Am i the only one who wanted the Xbox One as Microsoft originally promised?

#71KID VIDPosted 12/4/2013 1:09:02 AM
Where the hell were all of you supporters months ago? We could of used you back then to actually have meaningful discussions of the new system before the trolls took over the board.
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Xbox LIVE Gamertag: KIDD VIDD
#72aszsithPosted 12/4/2013 1:59:37 AM
Personally, I think MS should never have given in to the pressures of the second hand market supporters. This would be a non-issue if they hadn't. Why should they cater to a group of selfish consumers who want to subvert the profitability of them and their partners?

Basically, MS TRIED to do something that would benefit the publishers (which they are one), but gamers who like used games and/or have internet issues weren't happy about it. The squeaky wheel gets oiled, as they say. Lack of sufficient education and self-entitlement have really had a major impact on the game market, sadly.

So here are the results:

Everyone is forced to choose between all digital (which people with bandwidth caps complained about in the first place) or buy physical and be needlessly required to use a potentially defective drive (worst case), and to have a disc sitting in the system while your hard drive fills up with required installs (best case). The system was designed to not run games from the disc, and that won't change.

And like it or not, DRM is only going to get worse as self-entitled, uneducated consumers continue to complain that they aren't getting everything they want (plus some) for less than they should reasonably be required to pay.

In regards to DRM, you didn't like online passes? Fine. You'll get micro transactions instead and tons of freemium or pay-to-win games. What, you don't want those either? Well too bad. Publishers want to make a profit off of their product and the beloved second hand games market that costs them actual money, not just additional profit. Publishers support the servers, they should have the ability to charge you a reasonable price for that service, regardless of how much you handed Gamestop or the guy on ebay. Games aren't cars. They require the company to support them long after purchase. The used market hurts the industry and in the end, all consumers. And all because of the ones too short sighted to realize this is how it works because they want their cake, they want to eat it too, and they feel they should be able to pay what they want for it regardless of any other factors.
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I own a XBOne, PS3, XBOX360, and Wii. I'm in it for the gameplay, not the logo on the box. Can you say the same?
#73Fredrick2003xPosted 12/4/2013 2:10:11 AM
aszsith posted...
Personally, I think MS should never have given in to the pressures of the second hand market supporters. This would be a non-issue if they hadn't. Why should they cater to a group of selfish consumers who want to subvert the profitability of them and their partners?

Basically, MS TRIED to do something that would benefit the publishers (which they are one), but gamers who like used games and/or have internet issues weren't happy about it. The squeaky wheel gets oiled, as they say. Lack of sufficient education and self-entitlement have really had a major impact on the game market, sadly.

So here are the results:

Everyone is forced to choose between all digital (which people with bandwidth caps complained about in the first place) or buy physical and be needlessly required to use a potentially defective drive (worst case), and to have a disc sitting in the system while your hard drive fills up with required installs (best case). The system was designed to not run games from the disc, and that won't change.

And like it or not, DRM is only going to get worse as self-entitled, uneducated consumers continue to complain that they aren't getting everything they want (plus some) for less than they should reasonably be required to pay.

In regards to DRM, you didn't like online passes? Fine. You'll get micro transactions instead and tons of freemium or pay-to-win games. What, you don't want those either? Well too bad. Publishers want to make a profit off of their product and the beloved second hand games market that costs them actual money, not just additional profit. Publishers support the servers, they should have the ability to charge you a reasonable price for that service, regardless of how much you handed Gamestop or the guy on ebay. Games aren't cars. They require the company to support them long after purchase. The used market hurts the industry and in the end, all consumers. And all because of the ones too short sighted to realize this is how it works because they want their cake, they want to eat it too, and they feel they should be able to pay what they want for it regardless of any other factors.


I don't see how the second hand games market is costing them any additional money. Once a game console is discontinued... what should happen? We shouldn't be allowed to use it or acquire new games for it anymore? That seems pretty selfish on their part.

Like, Crystal Dynamics didn't see any money when I recently purchased Crash N Burn on the 3DO, should they have? But Crystal Dynamics received money when I pre-purchased Tomb Raider on PC (some of us do buy games). I think consumers should be able to purchase old and new games.
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Currently Playing: Hatsune Miku Project Diva F (CFM, 2012) - Alan Wake (Remedy, 2010)
#74jpraelsterPosted 12/4/2013 2:42:14 AM
Family share should have never been taken away the only reason it did was because microsoft was angry that their plan to screw gamers everywhere didnt work so they had to be babies about it and take family sharing away
#75aszsithPosted 12/4/2013 2:49:36 AM
Fredrick2003x posted...
aszsith posted...
Personally, I think MS should never have given in to the pressures of the second hand market supporters. This would be a non-issue if they hadn't. Why should they cater to a group of selfish consumers who want to subvert the profitability of them and their partners?

Basically, MS TRIED to do something that would benefit the publishers (which they are one), but gamers who like used games and/or have internet issues weren't happy about it. The squeaky wheel gets oiled, as they say. Lack of sufficient education and self-entitlement have really had a major impact on the game market, sadly.

So here are the results:

Everyone is forced to choose between all digital (which people with bandwidth caps complained about in the first place) or buy physical and be needlessly required to use a potentially defective drive (worst case), and to have a disc sitting in the system while your hard drive fills up with required installs (best case). The system was designed to not run games from the disc, and that won't change.

And like it or not, DRM is only going to get worse as self-entitled, uneducated consumers continue to complain that they aren't getting everything they want (plus some) for less than they should reasonably be required to pay.

In regards to DRM, you didn't like online passes? Fine. You'll get micro transactions instead and tons of freemium or pay-to-win games. What, you don't want those either? Well too bad. Publishers want to make a profit off of their product and the beloved second hand games market that costs them actual money, not just additional profit. Publishers support the servers, they should have the ability to charge you a reasonable price for that service, regardless of how much you handed Gamestop or the guy on ebay. Games aren't cars. They require the company to support them long after purchase. The used market hurts the industry and in the end, all consumers. And all because of the ones too short sighted to realize this is how it works because they want their cake, they want to eat it too, and they feel they should be able to pay what they want for it regardless of any other factors.


I don't see how the second hand games market is costing them any additional money. Once a game console is discontinued... what should happen? We shouldn't be allowed to use it or acquire new games for it anymore? That seems pretty selfish on their part.

Like, Crystal Dynamics didn't see any money when I recently purchased Crash N Burn on the 3DO, should they have? But Crystal Dynamics received money when I pre-purchased Tomb Raider on PC (some of us do buy games). I think consumers should be able to purchase old and new games.


Not exactly the same used market, and you know it. Current games have current servers. This isn't about classic gaming.

Trying to make a logical point on here is completely pointless when everyone is so fired up with picking a winning pony.
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I own a XBOne, PS3, XBOX360, and Wii. I'm in it for the gameplay, not the logo on the box. Can you say the same?
#76YMIHerePosted 12/4/2013 3:52:09 AM
aszsith posted...
DelRowe posted...
Why would you like 24-hour check in and mandatory Kinect? How does that benefit the consumer? It doesn't. It's unconventional and restricting.


Sure. I have internet, and my Kinect is plugged in and on. And, if the system allowed for EITHER playing from the disc OR playing digitally from an installed disc with a required 24hr check, how would providing TWO options be MORE restricting than the SINGULAR option we have now?

Why is it that everything with the Internet herd has to be so damn cynical and singular minded these days?


Do you have a memory problem sir? There was only one option in their plan as well, it just so happened their plan gave them complete control of the second hand market. They could have made an opt in system, or even kept the plan for digital titles only, but they didn't. Not for some technical reason, but because they couldn't see themselves raking in as much money if they didn't control the entire secondhand market.
#77Fredrick2003xPosted 12/4/2013 9:46:16 AM(edited)
aszsith posted...
Fredrick2003x posted...
aszsith posted...
Personally, I think MS should never have given in to the pressures of the second hand market supporters. This would be a non-issue if they hadn't. Why should they cater to a group of selfish consumers who want to subvert the profitability of them and their partners?

Basically, MS TRIED to do something that would benefit the publishers (which they are one), but gamers who like used games and/or have internet issues weren't happy about it. The squeaky wheel gets oiled, as they say. Lack of sufficient education and self-entitlement have really had a major impact on the game market, sadly.

So here are the results:

Everyone is forced to choose between all digital (which people with bandwidth caps complained about in the first place) or buy physical and be needlessly required to use a potentially defective drive (worst case), and to have a disc sitting in the system while your hard drive fills up with required installs (best case). The system was designed to not run games from the disc, and that won't change.

And like it or not, DRM is only going to get worse as self-entitled, uneducated consumers continue to complain that they aren't getting everything they want (plus some) for less than they should reasonably be required to pay.

In regards to DRM, you didn't like online passes? Fine. You'll get micro transactions instead and tons of freemium or pay-to-win games. What, you don't want those either? Well too bad. Publishers want to make a profit off of their product and the beloved second hand games market that costs them actual money, not just additional profit. Publishers support the servers, they should have the ability to charge you a reasonable price for that service, regardless of how much you handed Gamestop or the guy on ebay. Games aren't cars. They require the company to support them long after purchase. The used market hurts the industry and in the end, all consumers. And all because of the ones too short sighted to realize this is how it works because they want their cake, they want to eat it too, and they feel they should be able to pay what they want for it regardless of any other factors.


I don't see how the second hand games market is costing them any additional money. Once a game console is discontinued... what should happen? We shouldn't be allowed to use it or acquire new games for it anymore? That seems pretty selfish on their part.

Like, Crystal Dynamics didn't see any money when I recently purchased Crash N Burn on the 3DO, should they have? But Crystal Dynamics received money when I pre-purchased Tomb Raider on PC (some of us do buy games). I think consumers should be able to purchase old and new games.


Not exactly the same used market, and you know it. Current games have current servers. This isn't about classic gaming.

Trying to make a logical point on here is completely pointless when everyone is so fired up with picking a winning pony.


But you said you want to kill the second hand market, and without that, there would not be any way to experience Xbox One games in the distant future, since everybody would own the games and there would not be a way to exchange them or acquire more.

How is not the same used market? I picked up that 3DO game at the same place I picked up Space Marine for 360?
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Currently Playing: Hatsune Miku Project Diva F (CFM, 2012) - Alan Wake (Remedy, 2010)
#78aya469Posted 12/4/2013 10:14:44 AM
I think they could've quelled some of the anger towards them just by allowing people to play the games they own if they missed the 24 hour check in (due to internet connectivity issues or whatnot) by actually placing the disc in their system. Once people heard that if they missed that check in they wouldn't have access to their games, that was off-putting to a lot of people.
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#79Bikes-Posted 12/4/2013 10:21:04 AM
Switch to PC, all the benefits of the X1's original plan but executed with competence (at least steam, some other services not so much, but they're the minority)

That aside no one should be agreeing with the original plan, history proves it's a awful idea (Remember Diablo 3, Simcity 2012 and the launch of every MMO ever?, imagine that for the entire console. That and as others have discussed once the servers are pulled for good you're stuck with a brick)
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#80Fredrick2003xPosted 12/4/2013 10:28:58 AM
Bikes- posted...
Switch to PC, all the benefits of the X1's original plan but executed with competence (at least steam, some other services not so much, but they're the minority)

That aside no one should be agreeing with the original plan, history proves it's a awful idea (Remember Diablo 3, Simcity 2012 and the launch of every MMO ever?, imagine that for the entire console. That and as others have discussed once the servers are pulled for good you're stuck with a brick)


PC is the only place I trust digital distribution, but even then, I really like to own physical copies and I am considering going PS4 exclusive in the coming generation. It just doesn't feel like you own anything when you can't pick it up off your shelf.
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Currently Playing: Hatsune Miku Project Diva F (CFM, 2012) - Alan Wake (Remedy, 2010)