nowi, then Morgan has pointy elf ears, and then I'd have to immediately delete the savefile lest it permanently taint my 3DS because seriously? !@#$ elves.

Also classes. I've been meaning to ask, why are Sages considered superior to Sorcerers? is 2 Speed/magic really worth that much? I'm under the impression that accuracy is never much of a concern, and Waste is 10MT vs Gale's 4MT. Even with Forges, doesn't Waste more than make up for the lower mag cap?

Stahl x Cordelia and Frederick x Cherche are more optimal since they give their children everything they need. You could try Lon'qu x Cordelia, since Severa really only needs Vantage.

Virion generally should never breed since he has a terrible class set. People only suggest Cordelia x Virion to make Severa look like a Vocaloid character, which isn't worth that much. You can also get all Breakers with Lon'qu and more.

Brady's really fine with anyone as his father, since he gets enough skills on his own to make a good set.

Morgan's sprite will never change, much to annoyance to every player, no matter who you marry. She'll just have Nowi's hair color and Manakete clothing(another thing that turns people off).

Sages are better Vantage tanks than Sorcerers solely for the slightly higher Magic stat.
---
Yuri/Shoujo-Ai is the purest love. No questions asked.
Oh Poor soul who has lost their love, I will make your heart race once more!
#13Flame552Posted 8/19/2013 5:31:52 AM
Misha-Heart posted...
endgamecutter posted...


*snipped for space*

Also classes. I've been meaning to ask, why are Sages considered superior to Sorcerers? is 2 Speed/magic really worth that much? I'm under the impression that accuracy is never much of a concern, and Waste is 10MT vs Gale's 4MT. Even with Forges, doesn't Waste more than make up for the lower mag cap?

Stahl x Cordelia and Frederick x Cherche are more optimal since they give their children everything they need. You could try Lon'qu x Cordelia, since Severa really only needs Vantage.

Virion generally should never breed since he has a terrible class set. People only suggest Cordelia x Virion to make Severa look like a Vocaloid character, which isn't worth that much. You can also get all Breakers with Lon'qu and more.

Brady's really fine with anyone as his father, since he gets enough skills on his own to make a good set.

Morgan's sprite will never change, much to annoyance to every player, no matter who you marry. She'll just have Nowi's hair color and Manakete clothing(another thing that turns people off).

Sages are better Vantage tanks than Sorcerers solely for the slightly higher Magic stat.


I should probably mention that, along with you not wanting to use Nah, you still have Panne, Lissa, and Miriel to decide on.

If I recall, the typical "defense god morgan" is a Morgan beget by a +Def MU and a Kellam!Nah, if you want the typically considered best 3rd gen Morgan. (Or atleast, the best 3rd gen Morgan I've read about from a male MU)

While it's true you get "more" with Lon'qu x Cordelia, you have to remember that this is a min/max file. A character can only equip five skills at a time.

Between Limit Breaker, Tome Breaker, Sol, Armshift, and Galeforce, my Hero!Severa (and Cordelia) literally just need to stand there and kill everything with infinite-uses Brave Swords and Regalia-Ranged Axes during the enemies play phase. Like I said before, Severa gets everything she needs from her mom.

It sounds like you're thinking of Miriel X Gregor.

I also like Fredrick X Panne. Vaike X Panne with quite underwhelming during my first playthrough, and Yarne has the puzzling distinction of being the only character who does NOT get passed down a genderless class (wyvern rider) that the mother knows.
With Fredrick, Yarne gets the Wyvern Rider class path he should already of had, some great things from Fredrick, and can be made into another general-flier support if you want, like Gerome.

Owain...I like Lissa X Lon'qu, the classic "Princess and the Body Guard" pairing. His character is somewhat weird unless you give him access to swords, so given his stats, I wanted to make sure he had access to Trickster. With the DLC, Dread Fighter was pretty much made for him. Some people complain that Lon'qu!Owain has too much overlap in classes, and this is true but rather irrelevant.

Owain is a galeforce inheritable male child. This means he should have Galeforce, he should have the two Dread Figher skills, he should end up with Limit Breaker, and that leaves only one skill slot to be taken up with Vantage, a healing skill (Renewal), or anything else.

You're on your own for Brady. You're using all the people I've used, I don't like Ricken, and Libra's supports with the mother were boring. That...leaves Vaike, I think.

Also, two last things:
1) The most optimal pairing in this game is MUxAnyone. (Assuming you didn't do something weird, like +STR -MAG and then want to make a magical morgan.)
2) Sages are better VVTanks both for having a better magic stat cap AND for having lower defense. Lower Defense --> Increased Vengeance damage, and easier chance of getting below 50% health for Vantage.
#14endgamecutter(Topic Creator)Posted 8/19/2013 9:00:19 AM(edited)
Alright, here's my current leanings then

Olivia!Lucina, Paladin Skirmisher, Support
Paladin for mobility and her highest possible offense (I think, Great knight has higher str, but weaker pair bonus'). Skills: Dual Strike, Dual Guard, Galeforce, Luna, Limit Break

Vaike!Brady, Berserker, Support.
highest offense once again Skills: Dual Guard, Galeforce, Aggressor, Limit Break, Luna

Henry!Cynthia, Dark Flyer, Skirmisher
Extreme mobility from flying pony, also strong offense Skills: Galeforce, Luna, Limit Break, Tomefaire ?

Lon'Qu!Severa, Sorcerer, VV tank
as a tank, she needs 1-2 range brave to help deal with counters, and this saves her from bow vulnerability. Skills: Vantage, Vengeance, Limit Break, Galeforce, Luna

Donnel!Kjelle, ?, ?
No idea what to do here. Probably a Skirmisher Support, since she can't use magic and is therefore preferred with a physical brave.

Gaius!Noire, Dark Flyer, Skirmisher
I'm kinda sad I'm losing Class diversity here but hey, Flyers gonna fly. Plus she has a higher Mag cap than Severa. ?, ? Luna, Galeforce, Limit Break

Gregor!Laurent, Sage, VV Tank
yay, a VV tank without Sorcerer! Skills: Vantage, Vengeance, Armsthrift, Aggressor, Limit Break

???!Morgan, Bride, Rallybot
okay, HEAR ME OUT HERE. She is the only character I have with access to Rally Heart AND Spectrum, making her the best possible Rallybot I have, unless I marry a 1st gen, which weakens Morgan. Unless anyone else has a better idea, of course. Skills: Rally Heart, Spectrum, Magic, Speed, Bond

Libra!Owain, Dread Fighter, VV tank
Dread Fighter so he can keep his twitching sword hand (although I was tempted to cut it off and call him Jaime) other than that, tank on you crazy overhyped cowboy. Skills Vantage, Vengeance, Galeforce, Limit Break, Aggressor

Stahl!Gerome, Wyvern Lord, Support
Wyverns, and a new hopefully less boring support. that is all. Skills: Aggessor, Luna, Limit Break, Dual Guard, Dual Support

That's about as far as I've gotten, how badly am I screwing up?
#15Flame552Posted 8/19/2013 10:59:02 AM
Morgan has the most potential out of any character in the game and as such delegating her to "Rallybot" status hurt to read.

All spotpass and DLC characters (barring the spotpass six) have access to every class their gender can become, like MU, Morgan, and MU's other child if he marries someone who has one.

Ergo, any female spotpass or DLC character can get access to Rally Heart and Rally Spectrum and some of the DLC characters were made with "Rallybot" in mind, coming with almost all rally skills including Rally Strength, which is male exclusive.

-So please, don't do that to Morgan.

-You have Laurent as a Sage but beyond that, you appear to have no healers.
-You might find the other Dread Fighter skill, +10 Resistance, to be worthwhile.

-With regards to your Severa, I don't believe Vengeance and Luna stack.
-A Hero Virion!Severa with a regalia throwing axe and bowbreaker does the same thing. Beating a dead horse, I know, but seeing her as anything other then a hero just looks odd to me.
-I'm not sure what you want out of your Gerome. The Gerome I described was a way to maximize his mobility and support status. I'd probably switch Aggressor for Movement +1 as I believe Gerome needs to be the one attacking for Aggressor to work.

-You're also missing Nah and Yarne, though I guess it could just be you don't like stone users. (Which is a shame and a half, cause if you don't like Nowi, there's always Tiki, and Panne destroys everything).
-Also, don't forget that you get a Chrom!Inigo out of all this too.

-It is a bit odd that you were so adamant about Sully x Donnel, but you aren't quite sure what to do with Kjelle. Still, with the Myrmidon, Knight, Cavalier, Wyvern Rider, Mercenary, Pegasus Knight, Bride, and Troubadour class paths it's not like Kjelle is wanting for choices of classes OR skills.

We all have our different styles, but something I try to have on everyone is an offensive skill and a healing skill for self-sufficiency.

Typically, Luna is the vest offensive skill unless you're going for VV...or you have a particular Morgan pairing.
Due to their attack range, stone benefits, and high stat caps Dragons are probably the best users of Ignis, which is the Grandmaster offensive skill.

As for healing, if nothing else there is:
Renewal; a guaranteed 30% heal when your turn starts.
Lifetaker; 50% health back when you defeat a unit you attack. Best healing move on a galeforce user.
Sol; Heals half the damage you make on the enemy. Benefits from a high activation rate and being able to active during either phase.
Aether; Luna and Sol, in a single attack. Great skill that should be used by any character that learns it.


All in all, if you're happy with the pairings, you should be fine with what you got there. None of the decisions are poor and even though you have little class diversity, you're aiming to maximize your usage of a game-breaking combo and it looks like you're doing that.
#16endgamecutter(Topic Creator)Posted 8/19/2013 12:57:41 PM
Oh, didn't know about the DLC/Spotpass having access to all of the classes. Morgan is saved then, and my Rallybot will be whoever looks either the most silly or has their badass reputation the most scarred by becoming a bride. I'll...figure out who that is later

for healers, bride has access to staves as well, so I figured I'd throw Morgan (now some random DLC) a fortify or two and call it a day, although if I'm VV-ing I should probably revise that. I was considering making Brady a War Monk instead of Berserker, but that really cripples his strength. The extra magic might be handy as a pairup bonus though...

Somehow I forgot I was talking about procs (I blame Tharja always vengeance-ing every move), so I suppose I'll tweak my VV-ers out of Luna and leave it with the Skirmishers. I'll also replace the Aggressors with relevant faires, since I read the skill as working as long as it's player phase (which is still technically unsynergistic since I tend to play the enemy phase more)

Nah I'm still fairly sure I'm not going to use since I can't think of a way to get her a decent ability set (also her paralogue was a pain for me because she kept dying when I tried to feed her kills so I'm biased against her) Yarne I'm just not sure what to do with. Kjelle I just don't know what to do with. I was adamant about it because I thought I had far fewer VV-ers than I actually do, so I needed to give Tharja Gaius and Donnel to SUlly to maximize Galeforce, but I suppose the two are fairly interchangeable now that I understand I have more than I need. I DO like Nowi and Tiki though, even if they're fairly useless for the way I'm probably going to go about this.

As for Severa...I don't actually know what I'm doing with her. I mean, yeah, Class diversity is something I want, but I figured I'd want my frontline if nobody else using brave weapons, and I'm worried about counter so sorc made sense. that said, it WOULD be a waste to not use the massive strength mod she gets no matter what I do... Still think she gets Lon'Qu though. Even if she's a hero, she's gonna want vantage on the front line. I suppose that leaves new pairings at

Lucina: unchanged

Brady: Class: Berserker/War Monk Skills: Axefaire, Dual Guard, Limit Break, Luna GaleForce

Cynthia: unchanged (maybe have Henry pass her Aggressor for that last slot?)

Severa: Class: Hero Skills: Vantage Vengeance Galeforce Limit Break Armsthrift

Kjelle: still no idea, thinking of Falcon Knight for Class Diversity and I suppose a Spare healer, but that sounds really stupid...

Noire: Class: Sorcerer (like mother like child, I guess, also Class Diversity makes her my one Sorc) Skills: Luna Vantage Aggressor Limit Break GaleForce

Laurent: Unchanged

Owain Unchanged

Morgan: Class: Dark Flyer (She's Morgan, she classes as she Pleases) SKills: Aggessor Luna Galeforce Limit Break Armsthrift

Gerome: unchanged

Yarne/Nah: likely unused due to roster sizes. Otherwise Yarne will be berserker and Brady will be Warmonk. Nah I'm still not sure on.
#17Flame552Posted 8/19/2013 3:20:21 PM
That's part of the reason a male MU is typically paired with Tharja or Nowi. The MU's children will have access to all classes their gender will allow and Noire and Nah are the two kids who most benefit from that. Then there's the fact that most people would rather take the two great Morgan-like characters over a single better 3rd-gen Morgan.

Brady as a War Monk is good. All you have to do is give him Bolt Axes, which are axes that hit using the magic stat and you can buy them off one of the spotpass teams, can't remember the particular girl at the moment though.

I...actually use my Gaius!Kjelle as a healing Falcon Knight. It's not what she's made to do, but it works. Considering you're using Donnel!Kjelle instead, she has some toys that makes her better for other things, namely due to the fact that Armshift doesn't work on staffs. It does, however, make her an even better candidate for General with Armshift, Sol, Prescience and a few other of the many many things she gets.

-DLC skills cannot be inherited, so Henry should be passing down something else. He has access to some male exclusive classes, so look into one of those.

-Dread Fighter is DLC and male only. If you have a male MU, you can't have a Morgan with Aggressor.

-Dragons should only reclass to get good skills, of which even Nowi gets just as much as she needs. The Manakete has great stat caps which are made even better by the stat benefits given to them from Dragonstone+'s and should always be their last class.
--Unless the idea of Dragons flying Dragons is too hilarious to pass up and you leave them as Wyvern Lords.
#18endgamecutter(Topic Creator)Posted 8/19/2013 3:43:06 PM
Bluh, I suppose it doesn't matter so much what the men pass on then because Aggressor and Axefaire are the only skills worth having that they can exclusively pass on. And the only girl who could USE that is Severa...who needs Lon'qu for vantage. That means I can worry about final skills later since they can earn all of their worthwhile final skills on their own time.

It's not so much I'm worried about how dragons are going to GET their skills, I'm just concerned about the fact that they don't seem to have anything worth the effort of obtaining. I'm pretty sure I've already sorted out all my non-stone users anyway, so I might as well stick to my guns in that regard rather than try and find out whether or not the stoners can replace anyone.

General Kjelle might work as a support, I guess. She'll give my frontline extra beefiness, although she pays the price of limited offense in doing so. Maybe assassin would be better. I just realized I still need to figure out Inigo though. I keep forgetting that guy! I blame the fact that he's the only character I haven't seen the face of yet.
#19Misha-HeartPosted 8/19/2013 4:10:05 PM
You really shouldn't do Vaike!Brady. It's the complete opposite on how you want to build him. And War Monks aren't that impressive unless you really like the way they look. Sage!Brady is so much better.

Kjelle can be a Paladin or Hero or at least something with movement. Just not General since she gets Galeforce so never stick on support.
---
Yuri/Shoujo-Ai is the purest love. No questions asked.
Oh Poor soul who has lost their love, I will make your heart race once more!
#20endgamecutter(Topic Creator)Posted 8/19/2013 4:33:26 PM
Misha-Heart posted...
You really shouldn't do Vaike!Brady. It's the complete opposite on how you want to build him. And War Monks aren't that impressive unless you really like the way they look. Sage!Brady is so much better.

Kjelle can be a Paladin or Hero or at least something with movement. Just not General since she gets Galeforce so never stick on support.


Any suggestions for a replacement on Brady then? The only one I can think of is Ricken or Lon'qu, Ricken is annoying to me and doesn't really give anything classwise, and Lon'qu is on Cord for VV. I suppose I could go Vaike!Cord and Maribelle!Lon'qu, since I probably don't need as many tanks as I already have...

As for Galeforcers not being supports, I kinda disagree. As long as I keep both halves of the pair mobile, I can just swap the galeforcer in to make the first attack and then have the non-galeforce pull the second hit, assuming they're the intended lead. Unless you mean Kjelle should lead because she's going to have better leading stats then whomever I pair her with...?