After playing a whole weekend with Jak... I feel sorry for whoever mains him

#11KindertotenwaldPosted 12/3/2012 9:15:08 AM
Cosmic_Coyote posted...
Terotrous posted...
Jak, Toro, and Sir Dan all need significant buffs.


I tough Toro sucked till I used all his forms, his ninja and Oni forms are amazing and his justice form gains high AP, and he can sleep to regain AP too and his Lv 2 is amazing for multikills.

Sir Dan is decent.

Just Jak is this bad.


Why do you think Sir Dan is better?
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PSASBR: Big Daddy, Raiden
PSN: Omnisignificance
#12LanceDrakePosted 12/3/2012 9:16:19 AM
Jak seems to only be good in stock, since he's pretty dang good and being a wimp and running away, biding your time and building your AP to level 3, or if you're really good at timing, using his level 1 or 2.

In timed and kill limit, he cannot compete, unless your opponents are stupid and fall for your blaster spam the whole match.
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Alt account of NDgamer1122
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#13TerotrousPosted 12/3/2012 9:16:48 AM
Cosmic_Coyote posted...
I tough Toro sucked till I used all his forms, his ninja and Oni forms are amazing and his justice form gains high AP, and he can sleep to regain AP too and his Lv 2 is amazing for multikills.

Sir Dan is decent.

Just Jak is this bad.

Nah to be honest they're all pretty bad. All have bad AP gain and a hard time landing supers.

Toro's Ninja form has the most atrociously bad AP gain in the entire game. His level 2 is also one of the worst level 2s in the game outside 2v2 as it's so insanely obvious and avoidable. It has the longest startup of any super in the entire game.
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#14PyroSparkPosted 12/3/2012 9:17:04 AM
Jak is just one of those characters that are better for teams.
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rexator-"Make it a money match so that the winner gets to crap in the other's mouth." PSN: PyroSpark7
#15Cosmic_Coyote(Topic Creator)Posted 12/3/2012 9:21:09 AM
Terotrous posted...
Nah to be honest they're all pretty bad. All have bad AP gain and a hard time landing supers.

Toro's Ninja form has the most atrociously bad AP gain in the entire game. His level 2 is also one of the worst level 2s in the game outside 2v2 as it's so insanely obvious and avoidable. It has the longest startup of any super in the entire game.


Toro have 3 forms.

Want AP? use his justice form he hits hard and causes knock off

Want damage / range and decent AP? use his Oni form

Want range and play keep away? Use his ninja form

Want AP? jump up high and use "O"

His Lv 1 is great too and fast is almost as Sly lv 1
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"There is no knowledge that is not power"
#16KindertotenwaldPosted 12/3/2012 9:22:35 AM
Cosmic_Coyote posted...
Terotrous posted...
Nah to be honest they're all pretty bad. All have bad AP gain and a hard time landing supers.

Toro's Ninja form has the most atrociously bad AP gain in the entire game. His level 2 is also one of the worst level 2s in the game outside 2v2 as it's so insanely obvious and avoidable. It has the longest startup of any super in the entire game.


Toro have 3 forms.

Want AP? use his justice form he hits hard and causes knock off

Want damage / range and decent AP? use his Oni form

Want range and play keep away? Use his ninja form

Want AP? jump up high and use "O"

His Lv 1 is great too and fast is almost as Sly lv 1


Did you miss my question?
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PSASBR: Big Daddy, Raiden
PSN: Omnisignificance
#17bartz90Posted 12/3/2012 9:24:53 AM
Terotrous posted...
Jak, Toro, and Sir Dan all need significant buffs.


Toro does not need a buff. At least not a large one and not as much as these other two. I would put Big Daddy in there instead.
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#18TerotrousPosted 12/3/2012 9:26:36 AM(edited)
Cosmic_Coyote posted...
Toro have 3 forms.

Want AP? use his justice form he hits hard and causes knock off

It's also slow, has short range, and has absolutely no tools. Still, it's the most solid of his forms.

Want damage / range and decent AP? use his Oni form

This is not what Oni form is for as it does little damage, the only way it gets big damage is stance cancel to Justice Form. Oni form is for crowd control and more importantly, comboing into level 1 (though it doesn't do this well as the setups for level 1 are all obvious).


Want range and play keep away? Use his ninja form

Unfortunately you gain no AP and have no setups into supers so it's useless. Might as well just stick with Oni form.


Want AP? jump up high and use "O"

Builds AP slow and is a magnet for attacks. You can cancel out of it, but if you cancel early you build like no AP.


His Lv 1 is great too and fast is almost as Sly lv 1

It's actually very slow and avoidable and only combos after Oni Toro v/\ (which is obvious) and /\ charged to level 2, which is better but only works at a very precise range.


His level 3 is also obviously garbage.


Toro basically needs AP cost reductions (no cinematic level 3 should cost over 500 AP), Torobi needs to build more AP, and Oni Toro should also probably build a bit more AP.
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#19Cosmic_Coyote(Topic Creator)Posted 12/3/2012 9:25:31 AM
Kindertotenwald posted...

Why do you think Sir Dan is better?


I already stated:

"I know I main Sir Dan and he is also very hard to use but at least have several tools that works like the Axe, the shield, the dragon potion, the poison hand, the charge move, the arrow that can stunn, his massive d+s (air) range or the hammer... that witout mention his Lv1 is very fast and aimable and his Lv2 can track enemies and if used below is very hard for the enemies to dodge it fast

But with Jak is like shooting peas at your enemies is as if everyone had superarmor against hi weapons and his lv 1 is horrible"

Also he can setup for his Lv1 with many combos (avoidables by air tech I know) but you can play mind games with his arrow and land a Lv 1 also can take people by surprise in upper platforms as it is aimable.
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"There is no knowledge that is not power"
#20Cosmic_Coyote(Topic Creator)Posted 12/3/2012 9:29:40 AM
Terotrous posted...
Unfortunately you gain no AP and have no setups into supers so it's useless. Might as well just stick with Oni form..


Ninja Toro can combo from several of his moves with the Liu Kang kick or the Scorpionīs spear (I had saw several people do insane combos with it online)

You can cancel his sleep move and still gain a bit of AP (works better in FFA or 2 vs 2)

Oni form have several tools for big Damage like d+T (ground) or u+T (air)
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"There is no knowledge that is not power"