So this day one update...

#1RetrowirePosted 10/2/2013 3:44:48 PM
You're required to download it, otherwise your console doesn't play games.

This is most likely the reason you'll be purchasing the console.

So this is Microsoft's surefire method of making sure that most, if not every owner of the Xbox One definitely has broadband internet access.

Those who do have broadband access are likely going to be more than willing to use that Kinect 2.0 and thanks to Microsoft's confirmation that you'll have broadband internet, the spying will again be possible.

It's funny how America's short attention span has led us all to forget all about PRISM. It's still happening, nothing has been done about it.

I have nothing against the XBox One, but I do have something against PRISM. Unfortunately, Microsoft and PRISM are still hand in hand and there hasn't been any new positive info on that front.

So, just sayin', buy your Xbox Ones! But keep that Kinect 2.0 in the box. Thank God it isn't mandatory anymore.
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#2s2goodPosted 10/2/2013 4:26:48 PM
If people don't have Internet is this day and age then, they don't deserve a next gen console.
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#3Ramsus082Posted 10/2/2013 4:33:30 PM
Did I get in before the first "You're a conspiracy-filled fanboy if you're concerned with your privacy over using Microsoft products" post? I hope so.
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#4NewMoonShadowPosted 10/2/2013 4:35:22 PM
But laptops have cameras too. That makes everything Microsoft is doing and will ever do okay.
#5Ramsus082Posted 10/2/2013 4:42:17 PM
NewMoonShadow posted...
But laptops have cameras too. That makes everything Microsoft is doing and will ever do okay.


Yeah, I never understood that line of thought. We have to be afraid of unwarranted surveillance with every single device we own because we're skeptical about how Kinect 2.0 might be utilized due to the company's confirmed role in spying on citizens? Ridiculous.
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#6BudWisenheimerPosted 10/2/2013 4:45:21 PM
Retrowire posted...
I have nothing against the XBox One, but I do have something against PRISM. Unfortunately, Microsoft and PRISM are still hand in hand and there hasn't been any new positive info on that front.


What is it that is supposed to be the problem here? I never heard what the actual consequences are for Xbone owners. Is it just a feeling of invasion? Or does something tangible actually happen? Any real ramifications?

I really am interested. But I have to warn you that I actually like targeted advertising. So I don't consider that to be downside at all. But that's not related to PRISM as far as I know.

What are the actual repercussions from PRISM?
#7Ramsus082Posted 10/2/2013 4:59:05 PM
BudWisenheimer posted...

What is it that is supposed to be the problem here?

It's the invasion of privacy, and for some that has real consequences, and for other it's more an abstract concept that just doesn't sit comfortably.

Is it just a feeling of invasion?

There's definitely that, particularly for people who are uncomfortable with the fact that what they thought they were doing in private isn't actually private. That could be something innocent but still uncomfortable, like undressing in front of a webcam, or something less-innocent but still conducted under the expectation of privacy, like plopping on the couch and lighting up a blunt after a hard day of work. If you know what you're doing isn't private anymore, it changes things.


Or does something tangible actually happen? Any real ramifications?


Yeah, there's the very-real fear that the information obtained by being spied on could be used to incriminate you, even retroactively. The government could pass around your data to other agencies, or parse through your entire electronic history further if you've been indicted on criminal charges for something, big or small.

Here's an instance of where this has already happened:

http://rt.com/usa/drug-agency-investigated-wiretapping-evidence-139/

"US drug agency unit to be investigated for wiretapping, lying about evidence sources

But I have to warn you that I actually like targeted advertising. So I don't consider that to be downside at all.


I actually don't mind it at all. If I'm getting ads sent my way, I don't mind if they're curated based on my previous interests.

What are the actual repercussions from PRISM?


It's also really important not to just be comfortable with the invasion of privacy for the sake of staying comfortable. This is really, really a case where the slippery slope argument actually carries some weight; If this is ok, then progression of it could be ok as well. If it doesn't stop where the country demands it to, then where does it? When and where should the country demand it to stop? How far down the line should this policy go before enough is enough?

The argument is that now is enough, and we shouldn't just get comfortable with the fact that the government is spying on it's citizens to this degree, and we definitely shouldn't try to convince other people to be comfortable with it.
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#8Ramsus082Posted 10/2/2013 5:11:04 PM(edited)
And let's be clear here, the fact that plenty of other American companies assist in spying doesn't mean that this whole thing is a wash.... "Well, other companies do it too and I don't see you complaining about them!" isn't a legitimate rebuttal. What proponents of that argument are trying to imply is that it's hypocritical to be concerned with one aspect of your privacy and not the others, but they're missing the point; We can't be afraid about every single device in our lives, we don't work that way, and even if people did, being on the list of confirmed companies turns your garden-variety anxiety into credible paranoia. Credible is the key word there.

Being comfortable with your privacy in this day and age takes a little bit of purposeful naivety. It's necessary to get through our lives without tearing our hair out and over-worrying ourselves to death or at least a lower standard of living. But you can't be purposefully naive when you know, with 100% certainty, that you're using a product by a company who's unarguably involved with spying on it's consumers.
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#9BudWisenheimerPosted 10/2/2013 5:18:03 PM
Ramsus082 posted...
It's also really important not to just be comfortable with the invasion of privacy for the sake of staying comfortable. This is really, really a case where the slippery slope argument actually carries some weight; If this is ok, then progression of it could be ok as well. If it doesn't stop where the country demands it to, then where does it? When and where should the country demand it to stop? How far down the line should this policy go before enough is enough?

The argument is that now is enough, and we shouldn't just get comfortable with the fact that the government is spying on it's citizens to this degree, and we definitely shouldn't try to convince other people to be comfortable with it.


The link is having trouble connecting here. I'll check it later. But I completely understand the feeling of invasion being a deterrent for people even if it isn't a deterrent for me. I probably won't ever use social media for similar reasons.

I guess I just want to make sure there wasn't any actual risk involved that I missed because I haven't read any updated articles about the Kinect spying or whatnot. From what I know about my Internet I can always monitor how much data is going out. And from which devices. With the number of people doing this I'm certain we will hear about it quickly if there are any shenanigans with the Kinect uploading video or sound. So I don't think we're even at the slope yet when it comes to this particular product. Never mind slipping down to the bottom.
#10kyncaniPosted 10/2/2013 5:50:42 PM
Ramsus082 posted...
NewMoonShadow posted...
But laptops have cameras too. That makes everything Microsoft is doing and will ever do okay.


Yeah, I never understood that line of thought. We have to be afraid of unwarranted surveillance with every single device we own because we're skeptical about how Kinect 2.0 might be utilized due to the company's confirmed role in spying on citizens? Ridiculous.


Just five days ago, a pervert uses webcams to steal nude images and blackmail his victims.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/09/26/justice/miss-teen-usa-sextortion/?hpt=hp_c2


Of course an online camera with 3d capabilities that can frigging see in the dark is a privacy issue.