Tier List 3 - taking it serious now

#21LightEcoSagePosted 2/18/2013 5:36:59 AM
Retroxgamer0 posted...
LightEcoSage posted...
Retroxgamer0 posted...
even great and skilled players, like me and Lucario would struggle with in games because of his limitations

are you well known to do as well as you do with jak with at least one other character?


I haven't shared this with anyone but I do better with Kat and Ratchet then I do with Jak and thats truly sad... I even been thinking for some weeks now of switching to Ratchet..

I don't even want Jak in this game no more if their going to make him look this bad. I can't for for FUTURE DLC characters...


would you say ratchet is a b tier or are you going to argue that? i placed him in b tier, but on average in 2v2 matches jak has won about as much games as ratchet has from what ive seen personally, and i have yet to meet the ratchet equivalent of you, he barely has any fanboys =p also ratchet has never held a top spot on the leaderboards, jak has.


Ratchet is B tier and not OP, but I know that his Sniper needs a nerf. I can be a better Ratchet then I can Jak in one week. I've already beaten black and brown belts as Ratchet and he's not even over 110(rank). That says a lot.
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"Jak, you are the Greatest of Heroes" ~Precursor Leader
#22Retroxgamer0(Topic Creator)Posted 2/18/2013 5:44:14 AM
This shows lack of experience everywhere in this text. Its all over the place.

ignorant insult is ignored


First of all youre wrong about he has low AP gain because he was OP in the old build and for balancing reasons. Im tired of your exaggerations of him being OP in the old build.

him being OP in the old build is not an exaggeration, and this further proves that you want that version of him back. the one that can just kite with above average mobility at range and nail easy lvl 1 hc all day. he'd be the best character in the entire game.


You constantly while and exaggerate about him in the Old build as if he was Kratos and Raiden.Only thing OP about him in the old build was his MASS INVERTER AND NEEDLE LAZER! Get that through you're thick skull. Those are the only WEAPONS AND MOVES. You make his whole moveset in the old build sound OP.

more of the same


His mobility is also not that great, stop using his mobility as a point because his air uppercut leaves him vulnerable for a while before he can launch his spinkick and Jetboard especially.

i only said that its above average, to counter your feelings that jak is currently just average. you ignore the points i made about him having above average play.

His down circle is punishable and predictable. You just straight suck.
ignorant insults are ignored, go on...

Once you block it thats it that greatly decreases Jak's whole chance at winning a game.
more so than any other character? elaborate

His level 3 is not that great as your making it out to be. Its only good on short maps. if you was skilled enough you would know it can be easily air dodged.
ok now this i can have a whole 'nother topic to debate, but ive already polled people on the best level 3 and 90% of the game thinks jaks lvl3 is in the top 3 supers in the game. are you taking other characters into account?

He is not impossible to grab. He has moments where you can grab him. I know because I use him I know when hes vulnerable. Get your experience up.
very difficult but not impossible. in an above average way.

I can't believe you whine about Jak when most of the cast is better them him/ Ratchet is basically the OP Jak in this game without mobility yet Ratchet is fine though with his higher AP gain, combo potential, range and HC. Yeah what now. See those points <----
i did not whine. i did not insult you, but if i were, id probably say you are conceited to think that hes just average and you happen to be a super pro, yet youre even better with ratchet than jak and its some super secret, because you rarely play him or whatevs.
#23Retroxgamer0(Topic Creator)Posted 2/18/2013 5:52:58 AM(edited)
Ratchet is B tier and not OP, but I know that his Sniper needs a nerf.

so in your mindset b tier isnt overpowered, and your whole point of debate is that you're mad at me because i think he is above average, and you think he is only average, yet you do better than average with him. i think you are being slightly delusional here... the whole point you seem to want to prove is that jak sucks, he should be like beta build, but you are the best jak in the world, but even better with ratchet and everyones a scrub..or something like that o.o

also i already know jaks ap gain is lower with some guns, to balance out the fact that he gets out of range way too easily, but again if they were to buff all of the guns, especially the homing one, he would be very overpowered, they simply cannot do this. he isnt LIKE ratchet, i have no idea why you're comparing the two. if ratchets ap gain was like jaks on his guns he would suck.
#24LightEcoSagePosted 2/18/2013 5:52:57 AM
Retroxgamer0 posted...
This shows lack of experience everywhere in this text. Its all over the place.

ignorant insult is ignored


First of all youre wrong about he has low AP gain because he was OP in the old build and for balancing reasons. Im tired of your exaggerations of him being OP in the old build.

him being OP in the old build is not an exaggeration, and this further proves that you want that version of him back. the one that can just kite with above average mobility at range and nail easy lvl 1 hc all day. he'd be the best character in the entire game.


You constantly while and exaggerate about him in the Old build as if he was Kratos and Raiden.Only thing OP about him in the old build was his MASS INVERTER AND NEEDLE LAZER! Get that through you're thick skull. Those are the only WEAPONS AND MOVES. You make his whole moveset in the old build sound OP.

more of the same


His mobility is also not that great, stop using his mobility as a point because his air uppercut leaves him vulnerable for a while before he can launch his spinkick and Jetboard especially.

i only said that its above average, to counter your feelings that jak is currently just average. you ignore the points i made about him having above average play.

His down circle is punishable and predictable. You just straight suck.
ignorant insults are ignored, go on...

Once you block it thats it that greatly decreases Jak's whole chance at winning a game.
more so than any other character? elaborate

His level 3 is not that great as your making it out to be. Its only good on short maps. if you was skilled enough you would know it can be easily air dodged.
ok now this i can have a whole 'nother topic to debate, but ive already polled people on the best level 3 and 90% of the game thinks jaks lvl3 is in the top 3 supers in the game. are you taking other characters into account?

He is not impossible to grab. He has moments where you can grab him. I know because I use him I know when hes vulnerable. Get your experience up.
very difficult but not impossible. in an above average way.

I can't believe you whine about Jak when most of the cast is better them him/ Ratchet is basically the OP Jak in this game without mobility yet Ratchet is fine though with his higher AP gain, combo potential, range and HC. Yeah what now. See those points <----
i did not whine. i did not insult you, but if i were, id probably say you are conceited to think that hes just average and you happen to be a super pro, yet youre even better with ratchet than jak and its some super secret, because you rarely play him or whatevs.


No I don not want his Old version back. Your just misleading yourself...

You know what this reply just proved you are a terrible person to be listing points. Once you said things like elaborate on his WC that just show your lack of experience. Any Jak main or experience enough player should no how his WC is not that great against blocking opponents.

Im tired of arguing with people about Jak buffs, ive had had fair to many on both the forums and gamefaqs. Im not going to repeat myself for literally the 100th time.

One simple solution to you understanding you are wrong. Use Jak against high/skilled level players and tell me how that goes. Until you reach a certain experience your points will always be inconsistent, wrong, lacking and inaccurate.
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"Jak, you are the Greatest of Heroes" ~Precursor Leader
#25Retroxgamer0(Topic Creator)Posted 2/18/2013 6:00:07 AM(edited)
No I don not want his Old version back. Your just misleading yourself...

but you said it wasnt that overpowered and i was exaggerating, so why not? what would be stopping me from running away and spamming my homing gun and then using HC into lvl1 super over and over?
#26LightEcoSagePosted 2/18/2013 6:02:20 AM
Retroxgamer0 posted...
Ratchet is B tier and not OP, but I know that his Sniper needs a nerf.

so in your mindset b tier isnt overpowered, and your whole point of debate is that you're mad at me because i think he is above average, and you think he is only average, yet you do better than average with him. i think you are being slightly delusional here... the whole point you seem to want to prove is that jak sucks, he should be like beta build, but you are the best jak in the world, but even better with ratchet and everyones a scrub..or something like that o.o

also i already know jaks ap gain is lower with some guns, to balance out the fact that he gets out of range way too easily, but again if they were to buff all of the guns, especially the homing one, he would be very overpowered, they simply cannot do this. he isnt LIKE ratchet, i have no idea why you're comparing the two. if ratchets ap gain was like jaks on his guns he would suck.


Alright this is my last reply for you. You listed so many lies and exaggerations its not even funny. I never said I was the best Jak. I never said I wanted him to be like he was in the old build. Never said everyone is a scrub. I never said B Tier wasn't OP. I said Ratchet wasn't. OMG HOW OLD ARE YOU!? I can play slightly better with Jak against skilled players. You have no idea how it feels to play as jak against skilled players. And I never said all of his guns needed buffs and even if they all do receive buffs that WOULDN'T MAKE HIM OP. In our mind lot of buffs mean a character will become OP. Understand that the best Jak players struggle against players who skilled level are not even that high. Your Ratchet and Jak comparison shows how bias you are. You got 3 options. Challenge high level players as Jak, go to ranked and do a days worth of play as Jak or STFU and GTFOH.

I can't do these pointless lacking arguments anymore relating to Jak needing buffs. Im tired of explaining this over and over and over and over and over and over. Have fun with your inexperience misleading claims. DO me another favor. Make a topic saying is Jak a B Tier character and see how many people disagree with you. IM just going to let other people argue with you about Jak. I know the truth so im straight.
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"Jak, you are the Greatest of Heroes" ~Precursor Leader
#27Retroxgamer0(Topic Creator)Posted 2/18/2013 6:15:29 AM(edited)
I never said B Tier wasn't OP. I said Ratchet wasn't.

make up your mind. you said ratchet is b tier, and he wasnt overpowered, and now you're saying you never said b tier isnt overpowered, as if it is. you are confusing me >_< anyways i agree that ratchet is a b tier thats where i put him too.
#28LightEcoSagePosted 2/18/2013 6:16:43 AM
Retroxgamer0 posted...
I never said B Tier wasn't OP. I said Ratchet wasn't.

make up your mind. you said ratchet is b tier, and he wasnt overpowered, and now you're saying you never said b tier isnt overpowered, as if it is. you are confusing me >_<


It really gets me how people don't think Jak needs a buff. Do some more research kid, battle wise and video wise. I would link you but its not my job to. If you're going to list opinions you need to do it when you just about know a character very well which you obviously don't for Jak. You could never beat me on this subject. You're just way to bias, indenial and inexperience. Would it help if I said Lucario believes Jak needs a buff as well? I mean seriously im not the only guy who believes this. I can bust out multiple Jak mains who know he needs a buff, and videos, but without battles you'll always be lacking. It's real similar to pokemon. Your pkmn cannot face certain opponents until its ready and strong enough(experienced).

If only you had my perspective. Man I really wish I could share my perspective in full detail.. All the hardcore battles are rushing through my head...
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"Jak, you are the Greatest of Heroes" ~Precursor Leader
#29Retroxgamer0(Topic Creator)Posted 2/18/2013 6:18:18 AM
btw i made an error i meant to put midlow tier rather than low tier. i dont feel the gap is so great that it jumps a tier spot.
#30Retroxgamer0(Topic Creator)Posted 2/18/2013 6:21:41 AM(edited)
LightEcoSage posted...
Retroxgamer0 posted...
I never said B Tier wasn't OP. I said Ratchet wasn't.

make up your mind. you said ratchet is b tier, and he wasnt overpowered, and now you're saying you never said b tier isnt overpowered, as if it is. you are confusing me >_<


It really gets me how people don't think Jak needs a buff. Do some more research kid, battle wise and video wise. I would link you but its not my job to. If you're going to list opinions you need to do it when you just about know a character very well which you obviously don't for Jak. You could never beat me on this subject. You're just way to bias, indenial and inexperience. Would it help if I said Lucario believes Jak needs a buff as well? I mean seriously im not the only guy who believes this. I can bust out multiple Jak mains who know he needs a buff, and videos, but without battles you'll always be lacking. It's real similar to pokemon. Your pkmn cannot face certain opponents until its ready and strong enough(experienced).

If only you had my perspective. Man I really wish I could share my perspective in full detail.. All the hardcore battles are rushing through my head...


if you were reading my posts you would see that i clearly noted some moves of jaks need a buff, and some of them need a nerf to compensate. he has an unbalanced moveset. right now atm you only use half of his moves over and over and sparingly on the other half, he does not have a balanced moveset. that is one of his flaws, and one of the reason i do not main jak--he feels repetitive. you can however use his best moves with lower ap gain and try and kite better to compensate to slowly but surely get your level 3 and win. that is how they made it but i do not agree with it. id rather they nerf his obvious moves like his down circle, and then they actually can buff other guns correctly.