Can we have another FE Lord like Leif?

#21RJWalker243Posted 3/2/2014 5:46:04 AM
No, it is a very valid point. Geoffrey, Bastian and Lucia are supposed to be competend soldiers and strategists, Bastian especially and what the latter two were suggesting was perfectly sound military advice which our hero ignores because he's the hero. And he suffers no consequences for his actions and Bastian and Lucia are made to look like idiots.

It is a very valid complaint because Ike issues a bogus strategy and suffers no negative consequence unlike Leif's bogus strategies which come back to bite him.
#22Huff n puff 20Posted 3/2/2014 5:46:30 AM
Galwen posted...
17Master posted...
Going to save Geoffrey was on Elincia's request. Y'know, his employer?


Which was against Bastian and Lucia's advice. Who aren't sheltered princesses like Elincia was at the time.

He did what the sheltered princess wanted with no comeuppance. Ike gets to act how he wants without being shown to be all that ineffective.


While I'd be one of the first to say "Ike is a walking Deus Ex Machina"...

This bit....
Elincia is Ike's primary employer. Lucia and Bastian are not.

This means: Request from Elincia matters more than advice from Lucia/Bastian. Regardless of experience or what-have-you.
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#23Sir_BadassPosted 3/2/2014 5:47:29 AM
Ah, but if they were competent, Crimea wouldn't have gotten it's ass kicked the first time around.
#24Huff n puff 20Posted 3/2/2014 5:54:59 AM
Sir_Badass posted...
Ah, but if they were competent, Crimea wouldn't have gotten it's ass kicked the first time around.


You could be the most competent strategist in existence, and if you get outmatched, you're outmatched. Daein launched a surprise attack with huge numbers, with strong, competent soldiers. Crimea simply couldn't hold up.

Look at it like this-
Take the US/Iraq war.
Now give Iraq the best strategists in the world.
The US is still going to crush.
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#25Sir_BadassPosted 3/2/2014 5:57:48 AM
But we know that's not the case with Lucia/Bastian as we see them giving Ike and Elincia bad advice.
#26Galwen(Topic Creator)Posted 3/2/2014 6:17:16 AM(edited)
Sir_Badass posted...
That just means that Bastian and Lucia are idiots and it's a good thing Ike was in charge and not them.


Sure man, doing what a sheltered princess said over what her less sheltered and more experienced advisers said is really brilliant. And Ike getting no comeuppance for doing so really shows Ike is a characters who makes mistakes with important enough consequences.

Elincia doesn't even provide an alternate plan that details the benefits and risks. She just says to go help out Geoffrey and Co.

Yeah, I'll go with Thracia 776 and see all the screwups Leif's army did. What with how the Lord character is a sheltered prince and one of the Lord's advisers is a screwup who encourages him.
#27Huff n puff 20Posted 3/2/2014 6:20:11 AM
Galwen posted...
And Ike getting no comeuppance for doing so really shows Ike is a characters who makes mistakes with important enough consequences.


This shows something else though: that it wasn't a mistake.

Bastian is SAID to be a good tactician, but never... shows it.

The closest thing to it was FE10 part 2.
But he and Elincia both come up with the same solution to that problem, but his gets a lot of Crimeans killed. [The solution: Get Ike. The difference? Elincia went to get Ike the moment things went sour. He wasn't there because Bastian wanted to lure out all the dissenters. THANKS FOR THE CIVIL WAR, DUMBASS.]
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Now we are here we know it's too late! Today we hope to find some closure!
Silently waiting, do you hear a calling? Look into the wanting eyes, I'm still here!
#28Sir_BadassPosted 3/2/2014 6:26:11 AM
Galwen posted...
Sir_Badass posted...
That just means that Bastian and Lucia are idiots and it's a good thing Ike was in charge and not them.


Sure man, doing what a sheltered princess said over what her less sheltered and more experienced advisers said is really brilliant. And Ike getting no comeuppance for doing so really shows Ike is a characters who makes mistakes with important enough consequences.

Elincia doesn't even provide an alternate plan that details the benefits and risks. She just says to go help out Geoffrey and Co.

Yeah, I'll go with Thracia 776 and see all the screwups Leif's army did. What with how the Lord character is a sheltered prince and one of the Lord's advisers is a screwup who encourages him.


But Bastian and Lucia never demonstrate any real strategic abilities. Their plan in Chapter 24 was to needlessly sacrifice Geoffrey. Why should Ike listen to them when they're obviously incompetent?
#29Galwen(Topic Creator)Posted 3/2/2014 6:42:10 AM(edited)
SilverZangoose posted...
1. He was calling out utter BS and hypocrisy as he saw it. BS if you're referring to the bit where they're pretending they don't know who Elincia is, and hypocrisy if you're referring to the stuff with the herons, I'm not sure which you mean. Would you rather he sat quietly, scared to stand up for his views?


1.Don' t bite the hand that feeds you.

2. Ike bit that hand that was about to feed them. And they got fed anyway. Remember how upset those senators were after Ike mouthed off?

2. How is that stupid? They were innocent people who were living in crap conditions, and who had just had their land destroyed partly due to his actions, as the guy who flooded it only did it to destroy his army. It's not like he gave them weapons or intelligence about his army. It was just supplies, which couldn't be used against him, and it's not like he did that at a point where it was stated their army was running low on supplies either.


Except Soren was against giving those supplies.

3. What can I say? He was confident that he could win the battle and save innocent lives, as opposed to abandoning people he could save. And he was right. It's not like he was at a huge disadvantage, it was just an average battle for him.


So once again, Ike gets to do what he (and in this Elincia) wants and get away with it.

As for Shinon, it's not that Ike did anything wrong in particular, it's just that he'd never done anything in the past to gain Shinon's respect, so instead of Shinon just mindlessly following him, like a character would for an actual Gary Stu main character, he has to go out of his way to earn his respect through his actions.


Sure, and there are characters who are against Bella from Twilight.

Shinon is the only PC in PoR who opposes Ike enough to refuse to fight under him for a large portion of the game and try to kill him when he gets the chance. And he still ends up getting abroad the Ike train.
#30Huff n puff 20Posted 3/2/2014 6:57:35 AM
...Now that I think about it.

Thank the gods Ike doesn't listen to Bastian in FE9.

Bastian is STUPID. And his shenanigans in FE10 prove it.
Oh, he's so smart, he saw the dissenters and got Ike on his side to defeat them.
BRILLIANT.

He saw that things were starting to go sour. People were getting upset over Elincia's rule.
Instead of letting Elincia recruit a NATIONAL HERO TO ****ING BACK HER [you know, the National Hero that the Rebels are aspiring to be like] he gets the guy to ****ING DISAPPEAR TILL LAST SECOND.

Why? Because you know, if Elincia would've had Ike's backing Ludveck and his goons wouldn't have done ANYTHING. They would've sat there being angry, and far to afraid that Ike will ****ing slam a sword up their rear.
So Bastian's brilliant tactic was to make sure Ludveck COULD do something, so he could spring Ike on them at the last second, instead of you know, preventing the conflict entirely.

Yeah, the sheltered Princess is a LOT smarter than that guy.
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Now we are here we know it's too late! Today we hope to find some closure!
Silently waiting, do you hear a calling? Look into the wanting eyes, I'm still here!