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Why are the Unova starters considered the worst?

#21SubrinhoaPosted 8/23/2013 5:17:42 PM
Because they don't stand out in any way.
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#22tsunamisurfer08Posted 8/23/2013 5:21:10 PM
GangstaLizard95 posted...
I mean they're not the best but they are not the worst. The worst set of starters I considered the worst is the Johto starters. I mean their stat distributions are the same as the Kanto starters, just in different places. Heck, Typhlosion has the exact same base stats as Charizard.


Nah, Meganium is the only really bad Johto starter. The other two were cool. I could not find anything to like about Unova's starters at all.

Emboar being the third fire/fighting didn't really bother me. Technically Serperior and Samurott are the third pure grass and water starters as well.

GangstaLizard95 posted...
at least Emboar learns Flame Charge to solve its speed problem


Every other fire type (Plus Zebstrika and Genesect) can get that through TM as well though too.
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#23kagster123Posted 8/23/2013 5:26:35 PM
Because competitively, they're trash. The fact that people can only compare them to the 2nd gen starters (who are the second worst) proves enough.

Also there's the opinion standpoint, like aesthetics. I for one think they're all pretty bad.
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#24TehTrumpCardPosted 8/23/2013 5:32:26 PM(edited)
GangstaLizard95 posted...
I mean they're not the best but they are not the worst. The worst set of starters I considered the worst is the Johto starters. I mean their stat distributions are the same as the Kanto starters, just in different places. Heck, Typhlosion has the exact same base stats as Charizard.


Keep in mind that Gen 2's overall move count is much lower than Gen 5's and abilities did not exist at that time.
Couple that with the fact that Unova Gyms encourage trainers to not use starters, i.e. Waiter Trio, Normal-Type Gyms early game, and spaced out rival encounters in BW2 so you're given enough time to train other Pokemon and allow them to be more useful (and in most cases better) than your Starters in a much shorter time than in GSC.

Darmanitan > Emboar
Lilligant/Whimsicott >= Serperior
Seismitoad >= Samurott

And this is all before you're halfway through the game (since you can capture Darumaka without beating Burgh).


tsunamisurfer08 posted...
GangstaLizard95 posted...
at least Emboar learns Flame Charge to solve its speed problem


Every other fire type (Plus Zebstrika and Genesect) can get that through TM as well though too.

You forgot the part where Emboar has to outspeed and overpower the switch-in.
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#25Grammar_manPosted 8/23/2013 8:25:43 PM
TehTrumpCard posted...
GangstaLizard95 posted...
I mean they're not the best but they are not the worst. The worst set of starters I considered the worst is the Johto starters. I mean their stat distributions are the same as the Kanto starters, just in different places. Heck, Typhlosion has the exact same base stats as Charizard.


Keep in mind that Gen 2's overall move count is much lower than Gen 5's and abilities did not exist at that time.
Couple that with the fact that Unova Gyms encourage trainers to not use starters, i.e. Waiter Trio, Normal-Type Gyms early game, and spaced out rival encounters in BW2 so you're given enough time to train other Pokemon and allow them to be more useful (and in most cases better) than your Starters in a much shorter time than in GSC.

Darmanitan > Emboar
Lilligant/Whimsicott >= Serperior
Seismitoad >= Samurott

And this is all before you're halfway through the game (since you can capture Darumaka without beating Burgh).





Let's see:
Darmanitan>Emboar: Correct, but both are top tier choices for in-game in BW.
Smogon In-game Tier: Both Top, but Darmanitan is higher.
Serenes Forest In-game tier: SS Tier Darmanitan, S Tier Emboar.
Serenes BW2: Darmanitan- Best in the game. Upper Mid Emboar.

Emboar is excellent in BW(not BW2), it's just terribly outdone because the arguably best 2 mons in the game are Sawk and Darmanitan. Who cover the typing Emboar has.

Samurott:
Serenes: A Tier, Best Water-type available.
Smogon: Top Tier, Best Water-Type available
Serenes BW2: High Tier, 2nd best Water-type after Azumarill.

vs Seismitoad:
Serenes: C Tier, Second worst Water-type available(Alomomola is worst).
Smogon: Top Tier, Lower than Samu.
Serenes BW2: Unavaliable until post-game.

So Samurott>Tympole, overall. Excellent in-game mon. However, actually lower tiered than Emboar for BW1 by serenes, but higher by Smogon. In BW2, by far the highest tiered starter(Serperior is actually upper mid and just above Emboar).









Serperior:
Strictly mid-tier.

Lilligant:
Best Grass-type available in both 1 and 2. Note that it is always rated under Samurott, interestingly enough.
#26PriceeChinaDeckPosted 8/23/2013 8:30:10 PM
just overall ugly factor, or just looking different from the others I guess
I like the Snivy line but Tepig is just goofy and the Oshawott line confused me, all of it's forms look awesome but the adult form looks out of place
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#27SummonearthPosted 8/23/2013 8:31:39 PM
It is a matter of opinion and i have a feeling that some of those people who said that are either generation 5 haters in general and say everything in the game or Generation 1 fanatics.
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#28LexifoxPosted 8/23/2013 8:34:31 PM
Aesthetically, they're among the best.

Serperior suffers from a limited movepool and poor typing for walling or sweeping, with its real claim to fame (Contrary) locked away.

Emboar suffers from a slow speed and generally being outperformed by Blaziken and Infernape. It might be more viable in Trick Room, but it's a niche strategy still.

Samurott's issue is that it's an average Water Pokemon. There's nothing particularly special about it except for Megahorn, its abilities don't really help it out and there's really no reason to choose it over a lot of other Water Pokemon.
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#29GolurkcanflyPosted 8/23/2013 8:46:38 PM
They aren't very good stat wise but IMO I think Samurott, Snivy, and Serperior look pretty cool.
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