Isaac and Zeus Need a Serious Nerf

#11tripp2300Posted 4/7/2013 9:40:32 PM
dooms14 posted...
SlyCooperRawks posted...
1. "No but I was nearly blinded by that wall of text. If you can't be arsed to use paragraphs I'll just respond to the topic title and say no."

Okay, first of all, please don't respond to my question if you're too lazy to read what I have to say

2. "I think you need to learn how to deal with these characters before you cry nerf."

I have attempted and failed. If you've tried everything and you still can't, then the character is obviously too overpowered. And it also seems like you use Isaac and/or Zeus regularly if you think they shouldn't be nerfed/balenced at least slightly.


the 2 comment...

Tried everything... i dont wanna call you a liar so... use ratchet if your having a problem with the mines ratchet has everything.
Cole spam nades if dude likes camping mines and wait for an opening or gets agressive.
If you can deal with the mines Isaac is a cake walk.

Only characters that should have issues with mines are people that have nothing but close range moves.


So... Raiden?
#12AngelottPosted 4/7/2013 9:48:21 PM
tripp2300 posted...


So... Raiden?


Lol. Raiden is well equipped to handle 90% of those issues, ESPECIALLY with Zeus. I'm thinking Sweet Tooth. XD
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#13tripp2300Posted 4/7/2013 9:57:23 PM
Angelott posted...
tripp2300 posted...


So... Raiden?


Lol. Raiden is well equipped to handle 90% of those issues, ESPECIALLY with Zeus. I'm thinking Sweet Tooth. XD


I was just referring to the mine lol. Any good Isaac will punish you while trying to get past and set another.
#14AngelottPosted 4/7/2013 10:03:19 PM
tripp2300 posted...
Angelott posted...
tripp2300 posted...


So... Raiden?


Lol. Raiden is well equipped to handle 90% of those issues, ESPECIALLY with Zeus. I'm thinking Sweet Tooth. XD


I was just referring to the mine lol. Any good Isaac will punish you while trying to get past and set another.


I gotta agree. Just speaking about the call on "melee only" characters have issues with Isaac.
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#15MajesticFerretPosted 4/7/2013 10:08:29 PM
As far as Zeus goes, my only complaint about him is how overpowered his level 3 is in the fact that he has the ability to get 9 kills total during just one level 3.

9?! Really? Man, you guys must suck cuz most Zeus are lucky to get 6 and probably average around 4-5.

And don't tell me this Zeus was that good, because there's not a whole lot of "skill" behind Zeus lv. 3. You basically push a button that you hope gives you the highest probability of hitting people and then cross your fingers and hope they don't guess right, but even with lucky guessing, I don't see 9 kills as possible.


The only thing on Zeus that needs a nerf IMO is his forward triangle. The charge of it isn't that long, and the range/spread of it is pretty insane for something that nets 82 AP just from landing on one person and can easily hit multiple people. I've seen it get the full 82 AP just from getting people on the outer edges of the attack, which is ridiculous. Nerf it to like 65 AP and it'd be fine.

This is a reasonable nerf as his forward triangle sucks in 1v1/2v2 regardless of how much AP it builds, but it's way too good of a sucker punching move for FFA, similar to Sackboy's cake back in the day.



As for Isaac, first things first, have they nerfed his gun loop yet, because obviously that needs to be first to go. Scrubby players don't use it, but being able to AP burst with a projectile that reaches half the length of the screen is hilariously broken.
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#16fulcar95Posted 4/7/2013 10:21:22 PM
The fact that Zeus can cause an AP burst with ONE move is a bit too much don't ya think? If you ever fight more than one Zeus at a time, trust me you'll never forget how much it sucks getting sandwiched by those things. And yeah, his lvl 3 should be WAY easier to dodge. In FFA, because two opponents spawn on the left side of the screen and one on the right, his right fist will ALWAYS kill the two on the left, neither can move out the way fast enough. He can easily score 6 or more kills, and that's bull! His attack should be limited to 3 hits or something, not 4 or more. His lvl 2 also needs a reduced time limit, just like Isaac's lvl 1. Just because they're new characters doesn't mean they should have anything easy.
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#17tripp2300Posted 4/7/2013 10:27:56 PM
fulcar95 posted...
The fact that Zeus can cause an AP burst with ONE move is a bit too much don't ya think? If you ever fight more than one Zeus at a time, trust me you'll never forget how much it sucks getting sandwiched by those things. And yeah, his lvl 3 should be WAY easier to dodge. In FFA, because two opponents spawn on the left side of the screen and one on the right, his right fist will ALWAYS kill the two on the left, neither can move out the way fast enough. He can easily score 6 or more kills, and that's bull! His attack should be limited to 3 hits or something, not 4 or more. His lvl 2 also needs a reduced time limit, just like Isaac's lvl 1. Just because they're new characters doesn't mean they should have anything easy.


Idk rarely die more than once to it. He telegraph's his attack. Trick is learning it. Just try stay in middle and hop air dodge, ground and air won't hit. Move left or right regarding the side attacks. I will admit though, lag sometimes causes a kill before you spawn. Why? Idk.
#18AngelottPosted 4/7/2013 10:36:23 PM(edited)
MajesticFerret posted...
As far as Zeus goes, my only complaint about him is how overpowered his level 3 is in the fact that he has the ability to get 9 kills total during just one level 3.

9?! Really? Man, you guys must suck cuz most Zeus are lucky to get 6 and probably average around 4-5.

And don't tell me this Zeus was that good, because there's not a whole lot of "skill" behind Zeus lv. 3. You basically push a button that you hope gives you the highest probability of hitting people and then cross your fingers and hope they don't guess right, but even with lucky guessing, I don't see 9 kills as possible.


The only thing on Zeus that needs a nerf IMO is his forward triangle. The charge of it isn't that long, and the range/spread of it is pretty insane for something that nets 82 AP just from landing on one person and can easily hit multiple people. I've seen it get the full 82 AP just from getting people on the outer edges of the attack, which is ridiculous. Nerf it to like 65 AP and it'd be fine.

This is a reasonable nerf as his forward triangle sucks in 1v1/2v2 regardless of how much AP it builds, but it's way too good of a sucker punching move for FFA, similar to Sackboy's cake back in the day.



As for Isaac, first things first, have they nerfed his gun loop yet, because obviously that needs to be first to go. Scrubby players don't use it, but being able to AP burst with a projectile that reaches half the length of the screen is hilariously broken.


I agree to a degree on Zeus needing a slight nerf on his forward triangle AP gain. But the range with that move is terrible, plus its highly predictable, especially charged. Sackboy's cake attack/jam attack were an issue because they stayed out making a hazard, and they had insane range and trap capability, especially when boosted with the fan or in mid air, so they're barely comparable, but I get what you were alluding to.

I agree about the kills for Zeus' lvl 3, since its a big game of rock paper scissors. To net 9 kills they would have to fall for it every single time. Not unheard of, but rare.

And as for Isaac, the only gun that can do that is his kinetic shot, and that's with bouncing stacks. Every shooting character has the same range as Isaac with his pistol, and he only gets three shots before reload unless he's moving. Drake's AR stacks more AP than Isaac ever can, and Isaac's is way more punishable.
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#19RoyalShinePosted 4/7/2013 11:09:58 PM
SlyCooperRawks posted...
1. "No but I was nearly blinded by that wall of text. If you can't be arsed to use paragraphs I'll just respond to the topic title and say no."

Okay, first of all, please don't respond to my question if you're too lazy to read what I have to say

2. "I think you need to learn how to deal with these characters before you cry nerf."

I have attempted and failed. If you've tried everything and you still can't, then the character is obviously too overpowered. And it also seems like you use Isaac and/or Zeus regularly if you think they shouldn't be nerfed/balenced at least slightly.


It's not a matter of one person being able to face an Isaac/Zeus, but more a matter of people in general. I can handle most players who use Zeus and Isaac with multiple characters.

But I do agree that Isaac's level 1 should have a time frame.
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#20CHL305Posted 4/8/2013 4:28:38 AM
fulcar95 posted...
The fact that Zeus can cause an AP burst with ONE move is a bit too much don't ya think? If you ever fight more than one Zeus at a time, trust me you'll never forget how much it sucks getting sandwiched by those things. And yeah, his lvl 3 should be WAY easier to dodge. In FFA, because two opponents spawn on the left side of the screen and one on the right, his right fist will ALWAYS kill the two on the left, neither can move out the way fast enough. He can easily score 6 or more kills, and that's bull! His attack should be limited to 3 hits or something, not 4 or more. His lvl 2 also needs a reduced time limit, just like Isaac's lvl 1. Just because they're new characters doesn't mean they should have anything easy.


His level 2 is fine, I actually think they should buff it. In 2v2 I average about one kill with his level 2, compared to raiden, parappa, nariko, and big daddy who can easily get two. Heck, raiden can get at least three.

I have to be honest, I never take my Zeus to FFA, since it is not a competitive game mode.
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