does any one else think ms should of keep the drm

#11HiddenRoarPosted 1/9/2014 10:39:44 PM
Exxex posted...
^^^^

Standerd? Derp.

Stop making idiotic topics tc. Go exersice, or read a thesaurus.
And you.

You too.


Wtf is "Standerd"

That's not even a ******* real word.
#12ExxexPosted 1/9/2014 10:44:53 PM
Not you. It was meant for the guy above the guy above you.

People who can't spell piss me off.

Especially tc.
#13HiddenRoarPosted 1/9/2014 10:52:55 PM
Exxex posted...
Not you. It was meant for the guy above the guy above you.

People who can't spell piss me off.

Especially tc.


That guy's on crack to think the Xbox One is innovative when no games actively use the Kinect other than for gimmicks or "casual games" (Just Dance).
Literally a Xbox 361 if he wants to call the PS4 a PS3.5
#14ExxexPosted 1/9/2014 10:58:20 PM
HiddenRoar posted...
Exxex posted...
Not you. It was meant for the guy above the guy above you.

People who can't spell piss me off.

Especially tc.


That guy's on crack to think the Xbox One is innovative when no games actively use the Kinect other than for gimmicks or "casual games" (Just Dance).
Literally a Xbox 361 if he wants to call the PS4 a PS3.5


Pretty much. Innovation doesn't come broken right out of the box.
#15game freakozoidPosted 1/9/2014 11:08:16 PM
First off, they didn't bow to the whims of a minority. The vast majority was against it which is why when preorder numbers came in they rapidly reversed the policies. It wasn't the (humongous) backlash that got them to change but the actual fact that people were voting with their wallets.

Secondly, thinking that steam type sales would happen is absolutely foolish. As others pointed out, steam has to do that to stay in competition with its competitors. It's competitors also have big sales from time to time. Microsoft however has no competitors when it comes to buying their Xbox One games digitally. They are a closed system and our only option. They don't need to compete. It's the same reason why Xbox 360 never had those types of sales so yes, there is precedence.

Micro sorts policy ideas were terrible and were an attempt to kill one of the last advantages of consoles so they could swindle consumers out of their money.
#16aszsithPosted 1/10/2014 12:18:48 AM
game freakozoid posted...
First off, they didn't bow to the whims of a minority. The vast majority was against it which is why when preorder numbers came in they rapidly reversed the policies. It wasn't the (humongous) backlash that got them to change but the actual fact that people were voting with their wallets.

Secondly, thinking that steam type sales would happen is absolutely foolish. As others pointed out, steam has to do that to stay in competition with its competitors. It's competitors also have big sales from time to time. Microsoft however has no competitors when it comes to buying their Xbox One games digitally. They are a closed system and our only option. They don't need to compete. It's the same reason why Xbox 360 never had those types of sales so yes, there is precedence.

Micro sorts policy ideas were terrible and were an attempt to kill one of the last advantages of consoles so they could swindle consumers out of their money.


The vast majority? So early adopters all of a sudden qualify as the largest portion of the gaming community? And the vast majority of people cried foul across the Internet?

You can throw sensationalized extremes out to attempt to prove your point, but you don't make a very compelling argument when you do so, especially when your argument is in direct opposition of logic and reality.

In reality the vast majority of XBOne purchasers, over the life of the unit, will not be comprised of the early adopters who preordered it. In reality, the vast majority do not flock to the Internet to complain about features of a high-tech toy. Unfortunately, the vocal minority is very loud and motivated and Microsoft got scared that they potentially represented the entire community. While potentially true, it could also be potentially untrue.

Look at the vast majority of people who buy content on mobile platforms. They gladly purchase tons of micro transactions for games they barely play in some cases. Then a new device comes out and they buy it all again. But they never complain about it. Because the vast majority are too uninformed to know about these things or understand how they work. Only the vocal minority bother to do their research before heading out to retail.
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ALL games should have a Single Player mode. I can always guarantee I want to play when I turn on my system. I can't guarantee others will at the same time.
#17Spetsnaz420Posted 1/10/2014 12:29:33 AM
Question TC...
Why would there need to be intrusive DRM to have good prices on digital software? They can already do that with the current level of DRM... MS has no reason to price digital content lower so they don't.
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I don't conform to social convention
PS4 or Xbox... Why not Zoidberg?
#18game freakozoidPosted 1/10/2014 10:55:43 AM
The vast majority? So early adopters all of a sudden qualify as the largest portion of the gaming community? And the vast majority of people cried foul across the Internet?

You can throw sensationalized extremes out to attempt to prove your point, but you don't make a very compelling argument when you do so, especially when your argument is in direct opposition of logic and reality.


It's not sensationalized when it is true. Do you even know what that means? Microsoft kept saying that they were sticking to policy and then the actual preorder numbers came in and they were getting completely trounced. Public website polls like Amazon pulled their polls early because Sony was already winning the polls by 95% and growing, and these weren't isolated cases. If the majority hadn't fought back against this and the majority in fact supported Microsoft, they wouldn't have changed their stance. And I do have to say that it was cute for you to try to strawman what I said, but in the future let's not do that. It really doesn't help your case.

In reality the vast majority of XBOne purchasers, over the life of the unit, will not be comprised of the early adopters who preordered it. In reality, the vast majority do not flock to the Internet to complain about features of a high-tech toy. Unfortunately, the vocal minority is very loud and motivated and Microsoft got scared that they potentially represented the entire community. While potentially true, it could also be potentially untrue.


More and more nowadays people actually are putting research into their buys, especially when those purchases are costing them hundreds and hundreds of dollars. Your entire argument here depends on the fact that only early adopters cared about what was going on. Especially when you have cases like polls asking which console people were more likely to buy, them saying PS4, and then asking if they were going to preorder and wait and most said they would wait.

Not to mention that starting numbers and people buying a console at the start is crucial. It will influence support for that console and also helps influence future sales. People will want to buy the same console that their friends own after all. I honestly don't understand where you are getting that it was just a small minority when you then present absolutely no evidence to show that.

Look at the vast majority of people who buy content on mobile platforms. They gladly purchase tons of micro transactions for games they barely play in some cases. Then a new device comes out and they buy it all again. But they never complain about it. Because the vast majority are too uninformed to know about these things or understand how they work. Only the vocal minority bother to do their research before heading out to retail.


You do realize that you just defeated your own argument right and conceded that you agreed with me. I flat out said that people vote with their wallet. You just gave an example of how people are voting with their wallet on what they will and will not allow. Thank you for proving my point. And also, many times they will complain, but the difference in what they are purchasing is hundreds of dollars worth and so not a big enough deal to forego it. You are comparing a couple dollar in app purchase to $500. Voting with your wallet is very effective and it is why Microsoft changed their policies. Why else do you think it happened so soon after the preorder numbers came in?
#19aszsithPosted 1/10/2014 11:58:51 AM
game freakozoid posted...

It's not sensationalized when it is true. Do you even know what that means? Microsoft kept saying that they were sticking to policy and then the actual preorder numbers came in and they were getting completely trounced. Public website polls like Amazon pulled their polls early because Sony was already winning the polls by 95% and growing, and these weren't isolated cases. If the majority hadn't fought back against this and the majority in fact supported Microsoft, they wouldn't have changed their stance. And I do have to say that it was cute for you to try to strawman what I said, but in the future let's not do that. It really doesn't help your case.

More and more nowadays people actually are putting research into their buys, especially when those purchases are costing them hundreds and hundreds of dollars. Your entire argument here depends on the fact that only early adopters cared about what was going on. Especially when you have cases like polls asking which console people were more likely to buy, them saying PS4, and then asking if they were going to preorder and wait and most said they would wait.

Not to mention that starting numbers and people buying a console at the start is crucial. It will influence support for that console and also helps influence future sales. People will want to buy the same console that their friends own after all. I honestly don't understand where you are getting that it was just a small minority when you then present absolutely no evidence to show that.

You do realize that you just defeated your own argument right and conceded that you agreed with me. I flat out said that people vote with their wallet. You just gave an example of how people are voting with their wallet on what they will and will not allow. Thank you for proving my point. And also, many times they will complain, but the difference in what they are purchasing is hundreds of dollars worth and so not a big enough deal to forego it. You are comparing a couple dollar in app purchase to $500. Voting with your wallet is very effective and it is why Microsoft changed their policies. Why else do you think it happened so soon after the preorder numbers came in?


Unfortunately saying something is true doesn't make it so. You are sensationalizing because you contend certain assumptions to be true without regard for logic. You are ignoring reality though. Oh, and you have provided zero evidence as well.

The people who take online polls and come to the Internet for research, or leave reviews/comments ARE NOT THE MAJORITY. Only a SMALL portion of purchasers do that. For example, the XBOne has 1313 reviews on Best Buy right now. That is a SMALL percentage of people who actually purchased one from the chain (and some are possibly troll or shill reviews as well).

If Microsoft was basing their business decisions on the early adopters they would cancel XBOne production right now because it isn't selling as well as they hoped. This is indicated by the readily available stock. They produced what they expected to sell, but didn't sell what they produced. They aren't canceling production though because they plan to sell 10's of millions of units, and the first 5 million users don't mean as much as you contend they do.

Your main argument was people vote with their wallet. My point was they do and will buy anything, including items with strict DRM, which you said too, but somehow disagree with.

Arguing this is pointless. It is what it is, and the dissenters won. For now. Because anyone who thinks Microsoft won't try to see their original vision by slowly rolling out those features is shortsighted. The XBOne may not be what was originally announced right now, but it will become that over time.
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ALL games should have a Single Player mode. I can always guarantee I want to play when I turn on my system. I can't guarantee others will at the same time.
#20game freakozoidPosted 1/10/2014 4:13:35 PM

Unfortunately saying something is true doesn't make it so. You are sensationalizing because you contend certain assumptions to be true without regard for logic. You are ignoring reality though. Oh, and you have provided zero evidence as well.


You realize that saying something isn't true doesn't make it so either. There is no sensationalizing, there is just reporting what happened. http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update is where they talk about they are reversing their policies due to feedback. Note that the feedback happened every since the initial reveal and even after E3. However they kept that they were going forward with these policies anyways. The Xbox One was available for preorder after E3, which was a month after all the negative criticism and 'vocal minority' as you put it started calling it out. That didn't change at E3 and they maintained that they wouldn't change their policies. What did change? Preorder numbers started coming in and THAT wasn't even close to what Microsoft wanted and most sites where showing that PS4 was dominating. It was THEN that they changed their policy.

The people who take online polls and come to the Internet for research, or leave reviews/comments ARE NOT THE MAJORITY. Only a SMALL portion of purchasers do that. For example, the XBOne has 1313 reviews on Best Buy right now. That is a SMALL percentage of people who actually purchased one from the chain (and some are possibly troll or shill reviews as well).


You have this ridiculous notion that people that do online polls and research stuff are somehow completely different then the people that don't even though that's never been true for really anything when it comes to purchasing. You also have the ridiculous notion that people that spend that much money don't really do any research. Yes some don't, but those are in the minority with how tight money is for most people and how easy it is to look something up.

If Microsoft was basing their business decisions on the early adopters they would cancel XBOne production right now because it isn't selling as well as they hoped. This is indicated by the readily available stock. They produced what they expected to sell, but didn't sell what they produced. They aren't canceling production though because they plan to sell 10's of millions of units, and the first 5 million users don't mean as much as you contend they do.


Nice, this is where you prove that you have no idea what you are talking about. Seeing as how Microsoft DID change their business decisions right after the preorders, it shows that your first statement is false. For it to be correct, they would have had to still have the same DRM policies. And they were able to manufacture more in America than the current demand required but that doesn't mean that they didn't hit their goal. In fact they have repeatedly excitedly talked about how fast their console is selling and it is currently the second fasting selling console of all time behind the PS4. These consoles are shattering records.

Your main argument was people vote with their wallet. My point was they do and will buy anything, including items with strict DRM, which you said too, but somehow disagree with.


People voted with their wallet by saying no. That original no proves that your "people will buy anything" argument is flawed at best. People are willing to buy items with DRM because of things like they are extremely cheap, are a great deal, and they have options. None of that was available with a $500 Xbox One. You are again trying to strawman the argument here.