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Elder Scrolls online or FF14, which are you getting?

#41Maiken100Posted 8/21/2013 1:18:15 PM(edited)
jessevale posted...

Same deal for ESO. A charmless TES experience + MMO. TES needs normal multiplayer, not MMO.


Maybe but how do you come to this conclusion without actually playing the game?
Also it doesn't need multiplayer.
You make some sense in the rest of your post, too many clones but it isn't exactly an easy market to compete in unlike other genres. Games like EVE managed to show that the genre has variety but taking risks with mmos is very dangerous financially for a company.
#42kbe2k2Posted 8/21/2013 1:38:06 PM
Neither, they both look terrible.
#43jessevalePosted 8/21/2013 2:14:44 PM
Maiken100 posted...
jessevale posted...

Same deal for ESO. A charmless TES experience + MMO. TES needs normal multiplayer, not MMO.


Maybe but how do you come to this conclusion without actually playing the game?
Also it doesn't need multiplayer.
You make some sense in the rest of your post, too many clones but it isn't exactly an easy market to compete in unlike other genres. Games like EVE managed to show that the genre has variety but taking risks with mmos is very dangerous financially for a company.


I wanted to say more on ESO but hit character limit. I shouldn't have said "charmless TES," as there is a ton of potential for the classic charm the series had, since in an MMO developers usually try to include all sorts of features and throwbacks (read: fanservice, but not always bad) with all the time and space available. So we could get some of the traditional love like Morrowind... Except that the development team is far removed from then. So we're likely (I say likely, not definitely, as you're right; I don't know) gonna have a game built around the ideas that made Skyrim hit the big time and marketed for the same larger demographic.

Besides, one other thing MMOs do very very well is find interesting and creative uses for a franchise's years worth of content and little things. For example, seeing a minor hero unit from Warcraft 3 as a quest giving NPC in WoW, it's a neat little addition. The thing is, RPG settings for any game in general achieve this on a similar level; one of the best examples is Paper Mario. Seeing decades worth of Mario characters, including those seen in only one or two games, each with unique roles as either NPCs or monsters, it all adds up to a very charming experience.

Elder Scrolls is already massive, and always has been. The lore detailed in the books is one of those things that would do well added to an MMO setting, think being able to read books and scrap notes about Azeroth's history and happily discovering the history you're reading is a campaign from Warcraft 2. The thing is, because of the size of TES games already, this experience has less space to flourish [as an addition to what has already been allowed it's space] and when it does, it will feel less exciting and not as rewarding as that happy discovery normally does when a game gets the RPG or MMO treatment. This is what I meant by a charmless TES experience - what is normally the best part about expanding your favourite setting by conversion to the massive format has already been achieved. That charm will have a "been there, done that" feel. Not that there isn't still so much more room in an MMO for any number of other charming experiences.

But this is why I said TES needs regular online [if any at all] play. Next gen is thankfully beginning to look to be trending on this latest innovation, that is, seamless online interaction in a single player experience. Think Dark Souls simple way of warning or messing with players through your dead ghost. Games now (can't remember which are talking about this feature) are expanding on this idea to make what truly looks to be one of the best revolutions in how we play in a long time. Even before this, though, the simple idea of being able to wander around Tamriel and happen across another fellow wandering around a la Journey is an exciting prospect. I don't even need a UI or group system to cater to the online portion; just adding other random people/your friend wandering about whether you choose to play with them or not is incredibly compelling.

Unfortunately TES MMO delays any chance of that happening in regular TES even further.
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Eagerly awaiting FFXIV's inevitable failure. Even a fantastic game cannot withstand initial bad press & the long-dead MMO format. Sad but true.
#44SavageDonzillaPosted 8/21/2013 2:21:29 PM
Neither. I don't have time for sub based MMOs anymore. I'll stick with the occasional Rift, DCUO & GW2.
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#45JrambharosePosted 8/21/2013 2:26:09 PM
FFXIV, no regrets.
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#46datopgamerPosted 8/21/2013 2:29:37 PM
Not too much of a fan of TES, I just bought FFXIV so I'll try it for the first month and make my decision there. I didn't get a chance to play the beta so I'm going in blind basically. I only bought it because I got it on GMG for $24.
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#47jessevalePosted 8/21/2013 2:31:01 PM
On competition & taking risks in the MMO market:

It's not actually incredibly financially damaging to take risks with an MMO. For one, any company that decides releasing another MMO into a stagnant market probably deserves to lose their money. The thing is that it's quite clear the developers who are making these games are attempting to cash in on the success a very select few games in the genre ever had. SE thinking they could succeed on the level of XI again is ... Astoundingly stupid. But you also have very small, no name developers putting these things out like nothing and miraculously succeeding (as far as profit goes; for recognition, their success barely warrants a footnote).

You're right, though... But all this basically means is that MMO is not a good genre. Which is what I think, and so any company (hopefully not one I care about) who wants to continue releasing them deserves what they get.

What I hope for when I rant like this isn't just to stir some trouble and get some fans of a particular game or company to rage. I'm just raising some discussion on the state of the industry and this genre in particular. How would I like to see it change? Well, with new ideas, really.

If a developer out there truly wants to create an MMO type game for the admittedly absolutely incredible amount of potential the format has, then I would hope they try their best to actually make a unique game. Innovate ideas, not cash in. This isn't happening, no big deal. It's actually more entertaining when a company fails at an MMO than it is when an MMO is enjoyable to play, these days. Anyway, let's say you love a franchise and want to see the wonders that converting to the massive format can bring, as described in my post above (if that's part of the charm for you like it is for me). You'd of course want them to succeed so you can experience a good game and they can continue making good games and innovating for your pleasure.

So that's just what they should do. Competition & risk taking in the MMO market is a load of bunk, because it's a load of bunk. So don't compete in that market, Favoured & Beloved Game Developer #1 Inc.! Take your idea in stride, if there's a truly heartfelt multiplayer experience brewing in the minds of this theoretical company, then there's many many many ways for them to realize it out there.

Attempting to compete in the market with a genre we agree is dead isn't just "well, it's hard to do. You can't blame them." That is true, yes, but like in my last post, there are amazing innovations on the way for multiplayer experiences. So all I'm saying is I hope the developers of the games we love look out to new methods to bring unique experiences to the stores and our homes. There's more than that dead format to work with; use next gen tech to revolutionize in more ways than just graphics, and maybe you wouldn't suck so hard, SE (just kidding). Taking risks is hard. But making people give a crap about your risk-free, neatly packaged, bland clone game is a lot harder. There are thankfully more than a few developers who seem on board with innovating in this way coming up. I can't wait to see what gaming brings us after this tail end of the MMO craze is finally dead.

Based on your comment on EVE's unique experience, have you watched Mrbtongue's MMO video? If you haven't, well that's uncanny, cause it's super relevant and you nailed it. There IS a ludicrous amount of potential in this type of game. The type just needs to adapt (in at least a handful of ways, not just one new direction), the idea of seamless multiplayer-in-single player being one of them.

Anywho that's enough tl;dr for now. Thanks for reading :P
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Eagerly awaiting FFXIV's inevitable failure. Even a fantastic game cannot withstand initial bad press & the long-dead MMO format. Sad but true.