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Dropping Some Knowledge

#1Toasty_KabalPosted 3/15/2013 3:52:55 AM
Charizard isn't the only pokemon that takes 4 times damage from stealth rock. Also, Charizard does okay on lower tiered sun teams, he just needs a little spin support, which all sun teams need.
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PSN: TheLoneCthulhu
#2LexifoxPosted 3/15/2013 3:54:18 AM
Now we ask ourselves: What does Charizard do that other Pokemon do not do as well, and are there other, "better", Pokemon that could be used in its place?
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"Murder of the living is tragic, but murder of the idea is unforgivable." - Janus, speaker of the synod
#3Toasty_Kabal(Topic Creator)Posted 3/15/2013 4:02:06 AM(edited)
Lexifox posted...
Now we ask ourselves: What does Charizard do that other Pokemon do not do as well, and are there other, "better", Pokemon that could be used in its place?


Faster than Moltres, hits hard enough in sun to 2HKO almost everything in RU.
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PSN: TheLoneCthulhu
#4SephirothtPosted 3/15/2013 4:10:44 AM
You're right, Volcarona is 4x weak to and he's laughing his ass off at Charizard predicament. XD

(note: But I do still like Charizard)
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#5TherianReturnsPosted 3/15/2013 4:16:56 AM
I have no idea why people whine about Stealth Rocks. Just have a spinner when you use Charizard, i mean jeez.
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#6LexifoxPosted 3/15/2013 4:34:26 AM
Toasty_Kabal posted...
Lexifox posted...
Now we ask ourselves: What does Charizard do that other Pokemon do not do as well, and are there other, "better", Pokemon that could be used in its place?


Faster than Moltres, hits hard enough in sun to 2HKO almost everything in RU.


Notice the tier you specified?
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"Murder of the living is tragic, but murder of the idea is unforgivable." - Janus, speaker of the synod
#7Toasty_Kabal(Topic Creator)Posted 3/15/2013 4:46:05 AM
Lexifox posted...
Toasty_Kabal posted...
Lexifox posted...
Now we ask ourselves: What does Charizard do that other Pokemon do not do as well, and are there other, "better", Pokemon that could be used in its place?


Faster than Moltres, hits hard enough in sun to 2HKO almost everything in RU.


Notice the tier you specified?


I did say lower tiers in the first post. Not every Pokemon can be Scizor, and most aren't. Just because something isn't right for the OU metagame doesn't mean it's competitively useless.
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PSN: TheLoneCthulhu
#8LexifoxPosted 3/15/2013 4:47:47 AM
Yes, but no one hates on Charizard in lower tiers. People hate on Chariard when fans can't stop talking about how it's incredible and fantastic and you can use it in OU if you just give it a little support and focus your entire team on helping it out.
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"Murder of the living is tragic, but murder of the idea is unforgivable." - Janus, speaker of the synod
#9Toasty_Kabal(Topic Creator)Posted 3/15/2013 4:55:37 AM
Lexifox posted...
Yes, but no one hates on Charizard in lower tiers. People hate on Chariard when fans can't stop talking about how it's incredible and fantastic and you can use it in OU if you just give it a little support and focus your entire team on helping it out.


People hate on Charizard regardless of context on these boards. I'm just trying to help break the bizarre stereotype that Charizard is Farfetch'd tier that's been propagating on this board.
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#10pokemonfreak97Posted 3/15/2013 6:43:20 AM
Toasty_Kabal posted...
Lexifox posted...
Yes, but no one hates on Charizard in lower tiers. People hate on Chariard when fans can't stop talking about how it's incredible and fantastic and you can use it in OU if you just give it a little support and focus your entire team on helping it out.


People hate on Charizard regardless of context on these boards. I'm just trying to help break the bizarre stereotype that Charizard is Farfetch'd tier that's been propagating on this board.


No, Charizard is not Farfetch'd tier. It is a good Pokémon in the lower tiers. What we hate is the group of people that says " Charizard is teh BEsT EVARZZZZZZ!!" and then proceed to say that because Volcarona can do well with a 4x SR weakness in OU, so can Charizard.

Here (in case you are wondering) is why they are wrong.

Volcarona gets Quiver Dance, one of the two Gen V moves that is in contention for "best boosting move in the game". (The other one is Shell Smash). It also has Bug as its secondary STAB, which only overlaps with Fire on Grass-types, giving it 6 types hit for Super Effective with STAB instead of 5. Volcarona's stats are tailored for using (and also taking, to a lesser extent) special attacks, and using them fast, while Charizard's are mixed. Volcarona's average stat is 92, and its highest is 135; its BST is focused in mainly Sp. Atk. Charizard's average stat is 89 and its highest is 109; its BST is much closer to evenly distributed.

So, in other words, Charizard is a Pokémon that was designed to be a good starter; it is a jack-of-all-trades that looks awe-inspiring. Volcarona is a Pokémon that was designed much later on, by someone who was aiming to provide an Pokémon that could do one thing well. Jacks-of-all-trades need better conditions to do well--Manaphy gets Tail Glow and Hydration, Mew learns all TMs, Victini gets V-Create (which would be a lot better if Rayquaza didn't get it too), Arceus beats every Pokémon in at least one stat, et cetera. Thus, Volcarona and Charizard have different levels of competitive viability.

Note: I will be copying-and-pasting this to any topics which try to talk about Charizard being viable in OU.
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