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Now that Charizard has Mega forms, could he be higher tier then NU?/Team Thread

#51Mewtwo_soulPosted 10/27/2013 6:21:49 PM
Oron999 posted...
As I understand it, Smogon's banning limitations are only limited by the banning protocol of their pokemon simulators. Speed Boost Blaziken was not specifically banned only because the software didn't support such a ban.

This is also the reason that Garchomp as a whole was in ubers until sand veil was banned. Without sand veil Garchomp wasn't overcentralizing anymore.

Mega stones are hold items, and Smogon is perfectly capable of allowing particular items in particular tiers, as mentioned with soul dew. Even without any kind of software modification from earlier simulators, it is entirely possible to place particular megas into particular tiers. How they'll choose to page and tier them is another question, but that's just a matter of design and logistics.

I'm not convinced they'll be under "item options" or whatever; Charizard Y prefers special, sun-boosted moves with Charizard X prefers physical contact moves, and that is going to result in distinctly different sets and spreads.


Well not to start a whole new argument. Many Pokemon have distinctly different sets depending on function.

The only other problem I have is will base forms be taken into account of tier placement. Like I said if you just say "Well Megakahn can be walled by Ghosts" Yes, but what happens if you don't Megaevolve, will that also be taken into consideration in the overview of said form/Pokemon?

I think it should in the long run, as just going "Well without Crunch/SP Megakahn is walled." Is kind of frivilous if you cause a force switch to a Ghost and hit with Scrappy base form.
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#52Mewtwo_soulPosted 10/27/2013 6:28:42 PM
Welp it seems I was correct on what I said:


http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/should-mega-evolutions-be-tiered-separately-from-their-normal-counterparts.3490988/page-2

Second page final post.
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#53Oron999Posted 10/27/2013 6:31:23 PM
That's a very interesting point, and I agree that very few people pay attention to the things you can do by delaying your mega evolution. It's really going to be a question of how often it happens and how useful the delay is. Gyarados can still switch around and intimidate things to force them out.

Really, it's not a question of whether or not the pokemon have the options, it's a question of how relevant the options are, and how many people use those options.

And what's fun is that, if those choices are under-utilized, they gain a surprise factor that you, personally, can take advantage of.
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#54Oron999Posted 10/27/2013 6:32:37 PM
Ooh, that's a pretty neat conclusion they came to there. Interesting.
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#55Mewtwo_soulPosted 10/27/2013 6:33:30 PM
Oron999 posted...
That's a very interesting point, and I agree that very few people pay attention to the things you can do by delaying your mega evolution. It's really going to be a question of how often it happens and how useful the delay is. Gyarados can still switch around and intimidate things to force them out.

Really, it's not a question of whether or not the pokemon have the options, it's a question of how relevant the options are, and how many people use those options.

And what's fun is that, if those choices are under-utilized, they gain a surprise factor that you, personally, can take advantage of.


I fully agree, and that's in fact what made me start loving Megas. So many mind games can come from just one Pokemon with a mega. Though I doubt certain Pokemon will be heavily used in a tier without a mega (why I'm thinking IF Megakahn is OU, I think base form will be listed as BL (or lower percentage OU) unless Megakahn is a highly used Mega in that tier. Which is also possible.
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#56Mewtwo_soulPosted 10/27/2013 6:37:00 PM
Oron999 posted...
Ooh, that's a pretty neat conclusion they came to there. Interesting.


The only reason I believed that outcome would happen in the first place is because of Castform. The only Pokemon with multiple forms that are not outside of itself. (What I mean is unlike Deoxys/Rotom/etc. You must use it to experience its other forms)

Which is why I thought they'd probably end up under the same logistics, similar to my other point about Kangaskahn/Megakahn and Gyarados/Megados.
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#57Hoozah123Posted 10/27/2013 6:39:07 PM
Why would GameFreak ban their Mega pokemon? That boggle my mind.
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#58Mewtwo_soulPosted 10/27/2013 6:40:02 PM
Hoozah123 posted...
Why would GameFreak ban their Mega pokemon? That boggle my mind.


Isn't Mewtwo already banned by Nintendo in official tournaments?


Welp that answers part of your question already. (Though just a heads up we're discussing Smogon mainly here)
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