Microsoft idiocy at it's best

#81TreGoodaPosted 4/4/2014 6:27:11 PM
Iemander posted...
N3xtG3nGam3r posted...

Again, you have no idea how it works. You dont have all the variables available to form an educated opinion about the topic at hand.

You dont connect your system to the server, and then magically have the power of 10 processors at the fingertips of your system. Thats not how they're going to go about this. They are going to render it on the server, and send small data to the system telling the system what piece needs to be where, and when.

That isnt fantasy at all. Thats how it works currently with MMO's, and thats the approach they COULD take with something like this. Or, they could have some completely different way of doing all of this that they haven't explained yet, because they are still working on it, and its in early development.

Say what you want, im not going to debate with you any more. You keep repeating the same uninformed stuff over, and over. Until we get the rest of the equation you cant say ''It wont work'', just like i cant say that ''It will work''.

Now i can say how i think it will work, and why i think it would work, just like you can say the opposite. But really, being pessimistic over something that is only going to better our experience as gamers, again (and i dont mean JUST you) just makes you [pessimists] look like *** holes.


Not really, I am very much informed and I have a very educated opinion.

It's simply impossible with the current cabling/server warehousing infrastructure and how the internet works to do this. I'm not saying this because I'm pessimistic, but because I understand how things work.

in the hypothetical situation that you are right, that would mean that Microsoft is using a system that completely circumvents everything that we know is related to the internet. We know they're not, Azure is a pretty well known service and utilizes the internet just like any other service.


You are an I D 10 t error
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#82TreGoodaPosted 4/4/2014 6:32:17 PM
Iemander posted...
N3xtG3nGam3r posted...

You are basing this on the fact that it will take some extreme amount of bandwidth. Thats what im saying, you (nor me) know what type of bandwidth will be required, or how much latency is acceptable to have the simulation still look good. They havent gone that far with their presentations yet.

Nvidia can render real time lighting on the server side, and even with up to 200ms delay, it still looks pretty good. Now, i dont know how much bandwidth is required to do that, but i can tell you that you can currently rent a set of servers, for 10$ a server, per hour, and within a browser, design a pixar level quality movie...over an internet connection...in real time. What seems so far fetched about what MS is doing?

Im beginning to think you're just arguing to argue.


Rendering physics in the cloud is complete bollocks. Every single operation needs to be calculated, which would mean that every 1/60th of a second there needs to be communication between you and server bidirectionally.

However, I must admit the cloudlight thing from nvidia is impressive. I just researched it and it's good stuff.


what's bollocks is people like you on forums acting like you know everything about computers and networking. I'm head of IT at my company and I wouldn't pretend to know what you do nor would any of the professionals I work with on a daily basis. Ask wiggidywhat, he works for me.
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#83Reflex-ArcPosted 4/4/2014 6:38:08 PM
BoxTheMuppet posted...
I choose to look at the glass as half full because it's more fun to think "what if" rather than saying "no never".


Thank you. Sometimes I wonder if I'm the last optimistic gamer on the internet. :D
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#84Miiri0Posted 4/4/2014 8:35:26 PM
Xbone is like 50% weaker than PS4. I think this cloud bs is necessary to make xbone fanboy feel justified spending more money buying inferior hardware.
#85N3xtG3nGam3rPosted 4/4/2014 8:50:55 PM
So basically the only thing you latched onto there was the thing about Playstation. Typical.

In other words, the cloud is meant to do what a GPU already does, based on what you rattled off here.

And you're going off Sony isn't doing something because....they haven't said so?

GPUs as we know them have existed in some form since, what, the late 80's? So far it sounds like the cloud is supposed to replace GPU, again going off what you said here. Is that the point?


I only mentioned Playstation because you make it painstakingly obvious that its all you care about. Havent seen one shred of evidence that 1) you own any MS console 2) like any MS console 3) have ever posted anything but negetive opinions/comments about anything MS related.

Now that thats out of the way...

Yes GPU's are very old technology, they have been around for a while now, however, GPU powered calculations for things the CPU is supposed to handle, like physics, is fairly new. Like i stated before, my rig runs many AAA PC games max settings, 60fps+ while running PhysX. The PhysX aspect of certain games put extra stress on the GPU, and like i stated with the comment about PS4, rendering textures, post processing effects, Anti-Aliasing, Anistropic Filtering, Shaders, light maps and etc. with the added load of calculating heavy physics sims, takes away from the graphic capability of the GPU, because the resources are being used for the physics simulations.

If MS developers are able to offload physics simulations like building collapses to the cloud, and then to your machine, then that will free up possibly a considerable amount of horsepower that could be used for texturing, lighting, etc. or even more physics sims. See what im saying? And i say this because the GPU's inside of these machines (X1/PS4) are going to be able to get the job done, but they are pretty lackluster in comparison to say, the GPU in my sig, which was out before the X1 was, and while my card is very high end, its far from the best. They are going to need to extract as much graphic power from these GPU's as possible to stay competitive in terms of visuals, and that goes for both systems.

This is in no way a negative thing. Techniques that will allow more resources to be freed up for other things is better in every way. That will translate to better performance, or better visuals. Now how much of a performance or visual gain? We dont know that yet.

Theres this thing called optimism. You should read into it.
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#86N3xtG3nGam3rPosted 4/4/2014 9:46:43 PM
Im also going to leave this here:

For the guys that dont understand how this could work with modern internet speeds or are saying you need high bandwidth and low latency you are misunderstanding what they are doing. No rendering is happening in the cloud.

The user shoots a rocket at the building. The impact position is uploaded to the could. Cloud returns trajectory velocity and rotation vectors for lets say the 60 debris pieces that are created by the burst. That's a heavy calculation, and about 1 kb of returned data, at about 100-200ms latency. Hide that within an explosive effect and the latency is undetectable. Disable midair collisions, and have the returned vector function include a bounce or two, and you have less than a Kilobyte upload and download determining massive destructive potential. The gpu will have no problem handling the returned vectors. That's 80% of what makes up any image, destruction or not.


Someone posted this in another topic, just curious to see the responses as everyone in the other topic ignored this guys post.
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#87SythisTaruPosted 4/4/2014 10:00:47 PM
For anyone who doesn't believe this cloud tech, you have no idea what you are talking about and should turn off yourcomputer and leave the internet immediately.
#88leatheljPosted 4/4/2014 10:26:48 PM
Reflex-Arc posted...
BoxTheMuppet posted...
I choose to look at the glass as half full because it's more fun to think "what if" rather than saying "no never".


Thank you. Sometimes I wonder if I'm the last optimistic gamer on the internet. :D

Omg quoted for truth ppl are so dang negative and anti-innovation. Let MICROSOFT try new thing is that so bad? But ppl like tc will call you stupid or gullable he acts like he know every thing like new things can't be invented or created In this world.
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#89RaRitsujunPosted 4/4/2014 10:41:18 PM
Don't give up, MS!!!!!
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#90TenzhiPosted 4/4/2014 11:08:46 PM
Reflex-Arc posted...
It makes me a bit sad that people on a gaming forum can look at a neat tech demo like this and not think that it's cool that companies like Microsoft are even testing something like it. Sure, the infrastructure may not be there right now to make it feasible, but progress has to start somewhere.


It's neat, and I'm fine with them giving it a go, but their bold claims are just so many unicorn farts until we see it in place and functioning so dramatically on the actual system with an actual game on an average home internet connection. Tech demos are like the build-up of a snake oil salesman. Their presentation rightfully invites all manner of skepticism.

BoxTheMuppet posted...
I choose to look at the glass as half full because it's more fun to think "what if" rather than saying "no never".


I always say that the glass is neither "half empty" nor "half full" - it's simply half a glass of liquid x.
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