Developers disclose problems with Xbone Drivers

#4182xenoPosted 10/1/2013 6:53:15 AM
TrickyPony posted...
SunDevil77 posted...
embrandedone posted...
100 USD more

50 percent less powerful.

Thanks, MS


You're a sad, sad man.


While I doubt it's true, suppose the 50% thing is true. We learned last gen with PS3 being way more powerful with teh cell that it was unable to keep up with 360 in 90% of the games. These systems are both more powerful than the current systems, a lot more powerful than say the games will improve, I don't think game devs will be efficiently maxing either out.
Still going with my X1 preorder to start this gen.


This argument is getting old.

The PS3 was loads harder to develop for than the 360.

That situation is reversed this coming gen, AND the PS4 is technically more powerful.

Bringing up PS3 vs. 360 is about as strawman as you can get when discussing the development/power situation between the X1 and PS4.
---
Shwing
#42PlayaMadeTxn05Posted 10/1/2013 7:30:07 AM
chrish909 posted...
Its so sad how tc thinks anyone cares


Yet you post in his topic.

Hmmm...

Love your quote by the way.
---
http://www.youtube.com/greeneagemedia
Check me out!
#43RyzekiPosted 10/1/2013 10:55:04 AM
Solis posted...
TheApd_Returns posted...
Solis posted...
"Result, according to our information, the two studios would face a dilemma with their technical Xbox One games. Either offer a turning point in 1080p and 30 frames / sec game ... either do 900p but now the 60 frames / sec."

...When would this EVER be the case? Reduce the resolution by 30% but get a 100% framerate improvement? The whole thing just seems fishy in the way it's presented.


Resolution and framerate don't scale linearly? Take any PC game and mess around with the resolution... tell me if the frame rate gains or losses are 100% commensurate to the % of pixels lost or gained.

Actually, that's EXACTLY how it works, resolution and framerate scale quite linearly. Doubling the resolution generally DOES halve the framerate (or at least very close, taking overhead into account). The only time this wouldn't be the case is if the GPU wasn't at full utilization to begin with, in this example they should have been getting around 45FPS at 1080p if the GPU was actually being full utilized.

If decreasing the resolution by 30% brought about a 100% framerate improvement, and a game was running at 30FPS at 1080p, then it should be able to run at over 120FPS at 720p.


The only way by which resolution would have a linear change in framerate is when the game is exactly bottlenecked by memory bandwith, and nothing in the game consumed memory bandwidth in a dynamic matter.

Hence, it is almost impossible to see changes in a linear manner. Jumps can be small steps or even exponential decrease in performance depending on what is taxing the system. GPU utilization is nothing on it's own. A game is comprised of many things, and resolution is almost exclusively dependent on the memory bandwidth available when everything else is more than enough.

But I agree that a 100% jump in performance from a small drop in res is too much.
---
Core i7 4700MQ | | 16GB DDR3L || 128GB SSD + 1TB || GTX780M OC
#44zephirrainesPosted 10/1/2013 11:26:02 AM
82xeno posted...
TrickyPony posted...
SunDevil77 posted...
embrandedone posted...
100 USD more

50 percent less powerful.

Thanks, MS


You're a sad, sad man.


While I doubt it's true, suppose the 50% thing is true. We learned last gen with PS3 being way more powerful with teh cell that it was unable to keep up with 360 in 90% of the games. These systems are both more powerful than the current systems, a lot more powerful than say the games will improve, I don't think game devs will be efficiently maxing either out.
Still going with my X1 preorder to start this gen.


This argument is getting old.

The PS3 was loads harder to develop for than the 360.

That situation is reversed this coming gen, AND the PS4 is technically more powerful.

Bringing up PS3 vs. 360 is about as strawman as you can get when discussing the development/power situation between the X1 and PS4.


The argument still works because the ps3 was
Not superior in every aspect. It had less usable ram than the 360 but fanboys swore then that it didnt matter.

Truth is that the ps4 is not 50% more powerful or youd see it already in there exclusives. But driveclub is still 30fps while forza is 60.

Power of the cell BS all over again.
#45SolisPosted 10/1/2013 10:25:42 PM
Ryzeki posted...
The only way by which resolution would have a linear change in framerate is when the game is exactly bottlenecked by memory bandwith, and nothing in the game consumed memory bandwidth in a dynamic matter.

Hence, it is almost impossible to see changes in a linear manner. Jumps can be small steps or even exponential decrease in performance depending on what is taxing the system. GPU utilization is nothing on it's own. A game is comprised of many things, and resolution is almost exclusively dependent on the memory bandwidth available when everything else is more than enough.

But I agree that a 100% jump in performance from a small drop in res is too much.

Memory bandwidth isn't the only thing that a higher resolution strains, though. The entire rendering process is still repeated for each pixel, you can have all the memory bandwidth in the world and it won't matter if the GPU is being bottlenecked by other aspects. Although again, if you aren't being limited by SOMETHING in the GPU, then it wasn't being fully utilized to begin with. Although the only time you would see a decrease of MORE than half the framerate from doubling the resolution is if the extra framebuffer size is larger than the available graphics memory available, which wouldn't really happen on a console like the Xbox One where the framebuffer cache is more than large enough for a full 1080p image. It's not really realistic otherwise for double the work to require more than double the time to complete.


zephirraines posted...
The argument still works because the ps3 was
Not superior in every aspect. It had less usable ram than the 360 but fanboys swore then that it didnt matter.

Truth is that the ps4 is not 50% more powerful or youd see it already in there exclusives. But driveclub is still 30fps while forza is 60.

Power of the cell BS all over again.

Facts matter. Marketing gimmicks don't. "The Cell" didn't make up for the PS3's slower GPU, just as "The Cloud" won't make up for the Xbox One's slower GPU. It's really undeniable that the PS4 has a better GPU at this point, and that will absolutely have an effect on how games run on the system. After all, if hardware didn't matter, then Xbox games shouldn't have looked or ran any better than PS2 games.
---
"Walking tanks must exist somewhere for there to be such attention to detail like this in mech sim." - IGN Steel Battalion review
#46CapnStankyPosted 10/1/2013 10:27:52 PM
BkzIzu posted...
http://www.gameblog.fr/news/38402-xbox-one-des-developpeurs-confient-des-problemes-avec-les-dr
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=687295

Xbone can't catch a break


User Name BkzIzu
User ID 6790553
Board User Level 5: Warned
User on "parole" for one or more major Terms of Service violations. Can only post 3 messages per hour (10 per day), no topics, restored after 48-72 hours.

lulz
#47EvilScythePosted 10/1/2013 10:37:36 PM
Still nothing worthwhile to talk about on the PS4 boards, eh guys? Pathetic.
#48kyncaniPosted 10/2/2013 8:36:47 AM
zephirraines posted...
82xeno posted...
TrickyPony posted...
SunDevil77 posted...
embrandedone posted...
100 USD more

50 percent less powerful.

Thanks, MS


You're a sad, sad man.


While I doubt it's true, suppose the 50% thing is true. We learned last gen with PS3 being way more powerful with teh cell that it was unable to keep up with 360 in 90% of the games. These systems are both more powerful than the current systems, a lot more powerful than say the games will improve, I don't think game devs will be efficiently maxing either out.
Still going with my X1 preorder to start this gen.


This argument is getting old.

The PS3 was loads harder to develop for than the 360.

That situation is reversed this coming gen, AND the PS4 is technically more powerful.

Bringing up PS3 vs. 360 is about as strawman as you can get when discussing the development/power situation between the X1 and PS4.


The argument still works because the ps3 was
Not superior in every aspect. It had less usable ram than the 360 but fanboys swore then that it didnt matter.

Truth is that the ps4 is not 50% more powerful or youd see it already in there exclusives. But driveclub is still 30fps while forza is 60.

Power of the cell BS all over again.


The PS3 had complete bullcrap hardware with a higher price one year late to the party and they still sold more consoles than the Xbox 360 because they just had games.
This time the Xbox One has worse hardware, already alienated everyone with their bullcrap policies, focus on television, advertisement all over the place and absolutely no game.
It's going to be a slaughterhouse.
#49embrandedonePosted 10/2/2013 3:56:01 PM
Wonder if they knew beforehand about the locked GPU.
---
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzLUYX7M1SQ -- The Xbox One Board
#50SirLemontPosted 10/2/2013 4:53:40 PM
embrandedone posted...
Wonder if they knew beforehand about the locked GPU.


Dude. This is Microsoft we're talking about here.