Raiden, Kat, Evil Cole, Kratos, Drake, and Sly mains....

#31DopplesPosted 4/19/2013 5:12:56 PM
DireProphecy posted...
Dopples posted...
Drake OP? It was uninformed opinions like that that got him nerfed in the first place.

He was always weak to opponents in the air. Pre-patch Nariko, Kat, Fat Princess, E. Cole; anyone that could negate barrels could beat him with ease since he needed 600+ AP to win a match. All the nerfs did was making his bad match ups terrible (He used to have a 7-3/6-4 against Raiden. Now he gets eaten alive.) If you actually learned the damn match up instead of crying about it, you'd realize that he was very firmly in mid tier in modes that actually matter (FFA is not a legit mode.)

If you're still losing to Drake, it's because you don't know basic things, like how his hitbox on side triangle sucks, or that he has no way to get pressure off of him, or that his anti-airs are some of the worst in the game. If you're still losing to him after all of that, stop playing Toro, Sir Dan, or Big Daddy. The only acceptable bad match up that is just a case of his tools beating that of his opponent's is Dante, and even then I can't say for sure now that Dante has safe pressure.

tl;dr: Learn match ups before crying on message boards.



Pre-nerf he was the best 2 v 2 character. More Drake's than anything else at the top of leaderboards justify that claim. His moveset is just awesome support in 2 v 2, he can handle 2 opponents well, and his level 3 was just brokenly overpowered in 2 v 2. His run-and-gun sets up partner's level 1s incredibly easily.


In 2v2 he still got beaten by a lot of stuff. People just didn't play smart against him, so they cried foul. Was he really good in 2v2? Sure. But he wasn't broken or OP. Nerfing him did nothing for the game's meta, and only punished people who played him by forcing them to switch to Isaac if they wanted a similar playstyle.
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PSN: TheFinestBrew
Looking to improve my MvC3 game, would like advice from anyone who wants to give it.
#32DireProphecyPosted 4/19/2013 5:22:25 PM
Dopples posted...
DireProphecy posted...
Dopples posted...
Drake OP? It was uninformed opinions like that that got him nerfed in the first place.

He was always weak to opponents in the air. Pre-patch Nariko, Kat, Fat Princess, E. Cole; anyone that could negate barrels could beat him with ease since he needed 600+ AP to win a match. All the nerfs did was making his bad match ups terrible (He used to have a 7-3/6-4 against Raiden. Now he gets eaten alive.) If you actually learned the damn match up instead of crying about it, you'd realize that he was very firmly in mid tier in modes that actually matter (FFA is not a legit mode.)

If you're still losing to Drake, it's because you don't know basic things, like how his hitbox on side triangle sucks, or that he has no way to get pressure off of him, or that his anti-airs are some of the worst in the game. If you're still losing to him after all of that, stop playing Toro, Sir Dan, or Big Daddy. The only acceptable bad match up that is just a case of his tools beating that of his opponent's is Dante, and even then I can't say for sure now that Dante has safe pressure.

tl;dr: Learn match ups before crying on message boards.



Pre-nerf he was the best 2 v 2 character. More Drake's than anything else at the top of leaderboards justify that claim. His moveset is just awesome support in 2 v 2, he can handle 2 opponents well, and his level 3 was just brokenly overpowered in 2 v 2. His run-and-gun sets up partner's level 1s incredibly easily.


In 2v2 he still got beaten by a lot of stuff. People just didn't play smart against him, so they cried foul. Was he really good in 2v2? Sure. But he wasn't broken or OP. Nerfing him did nothing for the game's meta, and only punished people who played him by forcing them to switch to Isaac if they wanted a similar playstyle.


I'm sorry but you must not be aware of how his level 3 works. First of all, if your partner hits the zombies with attacks, they lose AP. When I ran Kratos + Drake with my brother, I could square chain a zombie keeping it stunlocked, and that player would lose about 200 AP. Second, the initial stun of the zombies was completely unnecessary and I'm glad they removed that part. But worst of all, AFTER the level 3, the opponents have no invulnerability, meaning you can kill them with a level 1 or start a burst combo on them, or grab them. Very broken. Couple this with how easily he can get level 3.
#33DopplesPosted 4/19/2013 5:24:12 PM
DireProphecy posted...
Dopples posted...
DireProphecy posted...
Dopples posted...
Drake OP? It was uninformed opinions like that that got him nerfed in the first place.

He was always weak to opponents in the air. Pre-patch Nariko, Kat, Fat Princess, E. Cole; anyone that could negate barrels could beat him with ease since he needed 600+ AP to win a match. All the nerfs did was making his bad match ups terrible (He used to have a 7-3/6-4 against Raiden. Now he gets eaten alive.) If you actually learned the damn match up instead of crying about it, you'd realize that he was very firmly in mid tier in modes that actually matter (FFA is not a legit mode.)

If you're still losing to Drake, it's because you don't know basic things, like how his hitbox on side triangle sucks, or that he has no way to get pressure off of him, or that his anti-airs are some of the worst in the game. If you're still losing to him after all of that, stop playing Toro, Sir Dan, or Big Daddy. The only acceptable bad match up that is just a case of his tools beating that of his opponent's is Dante, and even then I can't say for sure now that Dante has safe pressure.

tl;dr: Learn match ups before crying on message boards.



Pre-nerf he was the best 2 v 2 character. More Drake's than anything else at the top of leaderboards justify that claim. His moveset is just awesome support in 2 v 2, he can handle 2 opponents well, and his level 3 was just brokenly overpowered in 2 v 2. His run-and-gun sets up partner's level 1s incredibly easily.


In 2v2 he still got beaten by a lot of stuff. People just didn't play smart against him, so they cried foul. Was he really good in 2v2? Sure. But he wasn't broken or OP. Nerfing him did nothing for the game's meta, and only punished people who played him by forcing them to switch to Isaac if they wanted a similar playstyle.


I'm sorry but you must not be aware of how his level 3 works. First of all, if your partner hits the zombies with attacks, they lose AP. When I ran Kratos + Drake with my brother, I could square chain a zombie keeping it stunlocked, and that player would lose about 200 AP. Second, the initial stun of the zombies was completely unnecessary and I'm glad they removed that part. But worst of all, AFTER the level 3, the opponents have no invulnerability, meaning you can kill them with a level 1 or start a burst combo on them, or grab them. Very broken. Couple this with how easily he can get level 3.


The level 3 was the only thing even remotely broken about him though. I agree that they should have nerfed it, but they should have left it at that. Barrel was fine, his level 1 was fine, etc.


Also I'm probably the last person you want to claim that knows nothing about Drake. >.>;
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PSN: TheFinestBrew
Looking to improve my MvC3 game, would like advice from anyone who wants to give it.
#34DireProphecyPosted 4/19/2013 5:41:34 PM
I don't care who you are. You made no mention of his broken level 3. His level 3 made him OP in 2 v 2. And the nerf on barrel was fine, although I agree every other nerf was unnecessary. The vulnerability BS with his level 3 still persists.

Nerfing him did nothing for the game's meta, and only punished people who played him by forcing them to switch to Isaac if they wanted a similar playstyle.

The changes are not nearly bad enough to force anyone who had a competent Drake to switch to Isaac.
#35EX_BortthogPosted 4/19/2013 9:13:13 PM(edited)
I have a question for all of you. Do you people just not care that you use broken characters, or do you all have a sense of delusion in that your main is not overpowered at all?

Justice from Guilty Gear would like to clarify what 'broken' means

The only reason Justice has suddenly been unbanned after Guilty Gear, GGX, GGX+, GGXX, GGXX#r, GGS, GGXXAC+ and a total of 15 years is she was nerfed so goddamn hard even people say it was unjust

As an example of how Justice was broken, imagine if Kratos had 3 jumps, could dash in the air twice, his counter lasts 4 seconds, his counter had 4 characters of reach, he had true infinite combos where 1 hit = a 999 hit combo for as long as he wanted, a half screen teleport, and supers that literal took up 70% of the screen
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#1 Cactus
#36CT_HardcasePosted 4/19/2013 9:46:03 PM(edited)
How can people possibly care about OP people anymore? Game has been out for awhile, so most people know how to beat these characters. I have Jak and Sly at 999, but thats only because I love their series. Its not like I Lv1 spam as Sly.

Kratos and Raiden might be hard to beat still, but they're really predictable. Kat does indeed juggle alot, but they only use the same combo basically. Evil Cole's usually just spam Firebird, Grenades and Giga Punch, so it should become almost like a pattern. Drake, I have no comment on. Sly, with his constant Invisibility, Teleporting, and Lv1 spam, just be keep sure to a eye on him. I'm almost certain that one he gets that Lv1 and goes Invisible, he will use it.
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"Captain, I'm going with you!
... Somebody is going to dinner."
#37MajesticFerretPosted 4/20/2013 12:56:53 AM
you'd realize that he was very firmly in mid tier in modes that actually matter (FFA is not a legit mode.)

If by "not legit," you mean the mode that SB catered to the most and put the most focus in, than sure.

If anything, 1v1 is the least legit mode in this game seeing as you can only 1v1 FRIENDS and we still don't have a matchmaking version of it, aside from the fact more than half the cast is unusable garbage in 1v1 while is at least somewhat usable in 2v2 and FFA.



Drake is basically a god at the only game modes that matter. Who gives 2 ****s if he's now only mid tier 1v1 (which he isn't, seeing as far too much of the cast sucks at 1v1 for him to be only mid)? This game is arguably the most poorly balanced at 1v1. He's top tier at 2v2 and FFA (still) and those are the game modes that online caters to the most.
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Sanity is a one trick pony, all you get with it is rational thought, but with crazy the sky's the limit.
#38MajesticFerretPosted 4/20/2013 12:59:06 AM
If anything, people need to stop crying wolf on damn Raiden.

Guy will always be good in 1v1 and he now sucks balls in FFA.
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Sanity is a one trick pony, all you get with it is rational thought, but with crazy the sky's the limit.
#39ThermalPiscesPosted 4/20/2013 2:50:41 AM
I enjoy parrying your slow-as-hell moves because Dan is a bad character.
#40NeptunezzzzPosted 4/20/2013 5:54:52 AM
TheBlackAce222 posted...
I use Evil Cole and Raiden but I'm not the same as them.
I swear!


your all the same..