Xbox / PS4 performance

#41mygoodluckcharmPosted 3/26/2014 7:42:07 AM
chex81 posted...
RS_YELARAKA posted...
I laugh when I read topics with a ton of pony boys on my ignore list getting quoted spouting off garbage. Just confirms why they've been ignored.


Same, every thread on this board...and the boards main page constantly reminds me that theres a group of people with little going on in their lives and they use their large amounts of time to PROTECT Sony...for reasons i cannot comprehend. This board has really gotten out of hand, i know the mods like these threads as they sustain heavy traffic for debates but its gotten very annoying. Last gen was not even 1/2 this bad.


Yet there's so many people like you waste their time protecting M$ for some reason I couldn't understand either.
#42Ryan-06Posted 3/26/2014 7:46:24 AM
mygoodluckcharm posted...
chex81 posted...
RS_YELARAKA posted...
I laugh when I read topics with a ton of pony boys on my ignore list getting quoted spouting off garbage. Just confirms why they've been ignored.


Same, every thread on this board...and the boards main page constantly reminds me that theres a group of people with little going on in their lives and they use their large amounts of time to PROTECT Sony...for reasons i cannot comprehend. This board has really gotten out of hand, i know the mods like these threads as they sustain heavy traffic for debates but its gotten very annoying. Last gen was not even 1/2 this bad.


Yet there's so many people like you waste their time protecting M$ for some reason I couldn't understand either.


Owned. Cuts both ways. Does MDF not realize that?
---
chart: http://ow.ly/uuJ6g
chocolate: http://ow.ly/t0gvj, http://ow.ly/t0g1Y
#43chex81Posted 3/26/2014 7:57:30 AM
mygoodluckcharm posted...
chex81 posted...
RS_YELARAKA posted...
I laugh when I read topics with a ton of pony boys on my ignore list getting quoted spouting off garbage. Just confirms why they've been ignored.


Same, every thread on this board...and the boards main page constantly reminds me that theres a group of people with little going on in their lives and they use their large amounts of time to PROTECT Sony...for reasons i cannot comprehend. This board has really gotten out of hand, i know the mods like these threads as they sustain heavy traffic for debates but its gotten very annoying. Last gen was not even 1/2 this bad.


Yet there's so many people like you waste their time protecting M$ for some reason I couldn't understand either.


Where am i defending MS? I equally enjoy my 360/PS3/X1/WiiU...i do not conform to a brand. You even went out of your way to add the "$" in MS. I'm hardly a fanboy, i enjoy my Xbox One and like discussing the consoles games, even enjoy rational debates that make sense...then we have the Sony Fanboys that spend more time HERE than on their own board. Why are you even here? Oh right i forgot...need to remind myself again that for some reason you believe its in your blood to defend a brand...constantly...24/7...or else your life will be void of meaning lol.
---
XB1/WiiU/PSN: chex81
#44EiffelPosted 3/26/2014 10:31:00 AM
TC, the X1 is significantly less powerful than the PS4. They do have the same "guts" in that they both use AMD Jaguar CPU cores and GCN graphics but the X1 comes with more compromises. What can be patched on the X1 is the GPU reservation, currently there is a 10% system reservation for Kinect but this could be reduced to 2% for a boost in performance iirc.

MS wanted 8GB RAM for their multimedia aspirations and thought at the time that the only way to do this was to go with DDR3 system memory. Sony bet on GDDR5 and got lucky in that they were able to put 8GB in the PS4 when production rolled around; initially the thought was they would only have 2GB, then later on up to the reveal everyone thought it would be 4GB, at the PS4 reveal it was bumped up to 8GB.

DDR3 RAM is too slow for modern graphics so a band-aid was needed. MS went with 32MB ESRAM on-die to compensate. The 360 had 10MB eDRAM as a daughter die and this worked quite well for them. The trouble was that if they again went with eDRAM they would be limited to one manufacturer and it might not have been able to be on-die so would have to be a daughter die again. ESRAM could be integrated on-die and would be cheaper in the long run. The trouble is size, apparently the same amount of eDRAM would have taken up 1/4 the space the ESRAM does so if they had gone with eDRAM they could have had twice the memory and still had more room for additional GPU CU's, for example. The problem MS has is that the band-aid isn't big enough, 128MB or even 64MB would have worked well but 32MB is just too little to get the job done.

Since Sony used GDDR5 they didn't need a band-aid and could have more GPU with a similar size APU as the X1. The PS4's GPU has 50% more CU's and double the ROP's. This allows for more GPU compute to be used in the future to take a load off the weaker Jaguar CPU cores. X1 won't be able to do this to anywhere near the same extent.

Speaking of CPU, MS upclocked theirs to 175Ghz prior to launch so it was thought that the X1's CPU would out perform the PS4 (both have 8 Jag cores and Sony was thought to be at 1.6Ghz). However, a benchmark test after launch showed the PS4 CPU outperforms the X1's. Sony hasn't released their CPU clock so there is debate whether it's clocked at 2Ghz or if there is less system reservation (only one core reserved for OS vs 2 reserved on X1). At any rate, the PS4 CPU outperforms the X1's.

DX12 and the Cloud won't change this. The X1 currently runs on the Mono Driver which is DX with everything not related to X1 stripped out and X1 specific customizations added in. It's already very low level, the only way DX12 will improve the situation is if MS completely ****ed up the Mono Driver which isn't likely. Of course there will be imrovements to the API over time but the same is true of the PS4. DX12 is more of a benefit on the PC side offering a low-level "console like" API similar to AMD's Mantle. The Cloud has been pretty much debunked, there isn't enough bandwidth on the average connection to make any notable difference in realtime gameplay.

We are seeing the results of this in multiplat game releases. Comparing Ryse to Killzone is useless as it's apples to oranges. In multiplats you are seeing quite a bit of 1080p on PS4 and 720p on X1 which is more than 100% more pixels or 60fps on PS4 vs 30 on X1. Penello was all over GAF prior to launch saying there was no way the X1 would give up 30%; he was right, it's up to 100% performance difference.

It's a difficult adjustment, since the start the Xbox brand has always meant superior performance and that was the case for 12 years. Now that isn't the case and the gap is far bigger than the gap was last gen between the 360 and PS3. I know I found it tough to wrap my head around the new reality but that's how it is now. MS got arrogant just like Sony did leading up to the launch of the PS3 and are going to pay for it this gen.
#45dementedlullabyPosted 3/26/2014 10:41:05 AM
Sometimes I feel like one of those fat cats with a cigar in my mouth laughing manically.
---
The Imperial Truth is a Lie
#46sammogardPosted 3/26/2014 10:41:31 AM
why people get so uptight over graphics or specs is beyond me.

720 p is just as good as 1080 p imo its just being ocd and wanting the best on the market in peoples blood. i get it but i just bought my first hd tv ever and its 720 maxed out. using my 360 everything looks miles better i dont see how it could look any better.


as far as power unless you are a tech nut and have studdyed frame drop or screen tears w/e to the normal casual guy they wont even notice it. my advice dont learn it

don't worry about it pick the console on what exclusives and features call out to you.
#47EiffelPosted 3/26/2014 10:53:42 AM
Of course you should get the console that has the exclusives that appeal to you most and if that's the X1 enjoy it. However, saying that there isn't a difference between 720p and 1080p or no one can tell the difference between 30 and 60fps is just straight up denial and reassurance. It's kind of sad.

If X1 exclusives appeal more and you decide for whatever reason not to buy both consoles that's fine, enjoy your purchase. But you do have to realize that there is a massive performance difference because that is a fact. Multiplats won't be bad on X1, far from it, but they will be second best by a wide margin.
#48necro00Posted 3/26/2014 10:55:27 AM
sammogard posted...
why people get so uptight over graphics or specs is beyond me.

720 p is just as good as 1080 p imo its just being ocd and wanting the best on the market in peoples blood. i get it but i just bought my first hd tv ever and its 720 maxed out. using my 360 everything looks miles better i dont see how it could look any better.


as far as power unless you are a tech nut and have studdyed frame drop or screen tears w/e to the normal casual guy they wont even notice it. my advice dont learn it

don't worry about it pick the console on what exclusives and features call out to you.


Because if you spend 500 on a next gen system you dont expect 720 and 30fps for a majority of the playing experience.
#49ElitePosted 3/26/2014 10:56:17 AM
Golden Maven posted...
Just wait for DirectX12... Then we'll see where the consoles stand. Raw horsepower can only go so far.


So you don't think you need sufficient horsepower to power an entirely new API?
#50sammogardPosted 3/26/2014 10:56:44 AM
my buddy has a 1080p and i have a 720p tv put them side by side played the same downloaded file i sat there and couldn't tlel the difference

nor do i want to know the difference like i said ocd and perfection makes people want the best on the market.