Question about staggering

#1God_OfThe_SwarmPosted 6/12/2014 2:05:07 AM
Okay I've been looking around on the board and also in the piggyback official guide and i don't think i understand how the stagger mechanic actually works.

So here is an example situation, I would stagger and an enemy and use a heavy slash on it ...i found that dependent on what i use to initiate the stagger, it be physical or magical attack, changes the the modifier for damage, like magics attacks would be more powerful than the physical attacks and vice-versa..

Am i right in assuming that or what, kinda confused.
---
"Life sucks get used to it" - words of a very wise yet confused man
Gt- TheButlerSaga
#2God_OfThe_Swarm(Topic Creator)Posted 6/12/2014 2:11:24 AM
just to update the info, im on my 12th day and fighting the chocobo and earth eaters and some of battles are ending extremely quickly while others are taking ages.

Im obviously doing something but i want to be sure what it is so i can continue doing so.
---
"Life sucks get used to it" - words of a very wise yet confused man
Gt- TheButlerSaga
#3OregonDucks14Posted 6/12/2014 5:10:37 AM
What you use to stagger does not have any impact on the damage modifier of a staggered enemy.
#4schwarze2011Posted 6/12/2014 5:47:17 AM
in Chocobo/Earth Eater case, as you can see in datalog, the effect of your attacks will be greater if executed during particular timing. in CE's case, after the biting attack. CE alternates between punch and biting attack. now assuming that you always unleash barrage of spells at the beginning of each battle, you will stagger CE faster whenever it happens to bite instead of punching.
#5kjcan1Posted 6/12/2014 7:24:19 AM(edited)
Most monsters require 2 staggers to do serious damage to them. Some more, and some ( the weak ones ) less.

The more "damage" you do, the longer they stay staggered and the higher chance you have of staggering them again. I use quotes there, because damage is also affected by the type of damage. *Usually* your damage changes color ( yellow ) when you stagger not because you are suddenly more powerful, but because something has reduced their ability to withstand the damage when they are staggered - roughly the same as if imperil, or deprotect were cast on them.

Once staggered two things are happening. They ( the game coders ) use the terms stagger decay and perseverance.

This translates *roughly* to:

You want them in a weakened state -> perseverance
The monster/boss doesn't want to be -> decay

The less damage you do during this state, the easier it is for them to recover. The more you do, the harder AND more likely you will further reduce their ability to handle it. The less damage you do, the more the game favors the decay, the more damage you do, the more the game favors perseverance. That said, decay is ALWAYS happening ( never reaches zero ) and perseverance ALWAYS reaches 0 ( given enough time, the stagger will run out ).

The wave, is hard to see in the middle of fighting but roughly this:

If its red: They are near staggering, doesnt matter if they are staggered now or not. They are about to be staggered again.

If its yellow, and has big loopy curves, they are about to become red. Its like they are going "Oh crap this hurts"

If its yellow and is small - you're in a fight and they know youre there. Its like they are saying "Was that a piece of paper that hit me ?"

If its none existent, You need to hurt them more.
#6tam4g0Posted 6/12/2014 8:58:12 AM
I remember seeing Anubys get a different debuff depending on how you stagger it:
stagger by perfect guarding its attack - weak against physical debuff
stagger using magic - weak against magic debuff
#7God_OfThe_Swarm(Topic Creator)Posted 6/12/2014 9:34:03 AM
I think what happened was that during the stagger CE was imperiled and/or deprotected so my attacks were doing more damage.

I think i wasn't paying attention to keeping him debuffed after staggering him so i wasn't doing as much damage as i thought i should've been doing.

I will look into it later the next time i play and will definitely put up a reply.
---
"Life sucks get used to it" - words of a very wise yet confused man
Gt- TheButlerSaga
#8MimebladePosted 6/12/2014 3:23:01 PM
What I want to know is, what about those "counter staggers".

Anubys gets them whenever you instant block their attacks for example. Zomok Dragons get it too whenever they summon wind breath or do their whirlwind wing attacks.

Basically, blocking at key times or attacking at key times to instant-stagger. I'd like to know more about those (also any advice on Staggering Bhunivelze and Bhunivelze+ final forms would be greatly appreciated).
---
If you have a question about Guilty Gear, ask me anything!
http://gear-project.tumblr.com/
#9jeffhengPosted 6/12/2014 4:32:51 PM
mimeblade, for bhuni, just keep casting alternate ra spells
#10schwarze2011Posted 6/13/2014 1:36:29 PM
jeffheng posted...
mimeblade, for bhuni, just keep casting alternate ra spells


... in order to skip the combo finale (when Lightning flips backwards). cast twice, switch, cast twice, switch, rinse and repeat. perfect block his Divine Efflux and Heartless Angel. Block first two hits of Damnatio (the ones from his face), then spam (not hold) guard repeatedly for the following 15 hits (the ones like missile barrage). if you get the timing right you will take no damage.