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I'm surprised that Giratina-A isn't OU

#21TropiOUsPosted 3/31/2014 5:31:57 PM
get your head checked
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#22CharizardFirePosted 3/31/2014 5:33:42 PM
itachi134 posted...
So why is Giratina-A banned? Dark has been buffed obscenely in Gen 6, so I doubt Giratina would be overpowered in OU.

Ghost has been buffed even more than Dark.

There is a new type that resists Dark and does super-effective damage to it.

What happened to Ghost? One of the few types that resists it lost the resistance. (The same is true of Dark, but when you consider what else happened to Dark...)

Mark my words: If, at some point in the future, Game Freak decides to add a new type to balance a currently existing type that's seen as overpowered (like what they did with Psychic and Dragon), the overpowered type will be Ghost.
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#23itachi134(Topic Creator)Posted 3/31/2014 5:37:25 PM
Fault42 posted...
First of all, I want to point out the fallacy in your first sentence (being that you're ridiculing anyone who doesn't agree with you).
Your second sentence doesn't make too much sense... It restates itself in the beginning. It outspeeds the Lati twins, yes, but what do you want it to do? If we place Lugia in this imaginary OU state with Garchomp in the scenario you said, why would you want to keep Garchomp in? Unless you're SD'ing, I'd rather not let my scarfer / sweeper go against one of the most fearsome walls in the game. And yes, it is a wall.
And you contradict yourself in your third sentence, in which you mention that its defense is what actually allows it to set up in front of threats such as Terrakion. Yes, the speed lets you set up before most Pokemon, but if Lugia didn't have such ridiculous defenses, what stops it from getting destroyed by the proceeding Stone Edge?


I am not trying to ridicule, insult or verbally attack anyone here. I'm just saying, Lugia's Speed stat is good. You should be afraid of that stat more than anything else, and well, if you aren't... I don't know what to tell you.

Your points in the middle, I'm not really going to get into here. I mentioned Garchomp because he was/is seen in the Ubers tier since he is faster than all of the Uber Dragon types and Ground type allowed him to switch in on Thunders. He isn't seen so much in Ubers now, but in Gen 4 and 5 Ubers, Garchomp was definitely a thing. Lugia was notable for being one of the best ways to stop him, solely because of the Speed advantage.

On the Terrakion point, you misinterpreted me. Yes, I mention the Defense, but that isn't the threatening part about Lugia. Its the fact that Lugia has the Speed which allows it to go first, and let it take full advantage of the defenses. Defense without Speed means you usually go second, and have to take hits without being able to move. With Speed as well as Defense, you can go before the opponent, throw a screen in their face, and then Roost off any damage by moving first and removing your weakness to Electric and Rock moves. If Lugia was not faster than Terrakion, Lugia would not be able to counter him.
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#24TropiOUsPosted 3/31/2014 5:41:47 PM
CharizardFire posted...
itachi134 posted...
So why is Giratina-A banned? Dark has been buffed obscenely in Gen 6, so I doubt Giratina would be overpowered in OU.

Ghost has been buffed even more than Dark.

There is a new type that resists Dark and does super-effective damage to it.

What happened to Ghost? One of the few types that resists it lost the resistance. (The same is true of Dark, but when you consider what else happened to Dark...)

Mark my words: If, at some point in the future, Game Freak decides to add a new type to balance a currently existing type that's seen as overpowered (like what they did with Psychic and Dragon), the overpowered type will be Ghost.


Fairies are never a problem out of ubers. And they are only a problem in ubers because this thing called Xerneas doesn't have awful stats.
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Yes, I'm that guy from Smogon. 80% of my posts are troll posts. I HATE DRUDDIGON
#25itachi134(Topic Creator)Posted 3/31/2014 5:42:27 PM
CharizardFire posted...
Ghost has been buffed even more than Dark.

There is a new type that resists Dark and does super-effective damage to it.

What happened to Ghost? One of the few types that resists it lost the resistance. (The same is true of Dark, but when you consider what else happened to Dark...)

Mark my words: If, at some point in the future, Game Freak decides to add a new type to balance a currently existing type that's seen as overpowered (like what they did with Psychic and Dragon), the overpowered type will be Ghost.


Ghost gets negated completely by Normal type, though. The same cannot be said about Dark, which deals damage to every type no matter what. Knock Off is a big problem for anything without a Mega stone on the switch. No matter what Pokemon you are, Knock Off will be problematic since you lose your item. On top of that, Sucker Punch is a priority move that deals type damage with 80 BP, and can be STAB boosted. Since Steel no longer resists Dark, Sucker Punch went up in viability by a great deal. That is already saying a ton because Sucker Punch always had viability.

You can totally steamroll somebody with a +2 Bisharp spamming Sucker Punch. It also doesn't help that Defiant wrecks Landorus-T.
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If you're scared to die, then you're scared to live
#26Slayerblade11Posted 3/31/2014 5:43:32 PM
It has insanely good bulk and nearly everything that threatens it gets crippled by wilo wisp or phased out by Dragon Tail . On paper it seems too centralizing, but idk.
#27itachi134(Topic Creator)Posted 3/31/2014 5:44:07 PM
TropiOUs posted...
Fairies are never a problem out of ubers. And they are only a problem in ubers because this thing called Xerneas doesn't have awful stats.


Every OU team should have a Fairy type. Its just way too good to pass up on. The bad thing is that there are very few Fairies worth using in OU.

Azumarill, Mega Mawile, Togekiss, and Sylveon are just about the only ones worth using, and all of them have hindering issues.
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If you're scared to die, then you're scared to live
#28Fault42Posted 3/31/2014 5:45:43 PM
Actually, Lugia would counter Terrakion still. An Adamant, Choice Band, fully invested Terrakion's Stone Edge is a 3HKO on a Bold 176 Def / 252 HP Lugia (assuming Leftovers), giving you plenty enough time to Roost, put up Reflect, or whatever you deem worthy of its time.
But, I think we're wasting our time here on Lugia, and here's why: from the way I'm seeing it, you're basically comparing Giratina-A to Lugia without the speed, correct? (If I'm wrong, feel free to correct me.)
Again, I would like to point out Lugia's defenses, and why they are the main concern here, rather than the quick-stall aspect. While being able to go first is nice, but as mentioned before, Lugia is 3HKO'd by quite a strong Pokemon; that alone is why Lugia is a threat - it can use its bulk to set up, rather than its speed.
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#29TropiOUsPosted 3/31/2014 5:48:48 PM
itachi134 posted...
TropiOUs posted...
Fairies are never a problem out of ubers. And they are only a problem in ubers because this thing called Xerneas doesn't have awful stats.


Every OU team should have a Fairy type. Its just way too good to pass up on. The bad thing is that there are very few Fairies worth using in OU.

Azumarill, Mega Mawile, Togekiss, and Sylveon are just about the only ones worth using, and all of them have hindering issues.


>lists togekiss
>not clefable
thanks for confirming you are bad. All your opinions are invalid.
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Yes, I'm that guy from Smogon. 80% of my posts are troll posts. I HATE DRUDDIGON
#30TropiOUsPosted 3/31/2014 5:50:35 PM
Fault42 posted...
Actually, Lugia would counter Terrakion still. An Adamant, Choice Band, fully invested Terrakion's Stone Edge is a 3HKO on a Bold 176 Def / 252 HP Lugia (assuming Leftovers), giving you plenty enough time to Roost, put up Reflect, or whatever you deem worthy of its time.
But, I think we're wasting our time here on Lugia, and here's why: from the way I'm seeing it, you're basically comparing Giratina-A to Lugia without the speed, correct? (If I'm wrong, feel free to correct me.)
Again, I would like to point out Lugia's defenses, and why they are the main concern here, rather than the quick-stall aspect. While being able to go first is nice, but as mentioned before, Lugia is 3HKO'd by quite a strong Pokemon; that alone is why Lugia is a threat - it can use its bulk to set up, rather than its speed.


lol no.
252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 176+ Def Multiscale Lugia: 154-183 (37 - 43.9%) -- 99.8% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 176+ Def Lugia: 308-366 (74 - 87.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
doing basic math the min damage here is 105%
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Yes, I'm that guy from Smogon. 80% of my posts are troll posts. I HATE DRUDDIGON